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I think it's more that there's a folder for broader stealth issues whereas this is specifically for Thief dev. The two overlap quite a bit, but stealth impacts a lot more than just Thieves.
Thayet
@thayelf // http://thayette.tumblr.com
"But you must know that if corruption is powerful enough, it's not corruption at all — it's law. Unspoken, unwritten, but law." — Robert Jackson Bennett, City of Stairs
THAYET
DERPTRON
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/19/2016 11:33 PM CST
>I fail to see how a TM spell checking the defensive skills that it should is considered an unfair skill check. The majority of guildss with AoE spells are also Survival tert, and it makes sense for a spell that hits an entire area to what is in hiding also. It's a balance.
Are you sure you know how these checks work? Because just the other day I was dodging a clerics FOU all day and it was pulling me out of hiding. The character was clearly below my skills but FOU was dragging me out of hiding no matter what. Seemed like a 0 skill check situation to me. Warrants testing because I pretty obviously outclassed that character. That type of thing should never happen in this game, IMO.
>As for Watch, I agree something should be done but this isn't the place to have that discussion.
When then? I tried to rally against it when it was released but this was clearly a thing not up for discussion at the time and more of a "this is happening, deal with it" kind of thing. Never should have happened but it was obviously a band-aid at the time. Can you think of any reason for it to exist other than a PVP crutch for non-stealth guilds? When you think about it, it's really the only reason it exists. It's FREE perception ranks based on NOTHING, give me a precedent for that to exist.
By the same logic I should be able to activate MAGIC DEFENSE NOW and have 30 minutes of pure magic defense based on nothing. Where is that skill for NMUs?
Are you sure you know how these checks work? Because just the other day I was dodging a clerics FOU all day and it was pulling me out of hiding. The character was clearly below my skills but FOU was dragging me out of hiding no matter what. Seemed like a 0 skill check situation to me. Warrants testing because I pretty obviously outclassed that character. That type of thing should never happen in this game, IMO.
>As for Watch, I agree something should be done but this isn't the place to have that discussion.
When then? I tried to rally against it when it was released but this was clearly a thing not up for discussion at the time and more of a "this is happening, deal with it" kind of thing. Never should have happened but it was obviously a band-aid at the time. Can you think of any reason for it to exist other than a PVP crutch for non-stealth guilds? When you think about it, it's really the only reason it exists. It's FREE perception ranks based on NOTHING, give me a precedent for that to exist.
By the same logic I should be able to activate MAGIC DEFENSE NOW and have 30 minutes of pure magic defense based on nothing. Where is that skill for NMUs?
SHADOW7988
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 01:41 AM CST
> // Silent stowing/getting
This is already done with SLIP, which handles all of the restrictions like size and weight. I don't really see a reason to duplicate an existing system.
> >>What I'm suggesting is totally different than slip. Basically let the other survival primes use SLIP as it is. As masters of stealth, let us ALWAYS use a stealth check to perform basic actions. So verbs like Stow, get, put, take, swap, kneel, stand have a hiding check. If you can hide on someone, they don't see you perform those actions. You just do it naturally stealthy. If you fail the check, they get normal messaging. Can provide a toggle if you want. AVOID !Stealth. If you want to avoid the check, use SLIP. This would just be akin to a freebie since you are SO used to the self consciousness of always being stealthy.
I've advocated adding the ability to search from hiding, to change 'position' (such as to stand, or lay, kneel), seems quite silly that some fairly difficult things can be done with slip, but yet simple things can't. Just about everyone can load a bow with an arrow while remaining hidden (I think there is a stealth check, but Elec's concept seems to cover that as well). I'm saying that I'd like to see something like this for the future.
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"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
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Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
This is already done with SLIP, which handles all of the restrictions like size and weight. I don't really see a reason to duplicate an existing system.
> >>What I'm suggesting is totally different than slip. Basically let the other survival primes use SLIP as it is. As masters of stealth, let us ALWAYS use a stealth check to perform basic actions. So verbs like Stow, get, put, take, swap, kneel, stand have a hiding check. If you can hide on someone, they don't see you perform those actions. You just do it naturally stealthy. If you fail the check, they get normal messaging. Can provide a toggle if you want. AVOID !Stealth. If you want to avoid the check, use SLIP. This would just be akin to a freebie since you are SO used to the self consciousness of always being stealthy.
I've advocated adding the ability to search from hiding, to change 'position' (such as to stand, or lay, kneel), seems quite silly that some fairly difficult things can be done with slip, but yet simple things can't. Just about everyone can load a bow with an arrow while remaining hidden (I think there is a stealth check, but Elec's concept seems to cover that as well). I'm saying that I'd like to see something like this for the future.
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
SULIC
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 02:40 AM CST
<<So they have to be aware to know when they need to drop out of watch or re-engage watch.>>
Best idea for WATCH to me. It makes sense. So I see you focus intently on me so I can take action to blind you - with smoke, sparks, flare etc. To me we should keep it simple. There's already a precedent for us throwing dirt to disable, we should have an open dirt throw. NOT being hidden you advance to a certain range (probably melee makes the most sense) and attempt to throw dirt in the opponents face. If they're using WATCH it makes it harder for them to react, since it's a quick surprise movement. Now they lose their bonus and have a negative debil to perception. If they're not watching, or stop it in time anticipating a throw, they have a better chance at winning the debil contest.
Best idea for WATCH to me. It makes sense. So I see you focus intently on me so I can take action to blind you - with smoke, sparks, flare etc. To me we should keep it simple. There's already a precedent for us throwing dirt to disable, we should have an open dirt throw. NOT being hidden you advance to a certain range (probably melee makes the most sense) and attempt to throw dirt in the opponents face. If they're using WATCH it makes it harder for them to react, since it's a quick surprise movement. Now they lose their bonus and have a negative debil to perception. If they're not watching, or stop it in time anticipating a throw, they have a better chance at winning the debil contest.
BENNETTJ13
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 05:13 AM CST
I would love it if our dirt attacks could be done in the open, with an auto hide on success packed into the rt.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
BADGOPHER
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 06:37 AM CST
This is kind of a dumb one I thought of last night, but what about removing the RT from dismantling a box?
The mech teaching is kind of pointless, and the 6-9 RT just seems mean for something that is, essentially, a clean up tool.
The mech teaching is kind of pointless, and the 6-9 RT just seems mean for something that is, essentially, a clean up tool.
TECHNOGEEK
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 06:59 AM CST
>>I would love it if our dirt attacks could be done in the open, with an auto hide on success packed into the rt.
Screen does that. I just tested to make sure because I thought it did. Choke does not.
Screen does that. I just tested to make sure because I thought it did. Choke does not.
NINEVAH1
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 06:59 AM CST
>>Are you sure you know how these checks work? Because just the other day I was dodging a clerics FOU all day and it was pulling me out of hiding. The character was clearly below my skills but FOU was dragging me out of hiding no matter what. Seemed like a 0 skill check situation to me. Warrants testing because I pretty obviously outclassed that character. That type of thing should never happen in this game, IMO.
I'll agree that being pulled from hiding on a miss should be looked at, but I'm pretty sure that's something that needs to be looked at on a spell by spell basis because not all AoEs work like that. Armifer has said he's taking suggestions on how to fix Cleric spells to not be so OP. I'd suggest dropping that log/info into an email to him.
>>As for Watch, I agree something should be done but this isn't the place to have that discussion.
>>When then?
When the GM's are actually interested in working on Stealth. Filling the Thief dev thread with all this is just going to do more harm to our guild then it will benefit. First, this is the wish list thread for new stuff, there is another for complaints about existing systems. Second, Watch is not a Thief specific mechanic so it doesn't apply at all to what Naohhi is asking for or willing to work on. How about we focus on things for/about our guild and leave the game-wide mechanics/problems for another discussion when they'll be wanted and listened to.
Players agree that Watch is something that needs to be looked at, but the GMs have made it clear they aren't going to do it right now. Taking every opportunity to fill unrelated threads with complaints about it isn't going to help anyone and just takes away from what is trying to be done here.
I'll agree that being pulled from hiding on a miss should be looked at, but I'm pretty sure that's something that needs to be looked at on a spell by spell basis because not all AoEs work like that. Armifer has said he's taking suggestions on how to fix Cleric spells to not be so OP. I'd suggest dropping that log/info into an email to him.
>>As for Watch, I agree something should be done but this isn't the place to have that discussion.
>>When then?
When the GM's are actually interested in working on Stealth. Filling the Thief dev thread with all this is just going to do more harm to our guild then it will benefit. First, this is the wish list thread for new stuff, there is another for complaints about existing systems. Second, Watch is not a Thief specific mechanic so it doesn't apply at all to what Naohhi is asking for or willing to work on. How about we focus on things for/about our guild and leave the game-wide mechanics/problems for another discussion when they'll be wanted and listened to.
Players agree that Watch is something that needs to be looked at, but the GMs have made it clear they aren't going to do it right now. Taking every opportunity to fill unrelated threads with complaints about it isn't going to help anyone and just takes away from what is trying to be done here.
NINEVAH1
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 07:02 AM CST
>>Anyhow to get back on the suggestion train, can we permit stealing and marking on the hidden?
I like this idea a lot. Especially being able to mark someone you have spot-effect on.
I like this idea a lot. Especially being able to mark someone you have spot-effect on.
DR-NAOHHI
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/20/2016 10:18 PM CST
Judging from the last few pages, I think we're pretty fair off topic now, so I'm likely to not monitor this thread too much more. Thank you for all the input and responses thus far.
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NaOH+HI
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NaOH+HI
SHADOWCHIEF2
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/21/2016 01:16 AM CST
<Judging from the last few pages, I think we're pretty fair off topic now, so I'm likely to not monitor this thread too much more. Thank you for all the input and responses thus far.
Its just nature for people to get thrown off track, but aside from that I think people can be constructive. I think the last few pages of crap have just been a big issue that needs to be tackled, in order for the thief guild, and pretty much all survival prime guilds to be taken seriously for their skillset.
That being said, just talk about thief stuffs.
Its just nature for people to get thrown off track, but aside from that I think people can be constructive. I think the last few pages of crap have just been a big issue that needs to be tackled, in order for the thief guild, and pretty much all survival prime guilds to be taken seriously for their skillset.
That being said, just talk about thief stuffs.
DEFOL
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/21/2016 11:32 AM CST
It might be a feeble attempt at this point but i managed to dig up a few suggestions from what you already discussed, by the original authors/posters. I feel like some of the suggestions were a bit half-arse and were originally presented in a better way.
The whole contact thing:
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Thieves/Suggestions%20And%20Revised%20Suggestions/view/1497
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Thieves/Suggestions%20And%20Revised%20Suggestions/view/1677
So after seeing the thousandth Trader crier running around the Crossings doing their thing, it dawned on me that maybe Thieves should make use of our contacts network in a similar fashion:
Contact Runner: [TEACH|TRADE|MEETING]
Announce to all Thieves inside the current city that there is a meeting taking place, or a class starting, or even a Thief-only 'hot goods' sale about to happen. Keep some sort of sane interval for announcing, maybe even require a certain reputation level in that province, and have a fee collected based on the number of individuals the runner had to speak to (with thugging as a consequence if you're without the requisite number of coins? (Miss seeing people thugged))?
Could be usable only inside the Den, or Meeting Room, wherever is conducive to large numbers of people congregating for a while. Maybe the Guildleaders perk up from time to time and throw a message out to whoever's in ear-shot and chat with folks via the same thing, eh?
Bribes:
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Thieves/Suggestions%20And%20Revised%20Suggestions/view/817
Contact Bribe
Requires Contacts: Find|Tell, Fix, Guild
>Contact Bribe
You send your contact into the guard house to speak to a "friendly" judge or guardsman on your behalf, the contact returns with a wide grin on his face. "You ain't wanted around these parts chief!" You give the contact a nominal fee, 1000 kronars, and he saunters off to the local pub.
So thats my suggestion... I figured if you stole something and got caught with a fine of 500 kro... say you had 10 warrents out so about 5000 kronars if you were arrested, so you would basically be paying double to clear them without actually being arrested.
The Selfish reason I want this: No more losing Gweth charges from being arrested.
The whole contact thing:
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Thieves/Suggestions%20And%20Revised%20Suggestions/view/1497
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Thieves/Suggestions%20And%20Revised%20Suggestions/view/1677
So after seeing the thousandth Trader crier running around the Crossings doing their thing, it dawned on me that maybe Thieves should make use of our contacts network in a similar fashion:
Contact Runner: [TEACH|TRADE|MEETING]
Announce to all Thieves inside the current city that there is a meeting taking place, or a class starting, or even a Thief-only 'hot goods' sale about to happen. Keep some sort of sane interval for announcing, maybe even require a certain reputation level in that province, and have a fee collected based on the number of individuals the runner had to speak to (with thugging as a consequence if you're without the requisite number of coins? (Miss seeing people thugged))?
Could be usable only inside the Den, or Meeting Room, wherever is conducive to large numbers of people congregating for a while. Maybe the Guildleaders perk up from time to time and throw a message out to whoever's in ear-shot and chat with folks via the same thing, eh?
Bribes:
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Thieves/Suggestions%20And%20Revised%20Suggestions/view/817
Contact Bribe
Requires Contacts: Find|Tell, Fix, Guild
>Contact Bribe
You send your contact into the guard house to speak to a "friendly" judge or guardsman on your behalf, the contact returns with a wide grin on his face. "You ain't wanted around these parts chief!" You give the contact a nominal fee, 1000 kronars, and he saunters off to the local pub.
So thats my suggestion... I figured if you stole something and got caught with a fine of 500 kro... say you had 10 warrents out so about 5000 kronars if you were arrested, so you would basically be paying double to clear them without actually being arrested.
The Selfish reason I want this: No more losing Gweth charges from being arrested.
BADGOPHER
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/21/2016 12:21 PM CST
I'm not sure if this is a complaint or a suggestion or both. But I'm really frustrated with the lack of thief oriented magic items.
Self-activated arcana items would be nice for faking guild association.
Concentration regenerators like the health/mana/etc. ones.
Some type of item to train arcana with as well, since certain devices still rely on the skill to determine your ability to use them, but don't teach arcana itself.
Some type of thief-specific analog to runestones or scrolls would be nice. Maybe a 'memory stone' where we invoke it to get a single use of a khri at a value determined by the appropriate skills. The times I want access to the 'sensing' khri are so few that I'd rather just use a stone.
An ambush components pouch.
Fill it with dirt and naphtha, slap a hammer (or similar blunt object) on it similar to the weapon frogs, and have a knife sheath on it. Then whenever you want to ambush, the game simply checks your pouch. If it still has dirt, the game auto-uses that rather than requiring you to either forage dirt then hold it in your hand or push a dirt container. Similar for Naphtha, game verifies you have a quantity remaining and simply uses it like you had it in your hand, debits the container. For ambush slash/stun, the game would simply message you drawing the appropriate tool from the pouch and using it.
If I were designing it I'd add a couple seconds to the RT for convenience, and probably shave something off the contest, so that people who want to do it all purely manually can have that edge. The pouch would have to function like lockpick rings, where you can only put the same type/grade of naphtha/dirt into it (though there are not grades of dirt).
Special dirt!
Sneezing powder, itching powder, various alchemical tools which modify the results of a successful ambush choke/screen, with potential of blowback if you fail your ambush/LT check. But please no snake-eyes. Longer lasting versions of the ambush, or different effects (watery eyes make aiming weapons or TM difficult. Itching powder makes it impossible to maintain cyclics, etc. these are deliberately overpowered suggestions though). There is already a start here with the 'thug powders' you can almost never harvest.
Thug powders commercially available.
Their effect is hardly game breaking, and it's not much more significant than watch or a skill check.
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Deep_violet_powder
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Bright_green_powder
Return/improvement of trap harvesting.
You used to be able to harvest fun easter egg type items from traps.
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Black_cube
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Stoppered_vial
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Lumpy_green_runestone
It was a lot of fun to be a smoke-poof-ninja, but I haven't seen one in years. There's argument over whether they still exist (I think people say they do?).
Self-activated arcana items would be nice for faking guild association.
Concentration regenerators like the health/mana/etc. ones.
Some type of item to train arcana with as well, since certain devices still rely on the skill to determine your ability to use them, but don't teach arcana itself.
Some type of thief-specific analog to runestones or scrolls would be nice. Maybe a 'memory stone' where we invoke it to get a single use of a khri at a value determined by the appropriate skills. The times I want access to the 'sensing' khri are so few that I'd rather just use a stone.
An ambush components pouch.
Fill it with dirt and naphtha, slap a hammer (or similar blunt object) on it similar to the weapon frogs, and have a knife sheath on it. Then whenever you want to ambush, the game simply checks your pouch. If it still has dirt, the game auto-uses that rather than requiring you to either forage dirt then hold it in your hand or push a dirt container. Similar for Naphtha, game verifies you have a quantity remaining and simply uses it like you had it in your hand, debits the container. For ambush slash/stun, the game would simply message you drawing the appropriate tool from the pouch and using it.
If I were designing it I'd add a couple seconds to the RT for convenience, and probably shave something off the contest, so that people who want to do it all purely manually can have that edge. The pouch would have to function like lockpick rings, where you can only put the same type/grade of naphtha/dirt into it (though there are not grades of dirt).
Special dirt!
Sneezing powder, itching powder, various alchemical tools which modify the results of a successful ambush choke/screen, with potential of blowback if you fail your ambush/LT check. But please no snake-eyes. Longer lasting versions of the ambush, or different effects (watery eyes make aiming weapons or TM difficult. Itching powder makes it impossible to maintain cyclics, etc. these are deliberately overpowered suggestions though). There is already a start here with the 'thug powders' you can almost never harvest.
Thug powders commercially available.
Their effect is hardly game breaking, and it's not much more significant than watch or a skill check.
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Deep_violet_powder
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Bright_green_powder
Return/improvement of trap harvesting.
You used to be able to harvest fun easter egg type items from traps.
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Black_cube
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Stoppered_vial
https://elanthipedia.play.net/mediawiki/index.php/Item:Lumpy_green_runestone
It was a lot of fun to be a smoke-poof-ninja, but I haven't seen one in years. There's argument over whether they still exist (I think people say they do?).
VCHEN
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/21/2016 01:06 PM CST
Along the lines of the AoE ability discussion, I'd be perfectly content with a "Fan of Knives" type effect, but it'd be fun to consider an AoE poison bomb, maybe? That stoppered vial easter egg is pretty nifty. Granted this might be more geared toward an alchemy release.
Also, I think someone mentioned potentially using dirt nearby for SCREEN and CHOKE - wasn't sure if anyone suggested being able to default to dirt in the container without having to hold it before hand if the surroundings were not suitable.
Also, I think someone mentioned potentially using dirt nearby for SCREEN and CHOKE - wasn't sure if anyone suggested being able to default to dirt in the container without having to hold it before hand if the surroundings were not suitable.
SULIC
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/22/2016 03:03 PM CST
I'd just like to 'officially' suggest in the right folder access to a 'training room' for high reputation. This room would be slightly different in each Guild and offer
-An NPC infamous thief that HLCs could hide and stalk and steal from for high exp
-A training 'dummy' with bells on it for lower circle thiefs to get exp successfully stealing ,stealth from
-Locks built in practice doors with fluff traps
-A meditative bonus that lets us train khri faster in this room (this could be changed to train extra well only the khri taught in that Guild)
Maybe a bar/ fluff gear shop.
The whole point would be -
A serious incentive to focus on binning and completing tasks.
A serious incentive to train charisma, since at high enough ranks you'd have basically continuous access.
This would also provide a meeting area /hangout RP place for Thieves since they'd have serious motivation to stay until this train everything to ML. HLCs would want the easier training and would be there more and interact teach lower levels.
"Those who die heroic deaths are long remembered, thieves and drunks and cravens soon forgotten."
-Varys
-An NPC infamous thief that HLCs could hide and stalk and steal from for high exp
-A training 'dummy' with bells on it for lower circle thiefs to get exp successfully stealing ,stealth from
-Locks built in practice doors with fluff traps
-A meditative bonus that lets us train khri faster in this room (this could be changed to train extra well only the khri taught in that Guild)
Maybe a bar/ fluff gear shop.
The whole point would be -
A serious incentive to focus on binning and completing tasks.
A serious incentive to train charisma, since at high enough ranks you'd have basically continuous access.
This would also provide a meeting area /hangout RP place for Thieves since they'd have serious motivation to stay until this train everything to ML. HLCs would want the easier training and would be there more and interact teach lower levels.
"Those who die heroic deaths are long remembered, thieves and drunks and cravens soon forgotten."
-Varys
DR-NAOHHI
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/22/2016 04:04 PM CST
This suggestion kind of reminds me of the practice room in the Theives' Guild in skyrim. I like the idea, even though it would be a lot of work to put together. It might get piece-mealed if I pick this one up.
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NaOH+HI
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NaOH+HI
SHADOW7988
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/22/2016 11:47 PM CST
>This suggestion kind of reminds me of the practice room in the Theives' Guild in skyrim. I like the idea, even though it would be a lot of work to put together. It might get piece-mealed if I pick this one up.
Obviously we're only going to get what we get, but non-the-less. It might be cool coming in piece meal, new delivery. Perhaps some event of, look what the Guildleader brought in for us now. :nods, with a beam in his eyes:
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
Obviously we're only going to get what we get, but non-the-less. It might be cool coming in piece meal, new delivery. Perhaps some event of, look what the Guildleader brought in for us now. :nods, with a beam in his eyes:
---
"I think anything that forces you to do something no sane adventurer would do just in order to train is ridiculous."
DR-SOCHARIS
---
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
BADGOPHER
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/23/2016 07:01 AM CST
Just FYI the word is nonetheless. No hyphens and not non.
SULIC
Re: Thief Dev Wishlists
02/29/2016 03:43 PM CST
Had an idea while running around a certain Inn. It occurred to me that we aren't 'just' a persecuted outlaw group, but also a part of the elite movers in Elanthia. Much as gangsters in 1920's New York or Chicago had political connections and hobnobbed with the rich, famous and powerful, the Thieves Guild is a power among the elite providing needed services they would rather not admit to. I think in that vein it would be simple to update the TASK system to include thefts via pick pocketing from various NPCs. The Guild Leaders hand out assignments on who to rob, you steal the item and deliver it. Simple plots could be worked out around the basic premise of being assigned to steal X item from Y NPC and getting it back to the Guild. The rewards could be made larger as well as the exp from the theft... and of course, if you get caught the punishment should fit the crime. For these missions you could have a 'possession of stolen property charge' to the justice system. Various similar suggestions have been made I just think this is a way to simply implement it within existing systems. As always, thanks for the consideration!
"Those who die heroic deaths are long remembered, thieves and drunks and cravens soon forgotten."
-Varys
"Those who die heroic deaths are long remembered, thieves and drunks and cravens soon forgotten."
-Varys
