Previous
Then... What exactly is your complaint? That your necromancer can't braidvines in front of the warmie guild while listening to tm classes?
JHALIASCLERIC
XDESTRON
Re: Purging
03/25/2012 10:40 AM CDT
My only complaint is the phrase that keeps getting spouted over and over. "Necros are hard-mode. Quit or reroll". I just wish people would forget about it and move on. I wouldn't have even posted if I didn't rage a little when reading the thread and realizing that people still actually think this way.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Purging
03/25/2012 10:44 AM CDT
>>My only complaint is the phrase that keeps getting spouted over and over. "Necros are hard-mode. Quit or reroll".
But they are hard, and if you're not comfortable playing them due to those constraints, you should reroll.
It's like why I don't play guilds with teaching requirements, or high weapon requirements, etc. Because they're conditionals I'm not comfortable dealing with, so I should reroll if it makes me incredibly uncomfortable doing so.
hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down. - GERSTEINJ2
But they are hard, and if you're not comfortable playing them due to those constraints, you should reroll.
It's like why I don't play guilds with teaching requirements, or high weapon requirements, etc. Because they're conditionals I'm not comfortable dealing with, so I should reroll if it makes me incredibly uncomfortable doing so.
hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down. - GERSTEINJ2
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Purging
03/25/2012 01:34 PM CDT
>My only complaint is the phrase that keeps getting spouted over and over. "Necros are hard-mode. Quit or reroll". I just wish people would forget about it and move on. I wouldn't have even posted if I didn't rage a little when reading the thread and realizing that people still actually think this way.
But...
>All the guild requires is the lack of stupidity to stay out of town. If you think that's hard... I have news for you.
If your objection is that Necromancers aren't actually hard, than fine, I agree. You just need to play them differently. Or, if you can't adjust to that, because you're as idiotic as most people who play DR, then... wait for it...
You should quit or reroll.
But...
>All the guild requires is the lack of stupidity to stay out of town. If you think that's hard... I have news for you.
If your objection is that Necromancers aren't actually hard, than fine, I agree. You just need to play them differently. Or, if you can't adjust to that, because you're as idiotic as most people who play DR, then... wait for it...
You should quit or reroll.
MELLIONM6
Re: Purging
03/26/2012 03:20 PM CDT
>>because you're as idiotic as most people who play DR
While I generally hold similar view to your core argument above, I get the distinct impression taking a cheapshot a the majority of the player population was not only unnecessary, but also detracted from your argument by turning the general audience against your point. The emotion placed in even a well-made argument can kill said argument for the audience, particularly when it directly assaults them.
On the note of emotion, and I assume by "idiotic" you mean "driven by immediate emotion rather than logic and long-run utility", the appropriate word would be "irrational". Not much less offensive at the end of the day, but more technically accurate.
--Croegar/Shatteringwave/Someone Else
K>think
You try, but in the cramped confines of the tunnel, there's just no room to do that.
While I generally hold similar view to your core argument above, I get the distinct impression taking a cheapshot a the majority of the player population was not only unnecessary, but also detracted from your argument by turning the general audience against your point. The emotion placed in even a well-made argument can kill said argument for the audience, particularly when it directly assaults them.
On the note of emotion, and I assume by "idiotic" you mean "driven by immediate emotion rather than logic and long-run utility", the appropriate word would be "irrational". Not much less offensive at the end of the day, but more technically accurate.
--Croegar/Shatteringwave/Someone Else
K>think
You try, but in the cramped confines of the tunnel, there's just no room to do that.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Purging
03/26/2012 07:09 PM CDT
Not at all. I mean idiotic. The questions most people in game throw around make me hold incredibly little sympathy for players. I wager most people who read the forums belong to a subset of DR players who are enriched for being not idiots.
The Necromancer guild doesn't require incredible insight or a brilliant mind to play, but people routinely complain about how hard it is. As someone who griped a bit when I was first outed, I understand it's a learning experience and there's a lot of PAFO involved, but people who complain about accruing a years worth of SO, or who train magics with Trans spells... They are ignoring the advice made by the GMs pertaining to the guild. The equivalent truly is rolling an Empath because you love swinging a sword at ALL the critters, or rolling a Moonie because you don't want to train magic very hard. I stand by the statement that most DR players are idiots; being emotional has nothing to do with it.
Now, of course, the flip side of this, that certainly bears stating, is that there are a TON of people that wow me with their intelligence, either with their training routines or their RP. Anyyyyyyyyyyywhooodle.
If you don't like Necromancers, reroll, seems perfectly reasonable to me.
The Necromancer guild doesn't require incredible insight or a brilliant mind to play, but people routinely complain about how hard it is. As someone who griped a bit when I was first outed, I understand it's a learning experience and there's a lot of PAFO involved, but people who complain about accruing a years worth of SO, or who train magics with Trans spells... They are ignoring the advice made by the GMs pertaining to the guild. The equivalent truly is rolling an Empath because you love swinging a sword at ALL the critters, or rolling a Moonie because you don't want to train magic very hard. I stand by the statement that most DR players are idiots; being emotional has nothing to do with it.
Now, of course, the flip side of this, that certainly bears stating, is that there are a TON of people that wow me with their intelligence, either with their training routines or their RP. Anyyyyyyyyyyywhooodle.
If you don't like Necromancers, reroll, seems perfectly reasonable to me.
FELONIOUSPI
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 01:56 AM CDT
why is it that the Necro folders can't keep a good conversation going because of silly arguments ? We have been told that "Necromancer" folders will have a bit more strict of a policy . Yet topics either end up with someone degrading themselves in defending themselves or degrading themselves by debasing others .
By way of what I think I'm understanding, is that the OP has a problem with terminologies, the forum communication , like the guild "sucks". And tongue sharpened statements like "Reroll or Die"! . heh. Seeing as how the OP has also expressed that the guild is not "Hard" to them IG , Im only guessing at the approaches in communication are the topics of criticism . If that's true , I totally Agree. I hardly think any GMs building the guild would like things conveyed as "Sucking" . And more often then not are these forums used as a pivot for conflicts. Not the right folder.
DIMINISHEDANGEL
GERSTEINJ2
complaint
03/27/2012 07:06 AM CDT
This complaint is that this folder doesn't have a conflicts folder. Bards have a conflicts folder. Even empaths have conflicts folder. But the one guild most likely to get in a fight, no conflicts? Why??
"we're doing it for the good of mankind," said the philosophers of murder, waiting for the rest of the world to congratulate them"-Elie Wiesel <the gates of the forest>
"we're doing it for the good of mankind," said the philosophers of murder, waiting for the rest of the world to congratulate them"-Elie Wiesel <the gates of the forest>
BEVERAGEK
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 07:24 AM CDT
I think the entirety of the Necromancers folder is conflicted :P
~Leilond
http://tinyurl.com/Leilond-Portrait
http://drzeal.forumotion.com Learn How to PvP!
~Leilond
http://tinyurl.com/Leilond-Portrait
http://drzeal.forumotion.com Learn How to PvP!
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 07:58 AM CDT
>And more often then not are these forums used as a pivot for conflicts. Not the right folder.
The pivot for conflict in this case was 'saying you should reroll or quit isn't fair', and I'm contesting that, because A ) it's more than fair, and B ) people are stupid [not necessarily the complainer in this case, but most people complaining about Necromancers].
In case you need more clarification, there are plenty of legitimate complaints to levy about Necromancers, balance issues, bugs, etc. For example, I still would LOVE it if DEMEANOR COLD/RESERVED prevented Rangers from walking up to me and shaking my hand, as AFAIK, it's the only out in game that I have absolutely positively zero control over and zero ability to sensibly evade. I don't fear Moon Mages or Clerics as much as I fear Rangers for this exact reason.
The pivot for conflict in this case was 'saying you should reroll or quit isn't fair', and I'm contesting that, because A ) it's more than fair, and B ) people are stupid [not necessarily the complainer in this case, but most people complaining about Necromancers].
In case you need more clarification, there are plenty of legitimate complaints to levy about Necromancers, balance issues, bugs, etc. For example, I still would LOVE it if DEMEANOR COLD/RESERVED prevented Rangers from walking up to me and shaking my hand, as AFAIK, it's the only out in game that I have absolutely positively zero control over and zero ability to sensibly evade. I don't fear Moon Mages or Clerics as much as I fear Rangers for this exact reason.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 07:59 AM CDT
Edit by way of post: AFAIK. Not ATM machine or GSP system.
JHALIASCLERIC
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 10:05 AM CDT
Been a while, but I seem to recall that the omission of a conflicts folder in the Necro section is by design.
Perhaps the design will be revisited, now that Necromancers are settled in and the whole world isn't going crazy wanting to permakill them.
Perhaps the design will be revisited, now that Necromancers are settled in and the whole world isn't going crazy wanting to permakill them.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 10:18 AM CDT
I hope the world never stops wanting to kill Necromancers, but I do think an especially regulated Conflicts folder would be a good way to keep things compartmentalized.
DR-ARMIFER
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 12:51 PM CDT
>>Been a while, but I seem to recall that the omission of a conflicts folder in the Necro section is by design.
Guild-specific conflict folders are silly. If you want to take someone to task do it in the IC or OOC Conflicts folder, as appropriate.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
Guild-specific conflict folders are silly. If you want to take someone to task do it in the IC or OOC Conflicts folder, as appropriate.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
GERSTEINJ2
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 01:30 PM CDT
<<Guild-specific conflict folders are silly.>>
So all the other guilds are silly?
Because all of the other guilds have them.
"we're doing it for the good of mankind," said the philosophers of murder, waiting for the rest of the world to congratulate them"-Elie Wiesel <the gates of the forest>
So all the other guilds are silly?
Because all of the other guilds have them.
"we're doing it for the good of mankind," said the philosophers of murder, waiting for the rest of the world to congratulate them"-Elie Wiesel <the gates of the forest>
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 02:39 PM CDT
>>So all the other guilds are silly?
This is an entertaining question to ask the most caustic wit on the boards. I look forward to Armifer's reply. Wait wait! Let me try first.
>>So all the other guilds are silly?
There used to be a conflicts folder in the Necro folders, but it caused too much social outrage, so it was banned from the forums.
This is an entertaining question to ask the most caustic wit on the boards. I look forward to Armifer's reply. Wait wait! Let me try first.
>>So all the other guilds are silly?
There used to be a conflicts folder in the Necro folders, but it caused too much social outrage, so it was banned from the forums.
VOLCANUS
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 03:23 PM CDT
Are we all doing this now? Ok, I'll try.
>>So all the other guilds are silly?
There was once a conflicts folder for the necromancer guild, but it was purged by the hounds of rutilor.
MYTHORLOGICAL
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 04:39 PM CDT
>>why is it that the Necro folders can't keep a good conversation going because of silly arguments ?
Because we seem to be divided between the camp who wants to be able to discuss things openly and critically OOC, and the camp whose sole response to everything is "Welcome to hard mode, you should choose an easier guild". Coincidentally, the latter group seems to be the one that initially chooses to belittle posters themselves, which never results in anything productive.
Yeah, I'm in the first group. I wish we could have productive discussions, and be able to ask simple questions, why's and what if's without it devolving into the same old argument. There are probably people who have already started typing a response to this post telling me to reroll, and I haven't even said anything about the guild itself.
Markat says, "Pleasant people without moral faults, going to church every week and abstaining from sins such as vanity and zombies. Feh...."
Because we seem to be divided between the camp who wants to be able to discuss things openly and critically OOC, and the camp whose sole response to everything is "Welcome to hard mode, you should choose an easier guild". Coincidentally, the latter group seems to be the one that initially chooses to belittle posters themselves, which never results in anything productive.
Yeah, I'm in the first group. I wish we could have productive discussions, and be able to ask simple questions, why's and what if's without it devolving into the same old argument. There are probably people who have already started typing a response to this post telling me to reroll, and I haven't even said anything about the guild itself.
Markat says, "Pleasant people without moral faults, going to church every week and abstaining from sins such as vanity and zombies. Feh...."
TEVESHSZAT
Re: complaint
03/27/2012 05:33 PM CDT
>>So all the other guilds are silly?
Yes. Yes they are. Take that, other guilds.
"hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down." - GERSTEINJ2
Yes. Yes they are. Take that, other guilds.
"hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down." - GERSTEINJ2
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 06:02 PM CDT
>There are probably people who have already started typing a response to this post telling me to reroll, and I haven't even said anything about the guild itself.
Drop the poor me pity me persecution complex. You're not, and it's not helpfull to your cause.
The 'Hard mode, reroll' comments come out when people complain about the penalties of playing a Necromancer, and suggest work arounds, or removal. Because it's not in the intent or design of the guild to do so, and they clearly don't 'get' it.
Actual discussion of various aspects of the guild, from lore to mechanics, are interesting even for a non-necro-player to read. The guild is interesting, and has a good lore behind it, along with a nice suite of fairly concise abilities revolving around a central theme.
No one has said 'YOU suck, reroll', except maybe Jahliascleric or whatever that user name is, and s/he seems to just hate everyone equally. I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, I mean that the necro guild is, in fact, supposed to be hard. It is billed as an advanced guild. Many of the people who join either do not know or understand this, and they just want it to be like every other guild. To use someone else's example, it would be like rolling an empath and then complaining about the shock system because I just want to be a barb who can heal himself.
I've said it before, I tried a necro. I didn't like the penalties and mechanical limitations. I do not play a necro. I do not lobby to have the guild changed so I can. I play something else instead.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
Drop the poor me pity me persecution complex. You're not, and it's not helpfull to your cause.
The 'Hard mode, reroll' comments come out when people complain about the penalties of playing a Necromancer, and suggest work arounds, or removal. Because it's not in the intent or design of the guild to do so, and they clearly don't 'get' it.
Actual discussion of various aspects of the guild, from lore to mechanics, are interesting even for a non-necro-player to read. The guild is interesting, and has a good lore behind it, along with a nice suite of fairly concise abilities revolving around a central theme.
No one has said 'YOU suck, reroll', except maybe Jahliascleric or whatever that user name is, and s/he seems to just hate everyone equally. I can only speak for myself, but when I say it, I mean that the necro guild is, in fact, supposed to be hard. It is billed as an advanced guild. Many of the people who join either do not know or understand this, and they just want it to be like every other guild. To use someone else's example, it would be like rolling an empath and then complaining about the shock system because I just want to be a barb who can heal himself.
I've said it before, I tried a necro. I didn't like the penalties and mechanical limitations. I do not play a necro. I do not lobby to have the guild changed so I can. I play something else instead.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
SCHULTZS3
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 06:05 PM CDT
>The equivalent truly is rolling an Empath because you love swinging a sword at ALL the critters, or rolling a Moonie because you don't want to train magic very hard
I have long wished my Empath was Magic Primary.
I have long wished my MM was Lore Primary.
Really. Maybe not so much in the first case, but I play a MM primarily because of predictions (kind of Astrology, a lore skill? Predictions it seems is a strange critter in a strange Guild full of strange mechanics), but also enchanting (supposed to be Astrology, a lore skill. Will definitely roll over to Mech), Astral travel which is a good mix of Lore/Magic to interact with with any action (memorizing shards or actual travel), because of the lore and mystique of them, and a few odds and ends that are usually only tangential to being a Magic Prime. I feel kind of stupid having to cast magic spells over and over for HOURS to get my crushing Magic Total reqs. I guess I'll just be satisfied with Astrology moving to Primary.
Kaeta Airtag
>>Actually an opinion cannot be changed or corrected. Nice try back of line.-VERATHOR
>>But it can be wrong.-Starlear
I have long wished my Empath was Magic Primary.
I have long wished my MM was Lore Primary.
Really. Maybe not so much in the first case, but I play a MM primarily because of predictions (kind of Astrology, a lore skill? Predictions it seems is a strange critter in a strange Guild full of strange mechanics), but also enchanting (supposed to be Astrology, a lore skill. Will definitely roll over to Mech), Astral travel which is a good mix of Lore/Magic to interact with with any action (memorizing shards or actual travel), because of the lore and mystique of them, and a few odds and ends that are usually only tangential to being a Magic Prime. I feel kind of stupid having to cast magic spells over and over for HOURS to get my crushing Magic Total reqs. I guess I'll just be satisfied with Astrology moving to Primary.
Kaeta Airtag
>>Actually an opinion cannot be changed or corrected. Nice try back of line.-VERATHOR
>>But it can be wrong.-Starlear
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Purging
03/27/2012 07:31 PM CDT
>>I have long wished my Empath was Magic Primary.
I actually wished the same thing, but it's still kind of a moot point as the difference between magic prime and lore prime in terms of functionality, I feel, is entirely inconsequential.
>Drop the poor me pity me persecution complex. You're not, and it's not helpfull to your cause.
Basically, this. The notion that the Necromancer folder is incapable of productive talk is ludicrous, and really only demonstrative of a handful of posters not getting what they want. Which is sympathy for their mistakes and the dumification of the guild.
I actually wished the same thing, but it's still kind of a moot point as the difference between magic prime and lore prime in terms of functionality, I feel, is entirely inconsequential.
>Drop the poor me pity me persecution complex. You're not, and it's not helpfull to your cause.
Basically, this. The notion that the Necromancer folder is incapable of productive talk is ludicrous, and really only demonstrative of a handful of posters not getting what they want. Which is sympathy for their mistakes and the dumification of the guild.
MOD-HELJE
Re: Purging ::NUDGE::
03/27/2012 08:59 PM CDT
This one is getting kind of off-topic here, and what little is on-topic is approaching conflictual mass. Let's turn this thread around or take it down to the OOC conflict folders please.
As always if you have any questions or comments, please contact me at MOD-Helje@play.net, Senior Board Monitor Sidatura at DR-Sidatura@play.net, or Message Board Supervisor Annwyl DR-Annwyl@play.net.
Helje
DragonRealms Board Monitor
As always if you have any questions or comments, please contact me at MOD-Helje@play.net, Senior Board Monitor Sidatura at DR-Sidatura@play.net, or Message Board Supervisor Annwyl DR-Annwyl@play.net.
Helje
DragonRealms Board Monitor
MELLIONM6
Zombies
03/28/2012 03:01 PM CDT
In the case of most major NPC necromancers, there is a sizable collection of undead creatures under their control. Lyras, in fact, had an infinite number of them at multiple locations at her beck and call, plus the ones in her immediate vicinity. Hobglub had an insane number of murder dolls. While we haven't seen any armies around Book, is there something preventing him from producing several thousand zombies with intersecting lifespans? If not, what (lorewise, I assume the base mechanics weren't designed to handle it) is preventing us from producing 5 or 6 creatures under our direct control? Why were the spells that raised several other-wise autonomous mobs removed from the original spell list?
--Croegar/Shatteringwave/Someone Else
K>think
You try, but in the cramped confines of the tunnel, there's just no room to do that.
--Croegar/Shatteringwave/Someone Else
K>think
You try, but in the cramped confines of the tunnel, there's just no room to do that.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 03:24 PM CDT
Not to bash Book's abilities in comparison to Lyras, but I'd chalk Lyras' notable capabilities to her magical staff, association with an extra-planar demon, and general lichiness.
"hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down." - GERSTEINJ2
"hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down." - GERSTEINJ2
DR-ARMIFER
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 03:37 PM CDT
The three reasons are, in decreasing order of importance:
1) We don't have a good concept for how to balance a Horde of Zombies ability yet.
2) Lyras and other demonically oriented Necromancers are better at it than you.
3) The Philosophers encourage detailed work over mass raising as being more inline with the Great Work.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
1) We don't have a good concept for how to balance a Horde of Zombies ability yet.
2) Lyras and other demonically oriented Necromancers are better at it than you.
3) The Philosophers encourage detailed work over mass raising as being more inline with the Great Work.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
SHADESLAYER2
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 04:32 PM CDT
>>3) The Philosophers encourage detailed work over mass raising as being more inline with the Great Work.
This is why I can't wait until a more perverse guild opens its doors, or maybe it already has... dun dun dun.
This is why I can't wait until a more perverse guild opens its doors, or maybe it already has... dun dun dun.
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 04:39 PM CDT
>>If not, what (lorewise, I assume the base mechanics weren't designed to handle it) is preventing us from producing 5 or 6 creatures under our direct control?
Personally, I would prefer one pet that is very effective versus six that are considerably less powerful and much more cumbersome to control.
Personally, I would prefer one pet that is very effective versus six that are considerably less powerful and much more cumbersome to control.
SHADESLAYER2
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 05:05 PM CDT
We can effectively have two out at the same time, a construct and a zombie (though they kill eachother if in the same room). I can see an appeal to 'Mass Horde' though, perhaps a very difficult spell to maintain (esoteric cyclic spell?) that bypasses the need to perform rituals such as preserve, arise and heal them. The negative would be that it wold only be as effective as 50% of your targeted magic skill or something. I never expect to see something like this happen though, it would seem very difficult to code and whatnot.
JASON42
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 05:23 PM CDT
>>1) We don't have a good concept for how to balance a Horde of Zombies ability yet.
Base the quantity on thanatology ranks and tie it into the DO / SO system. Implement a small concentration or spirit hit for every action the zombies take...
Ive occasionally wondered why Necromancy / DO doesn't just chip away at spirit health instead of just all-or-nothing it...
- Kart
Base the quantity on thanatology ranks and tie it into the DO / SO system. Implement a small concentration or spirit hit for every action the zombies take...
Ive occasionally wondered why Necromancy / DO doesn't just chip away at spirit health instead of just all-or-nothing it...
- Kart
SHADESLAYER2
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 05:24 PM CDT
Man we don't even have Risen yet! Let's not skip a beat and head to raise all, let them finish other stuff first. >.<;
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Zombies
03/28/2012 05:26 PM CDT
>>This is why I can't wait until a more perverse guild opens its doors, or maybe it already has... dun dun dun.
Of course you have the assumption they'd want a person who originally came from Book's flock, heh.
"hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down." - GERSTEINJ2
Of course you have the assumption they'd want a person who originally came from Book's flock, heh.
"hypocrite, thy name is teveshszat, and i just hope i'm there to see you when you're broght down." - GERSTEINJ2
MELLIONM6
Re: Zombies
03/30/2012 09:44 PM CDT
>> 2) Lyras and other demonically oriented Necromancers are better at it than you.
Sorry to make you keep saying this.
>> 3) The Philosophers encourage detailed work over mass raising as being more inline with the Great Work.
This is good to know.
>> Ive occasionally wondered why Necromancy / DO doesn't just chip away at spirit health instead of just all-or-nothing it...
This, I believe, has been addressed, though I'm way to lazy to actually look up the posts. Based upon the question, I imagine one of these two will answer it.
A.) Philosophers don't practice any necromancy which deals with any kind of spiritually power. As such, they don't do anything that could hurt their souls or anyone else's. They also can't raise spiritual or non-corporeal undead. This is a core separation from the mechanically-oriented Philosophers and the demonically-oriented general collection of individuals bent on bringing your great grandmother back to kill and/or enslave you.
B.) The gods are so terribly above you that they only really take particular notice when you're putting particular effort into pissing them off, or crossing the line into becoming truly forsaken. They don't really care to let you know you're crossing the line with little spirit tickles. When you do finally get them to take notice, they make it a point to make you notice their attention.
--Croegar/Shatteringwave/Someone Else
K>think
You try, but in the cramped confines of the tunnel, there's just no room to do that.
Sorry to make you keep saying this.
>> 3) The Philosophers encourage detailed work over mass raising as being more inline with the Great Work.
This is good to know.
>> Ive occasionally wondered why Necromancy / DO doesn't just chip away at spirit health instead of just all-or-nothing it...
This, I believe, has been addressed, though I'm way to lazy to actually look up the posts. Based upon the question, I imagine one of these two will answer it.
A.) Philosophers don't practice any necromancy which deals with any kind of spiritually power. As such, they don't do anything that could hurt their souls or anyone else's. They also can't raise spiritual or non-corporeal undead. This is a core separation from the mechanically-oriented Philosophers and the demonically-oriented general collection of individuals bent on bringing your great grandmother back to kill and/or enslave you.
B.) The gods are so terribly above you that they only really take particular notice when you're putting particular effort into pissing them off, or crossing the line into becoming truly forsaken. They don't really care to let you know you're crossing the line with little spirit tickles. When you do finally get them to take notice, they make it a point to make you notice their attention.
--Croegar/Shatteringwave/Someone Else
K>think
You try, but in the cramped confines of the tunnel, there's just no room to do that.
SHADESLAYER2
GERSTEINJ2
Re: Zombies
03/31/2012 07:28 AM CDT
<<B.) The gods are so terribly above you that they only really take particular notice when you're putting particular effort into pissing them off, or crossing the line into becoming truly forsaken. They don't really care to let you know you're crossing the line with little spirit tickles. When you do finally get them to take notice, they make it a point to make you notice their attention.>>
Although this is indeed the case for necromancers, you'd have to wonder how "aloof" from the affairs of mortals the immortals really are - i.e. their interaction with the clerics who, get messaging about the different stages of how much the gods notice THEM when they do various of their devotional rituals and then commune.
I'd like to see a more interactive system for necromancers as well, rather than the old <wait out the timer> - thing. To me that isn't much different from the way "old" thief bonus used to work where if you pissed off the guild too much by getting caught stealing you would have to wait out months before you could even get back in the guildhall without being killed off. To me the "wait it out" thing for divine fury seems much along the same line.
No, we couldn't "please" the gods so well we could get favors from them - that's for the redeemed who more or less give up the craft to save their souls... <?> or not - depending on whom you believe -
But we could possibly placate them a little by doing some sort of groveling routine at one of their altars or something?
I'm sure the GMs could come up with some creative ritual here. After all, look at sacrifice . :-)
And... just because... I loved the messaging for the following :-)
<<Suddenly Khurek rushes toward you like an enraged green bull, bellowing, "You! You shall NOT desecrate our dead!"
Khurek gestures at you.
Your head explodes, leaving nothing but a few blackened and smoking skull fragments scattered about!>>
[Uzmam] "<chat>" "what you seem to not realize is that I'd love for Uzmam to be outed. That way she could have Divult finally apprentice her and I could learn those slips"
Although this is indeed the case for necromancers, you'd have to wonder how "aloof" from the affairs of mortals the immortals really are - i.e. their interaction with the clerics who, get messaging about the different stages of how much the gods notice THEM when they do various of their devotional rituals and then commune.
I'd like to see a more interactive system for necromancers as well, rather than the old <wait out the timer> - thing. To me that isn't much different from the way "old" thief bonus used to work where if you pissed off the guild too much by getting caught stealing you would have to wait out months before you could even get back in the guildhall without being killed off. To me the "wait it out" thing for divine fury seems much along the same line.
No, we couldn't "please" the gods so well we could get favors from them - that's for the redeemed who more or less give up the craft to save their souls... <?> or not - depending on whom you believe -
But we could possibly placate them a little by doing some sort of groveling routine at one of their altars or something?
I'm sure the GMs could come up with some creative ritual here. After all, look at sacrifice . :-)
And... just because... I loved the messaging for the following :-)
<<Suddenly Khurek rushes toward you like an enraged green bull, bellowing, "You! You shall NOT desecrate our dead!"
Khurek gestures at you.
Your head explodes, leaving nothing but a few blackened and smoking skull fragments scattered about!>>
[Uzmam] "<chat>" "what you seem to not realize is that I'd love for Uzmam to be outed. That way she could have Divult finally apprentice her and I could learn those slips"
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: Zombies
03/31/2012 08:20 AM CDT
>Although this is indeed the case for necromancers, you'd have to wonder how "aloof" from the affairs of mortals the immortals really are - i.e. their interaction with the clerics who, get messaging about the different stages of how much the gods notice THEM when they do various of their devotional rituals and then commune.
I wouldn't use clerics as a basis for the gods; clerics are essentially holy assistants. And even then, the commune messaging to me doesn't mean directly 'I am watching you at all times. I watch you sleep, and eat, and use the restroom' and more of a general 'Ah, that guy, ya he's an ok guy, what was his name?' vs. 'who the blazes are you and why are you calling me' vs. 'Bestest friend in the whole wide world who gave me a 20 last week' type of acknowledgements and affection levels.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
I wouldn't use clerics as a basis for the gods; clerics are essentially holy assistants. And even then, the commune messaging to me doesn't mean directly 'I am watching you at all times. I watch you sleep, and eat, and use the restroom' and more of a general 'Ah, that guy, ya he's an ok guy, what was his name?' vs. 'who the blazes are you and why are you calling me' vs. 'Bestest friend in the whole wide world who gave me a 20 last week' type of acknowledgements and affection levels.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
FELONIOUSPI
Re: Zombies
03/31/2012 02:02 PM CDT
>But we could possibly placate them a little by doing some sort of groveling routine at one of their altars or something?
Are you suggesting that Necromancers get on their knees and kiss God rear end ?
Are you suggesting that Necromancers get on their knees and kiss God rear end ?
FELONIOUSPI
Re: Zombies
03/31/2012 02:06 PM CDT
IF so , "You choose not to heed the admonitory communion, you choose to cast off the binding moral chains, xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. Despite your determination, xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx being scoured of everything holy and pure in you. xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx. You are now among the forsaken: fallen from grace, vilified by the universe."
