Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 10:27 AM CST
A change I would make personally would be to make 2x Ambush a post cap goal....Actually that is either my own first or second post cap goal.


I actually built 2x ambush into my training fairly early on. I think I had to wait until I was done with armor to fully 2x it but it was certainly well before cap. That is without skipping tertiary skills such as 1x First Aid and Survival and also taking 2x hide. It's certainly something you have the option of saving for post cap but it is also something you have the option of doing all along. That's why I set it under the optional training. My intention was that optional training could potentially become post cap goals but things specifically listed as post cap goals are not recommended prior to cap at all.

Also, wouldn't 1x in spells be considered a core skill? You have 1x harness power listed but no spell research. I know spells are under discreet training. If you don't wish to move spells into core training, then may I make a recommendation to move harness power.


I tried to make it clear under the discreet training that the ranger should 1x spells until they have 640 and 120. That is the core training. After that it becomes a choice, hence additional spells being optional. Personally I only have 80 spells total and I am almost 2x cap. Of those I stopped at 640 and 130 until probably my 90s when I felt I had the mana to use 650 regularly. Is it more confusing to put 1x spells until 60 in the core training or to put 60 spells in the discrete training?

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 10:42 AM CST
I tried to make it clear under the discreet training that the ranger should 1x spells until they have 640 and 120. That is the core training. After that it becomes a choice, hence additional spells being optional. Personally I only have 80 spells total and I am almost 2x cap. Of those I stopped at 640 and 130 until probably my 90s when I felt I had the mana to use 650 regularly. Is it more confusing to put 1x spells until 60 in the core training or to put 60 spells in the discrete training?


I understood what you did perfectly. Your notes about spell training came through loud and clear to me, but that is probably because your spell totals were pretty much what I did even though my getting there was considerably different.

General Radeek Andoran
Drakes Vanguard
Defender of Wehnimer's Landing
Black Raider of the Mir'Sheq

Empires exist through conquest, they live on by exercising total control of the conquered.

Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 11:11 AM CST
I understood what he did too but then again we have been playing rangers for some time.

I know you placed the link to 650 and folks can read the spell. However, since this is about archery. Wouldn't we want to bring to this page the benefits of Aspect of Wolf and Jackal?

I understand that Aspect is EXPENSIVE to use and shoot even at 93 I rarely use it unless I hunt bandits.

Might want to mention that CMAN Multi-fire really isn't worth looking into, in my opinion. You can't aim with it and Aimed eye shots are more effective. I see a lot of questions from folks as to whether or not they should train in it.

Peace
Zhelas



(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 11:17 AM CST
Might want to mention that CMAN Multi-fire really isn't worth looking into, in my opinion. You can't aim with it and Aimed eye shots are more effective. I see a lot of questions from folks as to whether or not they should train in it.


Believe it or not I actually found a good use for MFIRE, even though I don't use it or have it anymore. When group hunting in warcamps or with good swarms it get's you more hits in less time, rather like a spirit caster using Fire Spirit. I still prefer single aimed eye-shots though, so I no longer have it in my repertoire.

General Radeek Andoran
Drakes Vanguard
Defender of Wehnimer's Landing
Black Raider of the Mir'Sheq

Empires exist through conquest, they live on by exercising total control of the conquered.

Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 11:17 AM CST
Sorry about the multiple posts.

I approve of the armor training levels. We as regular players understand the benefits as to why chain in some aspects is better than leather. Some folks will say why would I want to wear double chain, augmented chain or hauberk versus brig? I am referring to understanding the crit factors. Preventing broken limbs. A broken arm or hand will not allow you to shoot.

Peace
Zhelas



(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 11:23 AM CST
Believe it or not I actually found a good use for MFIRE, even though I don't use it or have it anymore. When group hunting in warcamps or with good swarms it get's you more hits in less time, rather like a spirit caster using Fire Spirit. I still prefer single aimed eye-shots though, so I no longer have it in my repertoire.


I could see that if you don't want to dominate with the single eye shots. Isn't it stamina intensive? But as you mentioned it isn't in your repertoire anymore.

I personally prefer, 606, 509, pulse haste for 1 second open aimed eye shots. However I do understand that this is my hunting style and not everyone's.

Peace
Zhelas



(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 11:31 AM CST
My thought is that by the time they get 650 they should be able to decide for themselves what Aspects they want to use. For instance I don't tend to use Wolf and Jackal. I use Porcupine for the logic boost plus improved defense and then usually serpent for the evade boost in between. Though sometimes I use wolf when I am not in much danger and would like an AS boost. Also Lion when encumberance might be lowering my defenses more than serpent will raise it. Yierka for when I'm foraging or eating herbs. Owl for a TD boost in some situation, as well as the spirit trick once I enter the Rift. Well you get the idea. You could almost write a whole guide on the uses for 650.

If someone wanted to add a bit under maneuvers about Multi-fire being awful I wouldn't object or I can do it later.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 11:51 AM CST
Very true, concerning aspect.

Peace
Zhelas



(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:12 PM CST
I just wanted to chime in with my agreement on 1x Spell Research being a good core training suggestion. I know that that's what I've been doing and definitely plan on continue doing at least until I'm very close to cap (because getting 650 and 140 bring me to level 88 at a full 1x spell research). To me, the benefits of additional training in the ranger base beyond this also seem significant enough that I would consider it a core skill.

>Might want to mention that CMAN Multi-fire really isn't worth looking into, in my opinion. You can't aim with it and Aimed eye shots are more effective. I see a lot of questions from folks as to whether or not they should train in it.

Also, this. When I first started, I definitely got myself some MFIRE since it sounds so awesome and was like "wow, this is terrible" when I tried to use it.

Oh, and in case nobody is checking the main beginning ranger page, I added a super generalized training guide (in part, because I don't know if anybody is going to bother writing specific guides for all possible hunting styles). If anyone wants to check it out and give me some feedback (or edit the guide), here's the link: https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/A_beginner%27s_guide_to_playing_a_ranger#Skills

I tried to keep it very general while including many of the ideas I've come across. Many of these are from comments on this forum as well as the un-officials as well as from advice given to me in game during my time playing (it turns out that being a relative beginner when others have played for 10+ years means that you get to hear a lot of advice) and what I have gleaned from general research.
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:13 PM CST
>While I personally believe that the role playing section should be moved lower down on the page (and includes a glaring omission of animal companions and their role in roleplay),

This is a section I have been planning to revisit for a while. There are a lot of things I want to add, especially because it doesn't focus so much on roleplay as it does character development. I want to delve a little into roleplay and properly tie to to character development (from a roleplaying perspective as opposed to mechanical, for example). As for placement, I like it at the beginning because it sets the tone for what myself and everyone participating wants to be an important focus in terms of character building.

>We have explained that the information Statistics subsection of the character creation section needs to be moved elsewhere because nothing you have said in it so far is relevant to rangers specifically and much of it has been repeated elsewhere on gswiki.

I've already stated my piece on this. Obviously I'd like to retain it. I may move/delete/add things here and there (it's still a draft and hasn't realized its potential yet), but that remains to be seen.

I am going to disconcern myself with arguing for what I want here and just start writing more. It's been a huge time sink and has been incredibly detrimental to motivation. Going back and forth about what's missing or what should go into a draft that's not even complete is near pointless (especially since nothing I haven't already considered has been brought up). If there's a next time, I guarantee there won't be a public draft.

This has been my process:

Layout what I want a section to say,
Write it,
Reorganize layout (figure out what's good and what's not)
Rewrite,
Move on to next section so I can let my brain spend a couple days mulling around what I'd just set down
Note things I plan to rewrite to be done after the draft is complete

The further I get, the better an overall picture of the guide appears in my head. This leads to me noticing other places for improvement (perhaps slimming down a section will be part of this) so that I can make sure each part of the guide is staying true to its purpose and the purpose of the whole.

This becomes difficult when there are multiple editors of a draft. Every one of them will have their own ideas, which will obviously clash. Part of it is my fault because I didn't make a layout public (mostly because it keeps changing) and because no one expressed an interest in writing on the wiki until SARAH3 came along.

If I could ask one thing of other editors: give me a week to put everything together (which includes the contributions in this thread), and then we'll talk about redrafting what needs to be redrafted. The more I have to think about what other people are writing, the longer it'll take me to get out what I want. All this arguing has done is drag my focus far away from producing anything useful.

~Brian, Sepher's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:15 PM CST
Sorry to multipost, but I missed this:

>You could almost write a whole guide on the uses for 650.

If someone would do this, that would be amazing. I have very little idea of how I will make use of that spell when I get to it (I mostly know that it doesn't last very long, but seems really neat).
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:18 PM CST


Spells for a ranger is so broadly stated I wouldn't call it a "core" skill. The reason I say this is I've seen anywhere from .5x spells all the way to 2x spells and still see the ranger be successful. I've seen people work more the MnS circle then the ranger circle and sitll come out just fine. If anything while I see why its called a core spells you dont need to even learn spells to be a successful ranger.

Also something to think about. This is a guide for newbies. I would look at the whole of the guide as pre-cap and not even mention Post-Cap goals. I think post-cap could be a guide in of itself.

Pup's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:26 PM CST
Or, just do whatever you want with no regard for quality. Sure, that's a thing.

~Brian, Sepher's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:28 PM CST
>This is a section I have been planning to revisit for a while. There are a lot of things I want to add, especially because it doesn't focus so much on roleplay as it does character development. I want to delve a little into roleplay and properly tie to to character development (from a roleplaying perspective as opposed to mechanical, for example). As for placement, I like it at the beginning because it sets the tone for what myself and everyone participating wants to be an important focus in terms of character building.

Ah, yes, but if you put it after the main character development section. Then this is information that's already covered so you can focus on roleplay (while directing the reader to check out the earlier sections for more details on those specifics).

>I've already stated my piece on this. Obviously I'd like to retain it. I may move/delete/add things here and there (it's still a draft and hasn't realized its potential yet), but that remains to be seen.

Well, I haven't moved it and I'm probably not going to move it any time in the near future because that honestly seems like a lot of work to do properly. I think that much of it can be dropped onto the statistics page, to be honest, although it probably would require some sort of transitions and reorganization for that page, which is why I don't want to deal with it. Like I either said earlier or meant to say earlier, you provided more information about statistics on the beginner's guide to a ranger page than exists on the actual statistics page so I think it's something that should exist on the wiki, I just don't think it should exist where it currently is (so if you replace it entirely at some point, maybe sandbox it for use elsewhere instead of just cutting it entirely).

This page definitely needs to have a section on statistics though, I'm not arguing that (just suggesting that it should be limited to ranger-specific information). And mostly what I did on the statistics section today was change your html markup to the wiki-appropriate mark down (because that's something that should be done whether or not it moves).

>If I could ask one thing of other editors: give me a week to put everything together (which includes the contributions in this thread), and then we'll talk about redrafting what needs to be redrafted.

...so I'd already been tinkering with the super general skills in my sandbox since Monday or so and popped it up there basically as soon as Scribes made some comments because before then it seemed like adding anything would be acting aggressively.

I'm not sure if I adequately expressed my enthusiasm for this project, but I got a bit jazzed about it so I do these kinds of things.
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:37 PM CST
>Or, just do whatever you want with no regard for quality. Sure, that's a thing.

See Scribes's post. You do not get to reserve the right to exclusive edits on the main wiki page for a week. You hadn't added anything for a few days and I've been quite excited about it so I started doing my own work (I even volunteered to work on a skills section earlier in this thread).

Also, please don't insult me. It's a bit rude.
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:52 PM CST
Or, just do whatever you want with no regard for quality. Sure, that's a thing.
~Brian, Sepher's player


Why not just make your own ranger page with your name on it?

Chad, player of a few
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 12:53 PM CST
Alright. SARAH3 is the new high-reigning ranger expert.

I'm out. This isn't worth the trouble it's causing. Every olive branch has been slapped away, so there's clearly no point in continuing.

What a pathetic joke.

~Brian, Sepher's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 01:10 PM CST
>Why not just make your own ranger page with your name on it? -Chad

This is my plan. I'm not sure I'll post it on the wiki, however. I'd like to do what I promised I would do, but I think I'll take a break for a little bit to clear this nonsense from my mind.

I cannot understate my disappointment that a quality guide could not appear in the beginner's guide on the wiki.

~Brian, Sepher's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 01:26 PM CST
Lore Training
It is sometimes recommended to obtain one rank of both blessing and summoning lores as soon as possible.


Why is this recommended?


1 Rank in Blessing Lore gives:

+2 Resistance to Poison and Disease from 104 and 105
+1% chance to activate 115
+1 Stealth bonus
+1% EBP from assuming the proper aspects
+3% RT reduction from Yierka aspect

1 rank in Summoning Lore gives:

+.001 DF Fire Spirit
1% additional spell hindrance from Sounds
2% chance for strength drain poison from Tangle Weed
+1 Mana Capacity from Imbue
5% chance for an additional damage cycle from 635
+1 HP From Assuming Bear Aspect

A low to even mid level ranger will not have 650, will not have or use 635, will not make much use of Imbue and we don't bolt. We're talking about throwing away 20 MTPs for small bonuses to minor spirit spells many people only use as dispel fodder, a minute stealth bonus, a small bump to the secondary unreliable effect of sounds and a 2% chance to poison something that isn't going to live long enough once Tangleweed knocks it down to matter.

I wouldn't recommend Blessing Lore unless you are willing to dedicate at least 5 ranks. At that point you add +1 DS, +1 Bolt DS, +1% skin value and +1 TD from spells every ranger is going to have up all the time. I probably wouldn't even do that until maxing out the TD bonus from 625 at 49 ranger spells and at that point you may as well train up to 50 ranks. Summoning Lore I have less experience with but I wouldn't train it up unless I was ready to sink some serious points into it to improve 616 and 635 and only later in life at that.

My recommendation is to remove this bad advice from the guide. When I read it I immediately went to look over Summoning Lore to see if I was really missing out not training that 1 rank and my feeling is that I'm not. A new ranger is likely to blindly follow it and waste more than a spell rank worth of MTPs on something that is not nearly as useful as that spell rank at low level.


Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 01:28 PM CST


Well, I imagine the intent was collaboration. To produce a guide for new players with little knowledge of the ranger profession. My last interest in the boards was literally a decade ago in Gem 3 However, I remember a shared respect for each others efforts and opinions.

We, never as long as I recall reading the ranger boards in the past had any of the issues I have seen here since this competition started.

What collaboration has been taken by some to mean in my opinion is, they can disregard others input, experience, comments, and or concerns in lieu of their 'own opinion and eagerness' on everything that has been brought up. Some may do a lot of work on this project, but attitude, method, manner, and the over all nonsense has totally alienated anything I as a player planned on offering here.

So, go ahead rewrite, or put in your work because it apparently is a better format, opinion, or maybe you just like it better.

Yes, I also have had enough.

ranger out
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 01:37 PM CST




That was on my TWC guide, not ever intended for the general guide. You know, the one I repeatedly said was a rough draft and I was working on it so had not fleshed every detail out yet.

John
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 02:03 PM CST
<<If I could ask one thing of other editors: give me a week to put everything together (which includes the contributions in this thread), and then we'll talk about redrafting what needs to be redrafted. The more I have to think about what other people are writing, the longer it'll take me to get out what I want. All this arguing has done is drag my focus far away from producing anything useful.

Hi everybody!

How about this arrangement right now for the Ranger guide?

Let's keep discussion going here on the forums about inclusion and arrangement. As we've had two main contributors on the actual wiki, Sarah and Brian, I want to pursue a somewhat different avenue. Brian, I want you to continue making edits to the current page, and Sarah, I want you to duplicate that content in a sandbox and make what changes you think would be appropriate there. When the contest is over, we'll have ourselves something of a ecumenical council where we can see how we can take the best parts of both and combine them into the ultimate guide. We can hash out disagreements at that point. If any new players enter the fray, we'll communicate with them and figure how best to proceed. ;)

(YEAH, I JUST CUT THE BABY IN HALF KING SOLOMON STYLE.)

<<Post Cap info

I think Post Cap info can warrant inclusion since sometimes planning ahead is the name of the game. That said, it could potentially be spun off into an Advanced Guide to Playing a Ranger for the most in depth material.

Thanks everyone!

GM Scribes
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 02:29 PM CST
>Brian, I want you to continue making edits to the current page, and Sarah, I want you to duplicate that content in a sandbox and make what changes you think would be appropriate there. When the contest is over, we'll have ourselves something of a ecumenical council where we can see how we can take the best parts of both and combine them into the ultimate guide. We can hash out disagreements at that point. If any new players enter the fray, we'll communicate with them and figure how best to proceed. ;)

Works for me.

It actually did wonders for me to make the decision to "let it go." I feel like my mood instantly improved a great deal. I'm still going to take a day to have nothing to do with it, but with this arrangement, I think things can proceed in a manner acceptable to me.

Thank you for the consideration.

~Brian, Sepher's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 04:00 PM CST
Hola!

As hours passed since my last post, it dawned on me that it probably wouldn't do to have you (Brian) work on the current page because someone completely ignorant of these recent posts and what not can come along and start making edits, and well, as the old saying goes, "A fish in the cat tank only stirs up trouble." (circa 2015)

However, I didn't want to create a sandbox area, either, as they lack talk pages for discussion purposes. Hence, I just created a new page:

https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/The_beginner%27s_guide_to_playing_a_ranger (Yes, I changed an article. So sue me for lack of creativity).

I have copied everything over from the present page (which can be torn to pieces by any Joe passing through) and when you are ready to hop back on the writing saddle, you can rest assured that no one will wander in and make edits for the duration of the contest and if they do, just let me know.

So I will turn the current page over to whomever and whatever edits. We will otherwise follow the same merging issue at the end of the contest as I had previously discussed.

So sayeth Scribes.

GM Scribes
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 04:24 PM CST
Hey, just chiming in here. My points were never meant to provide unhelpful and damning criticism. I personally think the guides are heading in the right direction. If my points help to make your hard work better, which I hope they do, that makes me happy.

Peace
Zhelas



(Lord Paladin walks around Droit examining his equipment.)
Lord Paladin: How does he....How does he work?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 04:26 PM CST
>I have copied everything over from the present page (which can be torn to pieces by any Joe passing through) and when you are ready to hop back on the writing saddle, you can rest assured that no one will wander in and make edits for the duration of the contest and if they do, just let me know.

Roger that. Thanks.

~Brian, Sepher's player
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 04:57 PM CST
That was on my TWC guide, not ever intended for the general guide. You know, the one I repeatedly said was a rough draft and I was working on it so had not fleshed every detail out yet.
John


John, was this in response to my concern over the 1 rank of each lore thing being in the main ranger guide? I wasn't complaining about it being in your guide which I knew was a work in progress and everyone was still discussing things. I was just concerned it ended up in the main guide and wanted to make my case for removing it from there. You've done an excellent job with the TWC guide and I borrowed quite a bit from the formatting when I posted the archer guide. Keep up the good work and please don't take anything I'm saying here as anything but constructive criticism meant to further the conversation. I just want to help new rangers.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 06:54 PM CST


Thanks Keith, much appreciated.

John
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/18/2015 07:45 PM CST
>My recommendation is to remove this bad advice from the guide. When I read it I immediately went to look over Summoning Lore to see if I was really missing out not training that 1 rank and my feeling is that I'm not. A new ranger is likely to blindly follow it and waste more than a spell rank worth of MTPs on something that is not nearly as useful as that spell rank at low level.

Okay, suggestion removed from "A Beginner's Guide..." and the paragraph has been reworked slightly accordingly.
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 07:40 AM CST


Ok, largely caught up on twc page, working on introduction and tweaking. If you see anything glaring please let me know.

John
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 11:44 AM CST
Am I spending too much time on the TWC guide, explaining runestaff to block bolts? It is such a rarely used option I tossed it in since a TWC ranger has only Wall of thorns to stop arrows/bolt spells, or out right evasion. Or hope they have enough Bolt DS to not get hurt.

My +8 runestaff is parrying about 11% of arrows and bolt spells before they get to check my bolt DS. Then I can stow it draw blade and attack or cast.

opinions?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 11:59 AM CST
I think swapping to a runestaff for bolt parrying is a rather advanced technique. Might want to leave it off a beginners TWC ranger guide.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 12:07 PM CST
I agree with this, and then again, I don't. I understand this is a beginning guide, and please, this is just my opinion, but as a beginning player, while it's nice to know the basics, I find it also good to know where you should be going with your training. Give me the "why's" of what you're training in, not just the "what's". This allows a new player to see what they can do later in life, and why they train in certain things to get there.

While I know there are a vast multitude of options open for rangers, and we can't possibly cover them all in this guide, I think for the lesser used builds, like TWC, something like the runestaff defense would be interesting to a new player or a new ranger, even though it might be an advanced technique and may not be used until later in life.

Feel free to ignore this, it's just how my mind works. I've always wanted to know the "why's" and the details.

General Radeek Andoran
Drakes Vanguard
Defender of Wehnimer's Landing
Black Raider of the Mir'Sheq

Empires exist through conquest, they live on by exercising total control of the conquered.

Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 12:24 PM CST


Thank you both. I have moved Runstaff test to a seperate area. I did leave a comment about the option under TWC bolt defenses and mentioned it was for later down the lines etc, but is for a reference and option to consider.

John
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 01:23 PM CST
>I agree with this, and then again, I don't. I understand this is a beginning guide, and please, this is just my opinion, but as a beginning player, while it's nice to know the basics, I find it also good to know where you should be going with your training. Give me the "why's" of what you're training in, not just the "what's". This allows a new player to see what they can do later in life, and why they train in certain things to get there.

As John mentioned, he's working on a separate and more advanced guide for TWC rangers, which is where lots of this data is going.

For the beginner's guide, I've been thinking about what to do with all this whacky info that doesn't particularly fit well in any one place and came up with another section that I might call "Tips and Tricks". Stuff that new players don't really need to worry about, but just to let them know that it exists for further investigation. Some "you can do this cool stuff if you want, but it's not important" kind of details.

I'm a big fan of the "why's" of character training/tactics/etc, too.

~Brian, Sepher's player, has been learning some new things working with Aurach on the TWC stuff.
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/19/2015 01:29 PM CST
As John mentioned, he's working on a separate and more advanced guide for TWC rangers, which is where lots of this data is going.
For the beginner's guide, I've been thinking about what to do with all this whacky info that doesn't particularly fit well in any one place and came up with another section that I might call "Tips and Tricks". Stuff that new players don't really need to worry about, but just to let them know that it exists for further investigation. Some "you can do this cool stuff if you want, but it's not important" kind of details.
I'm a big fan of the "why's" of character training/tactics/etc, too.


This works quite well...thanks for the clarification!


General Radeek Andoran
Drakes Vanguard
Defender of Wehnimer's Landing
Black Raider of the Mir'Sheq

Empires exist through conquest, they live on by exercising total control of the conquered.

Only the dead have seen the end of war - Plato
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/20/2015 09:52 AM CST
I wrote up some suggestions for setting statistics on "A beginner's guide..." found here: https://gswiki.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/A_beginner%27s_guide_to_playing_a_ranger#Statistics

Comments, edits and suggestions are welcome.

I was also thinking to reorganize the skills a bit more to generalize it further. This would mostly involve breaking the Core Skills into overall core skills (1x PT, 2x Weapon, 1x Spell, 1x HP) and defensive core skills, from which it would be recommended to choose at least two (1x Dodging, 1x CMANs, 1x Shield Use, 1x-2x Perception). The reason I was considering to break it down this way is that for some builds, 1x CMANs or shield use are definitely part of core training, while for others, they're not so much. I figure that breaking it down this way allows a new player to more easily mix and match skills if they choose a build that isn't covered by the more specific guides. I also think it might better reflect the versatility of Rangers as a class. Thoughts?
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/20/2015 10:10 AM CST


Seems to me the most common type of ranger was sword and board to start. (maybe ranged now not sure) since there is a ranged guide available, perhaps the beginning guide should focus on sword and board?

John
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/20/2015 10:56 AM CST
>Seems to me the most common type of ranger was sword and board to start. (maybe ranged now not sure) since there is a ranged guide available, perhaps the beginning guide should focus on sword and board?

Eh, I kind of think that the ranged guide is looking a bit more advanced so it can avoid going into explanations for particular training decisions while the beginner guide should provide a comprehensive overview with more "why" spelled out. Basically, an advanced player is likely to see the advantages in a particular training path without much explanation, while a beginner might want more information. So even though someone considering an archer ranger should look at that page too, they might also want to refer to the more general one in case they don't understand why the path presented in the specific one was laid out the way it is.

In principle, since there isn't a sword and board specific guide (yet?), that can certainly be presented as an example for skill setting on the beginner page though.
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Re: GSWiki Ranger Guide 02/20/2015 11:10 AM CST
The sword and board guide will need to include a suggestion for how to prop your head up when you fall asleep because your hunts take so long. Wouldn't want to break your keyboard when you pass out.

Keith/Brinret/Shiun

Be nice to Wyrom or I will cut you!
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