I like both of these spells. They serve specific purposes and they serve them well... for the most part. There is, however, one glaring issue that both RoC and RoG share in my opinion: random anti-magic rooms.
Both RoC and RoG are cyclic spells and if a cyclic spell attempts to pulse while you are in an anti-magic room, it fails and ends the spell. The result of this can range from annoying to disastrous depending on where you happen to be at the time. But the most frustrating part of all is it feels like there's very little consistency in which rooms are classified as anti-magic.
For example, why are some banks anti-magic and some are not? Why is the meeting room in the crossing town hall anti-magic but the meeting rooms over in the crossing city meeting hall are not? Most players aren't going to care about anti-magic rooms at all, but for a necromancer we have to memorize these details by trial and error.
I'm not suggesting that someone goes through the whole game to find every room that should be anti-magic but isn't or every room that is anti-magic but shouldn't be. That would take entirely too much effort, I'm sure, and wouldn't solve the frustration of having RoC/RoG end every time you want to visit the bank. I suppose you could consider that kind of frustration an expected part of playing a necromancer, but I'd rather not believe that to be the case.
What I would like to see is either: #1) RoC and RoG become able to persist in anti-magic rooms, or #2) RoC and RoG become standard style 10-40 minute duration spells.
I don't know if #1 is even possible, so I'm personally leaning towards #2. The downside of #2 would be that we'd lose our convenient cyclic utility trainers, but that's a sacrifice I'd make in a heartbeat for RoC/RoG to not have to butt heads with anti-magic rooms anymore.
Please and thank you.
ACIDICSNAIL
CAELRIC
KAIJITALEX
Re: RoC/RoG & Anti-magic Rooms.
04/18/2020 04:23 PM CDT
I'm not saying this is necessarily a negative to #2, but ROC/ROG/liturgy would become extremely powerful - perhaps way beyond what the original intention for those spells are. It'd be really easy as a high-level necro to have ROG up while hunting and have no trans spells showing. That'd probably be the case for lower-level necros as well.
TK-421
Re: RoC/RoG & Anti-magic Rooms.
04/18/2020 06:51 PM CDT
>> Both RoC and RoG are cyclic spells and if a cyclic spell attempts to pulse while you are in an anti-magic room, it fails and ends the spell. The result of this can range from annoying to disastrous depending on where you happen to be at the time.
Unlike most other cyclic spells, there can be real consequences to us when these spells drop. If I'm using either of these odds are it's because I'm about to enter a standard justice zone and I need their protection.
The anti-magic rooms are like land mines. I know where some of them are, but others...
I would love both of the Rites to be non-cyclic.
(Or some other change that doesn't immediately kill them when I enter an area flagged no magic.)
- I
Unlike most other cyclic spells, there can be real consequences to us when these spells drop. If I'm using either of these odds are it's because I'm about to enter a standard justice zone and I need their protection.
The anti-magic rooms are like land mines. I know where some of them are, but others...
I would love both of the Rites to be non-cyclic.
(Or some other change that doesn't immediately kill them when I enter an area flagged no magic.)
- I
THECODMISTER
Re: RoC/RoG & Anti-magic Rooms.
04/18/2020 07:19 PM CDT
Personally I am in favor of #2. The frustrations of simply trying to bank and get out of say.. Crossing. Makes you get caught very easily if you left some trans buffs up.
It would also allow those who want to stay hidden longer in their lives from the outside world the chance too. Even if they have USOL up. An adventurer may run in and see you have buffs but they may miss a USOL attack. Therefore, keeping you hidden longer if you can utilize both spells at once.
Also could be a better utility trainer for us without the need of RESEARCH and not having to quickly dispel EOTB each time it is casted.
Just my thoughts,
Bhaalgorn
ACIDICSNAIL
Re: RoC/RoG & Anti-magic Rooms.
04/18/2020 07:41 PM CDT
I kind of agree that RoG in particular might become better than was originally intended if it allows a necromancer to essentially hide their spells at all times. I haven't made up my mind entirely whether that would be a bad thing. As Bhaalgorn's player said, it would allow necromancers to potentially remain unknown for longer, which I take to be a positive thing.
If RoG being a standard style spell with no downsides is too strong, here are a few possible downsides: #1) Have RoG end if you enter into combat. This allows RoG to still be useful for moving through justice areas and for taking an opponent aware, but doesn't allow for 100% up-time. #2) Prevent the duration of transcendental buffs from being refreshed if RoG is active. This would also prevent a necromancer from having 100% up-time on hidden transcendental buffs. #3) Let it be that strong, but turn it into a ritual spell; the kind that needs a ritual focus to be cast. Necromancers don't have one of those yet, and the need for a ritual focus might serve to justify being able to have 100% up-time.
Additional thoughts/opinions appreciated.
If RoG being a standard style spell with no downsides is too strong, here are a few possible downsides: #1) Have RoG end if you enter into combat. This allows RoG to still be useful for moving through justice areas and for taking an opponent aware, but doesn't allow for 100% up-time. #2) Prevent the duration of transcendental buffs from being refreshed if RoG is active. This would also prevent a necromancer from having 100% up-time on hidden transcendental buffs. #3) Let it be that strong, but turn it into a ritual spell; the kind that needs a ritual focus to be cast. Necromancers don't have one of those yet, and the need for a ritual focus might serve to justify being able to have 100% up-time.
Additional thoughts/opinions appreciated.
DRTRV80
Re: RoC/RoG & Anti-magic Rooms.
05/08/2020 11:55 AM CDT
I'll take any solution to this. Long been a pet-peeve of mine.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: RoC/RoG & Anti-magic Rooms.
08/04/2020 12:21 PM CDT
This is a late reply, but as a person who always made efforts to keep RoC/RoG up during events to mask their necro, it's frustrating to see players/GMs sometimes try to "game" the system (my view, not theirs, of course!) by trying to exploit anti-magic rooms, so I'd definitely like to figure out how stuff like this can get resolved.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
