I don't beserk much so I can't remember if there's actually a command to stop it but I don't think so. My advice would be to kill until everything is gone(since IIRC you can't retreat with stone) then leave the area. Stone doesn't take much IF so if you keep killing it'll keep regening your IF and keep the berserk going.

That's one of the reasons berserks don't get used at the high end. There's no feasible way to stop them other than to let them run out.

You can shorten the length significantly by being out of combat.

If out of combat you can shorten the length even more significantly by then berserking cycline, nightmare, and blood out of combat, you will fall stunned for probably a full minute or more.

I do realize these are work-arounds out of combat and probably defeat the purpose of wanting to stop them in the first place....but I thought I would share.


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Soon you should have nightmare and you can reatreat with that up, much easier to stop fighting and just let it end.

I was just saying use it and not stone, gives some nice bonuses, works really well.

It buffs strength charisma and gives a multi bonus so it does help with multi fighting but after just comparing it to stone, stone is better if you can handle the no retreat.

>I never understood why Stone was no retreat

With rare exception all berserks are no retreat. The idea is you're too angry to even think about it.

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Magic's Death Caraamon Makdasi, Gor'Tog Barbarian
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
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>>I never understood why Stone was no retreat, especially since the stam boost isn't really needed unless you're dying. It just seems silly.

Stone is a very powerful buff, especially at lower circles: I always considered it a vitality version of the Cleric spell Persistence of Mana, and on top of that it offers damage reduction, stat boosts, and multi opponent boost.

I agree with the no-retreat being strange. While I don't mind if some of the restrictions (like no-retreat on some berserks) staying for "flavor," in general the penalties of berserks are way too restricting, and make most people shy away from ever using them. I hope the rewrite fixes this, because I love the concept of being an angry Barbarian.

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Right now the Moon Mage place on the "combat pet totem pole" is the part that's sunk into the earth to lower the pole's center of gravity.
-Armifer de Dragonrealms

>>Fixed, it's easily surpassed by Badger and Dragon somewhere between 60th and 75th circle.

If you just take it on its own, I think it's a decent ability in its own right.

I actually had this line in the post about how I realize the standard of measurement these days is Dragon Dance at circle 100+, and in comparison it's crap, but it sounded sort of ranting, so I took it out!

Choosing between it and Badger, obviously you take Badger in later circles. But what if Stone was a straight damage reduction and you could stack it with Badger? Hopefully the rewrite will allow something like this.

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Right now the Moon Mage place on the "combat pet totem pole" is the part that's sunk into the earth to lower the pole's center of gravity.
-Armifer de Dragonrealms

There's no barb like that because having 10 or less disc makes for one crappy character.

>I tried the plated berserking barbarian thing. The early success was unexpected and impressive, but the idea fell short in the late game where dances offer almost all the benefits of berserks with none of the drawbacks.

Can you define early/late game? I'm assuming early would be anything pre 200 ranks, and late would be mostly 400+?

So, can you say dances equal stacked 'zerks till that range, but start to pull ahead, or do berserks simply completely eclipse dances until you hit 50+?

>>Might be the closest. 87th barb with 75 str, 70 stam, 55 agil/ref and 25 disc. 400 ranks of HP, but due to the hinderance with using full plate, I prefer good leather body armor with forged HP accessories. I don't hide during combat. Plan is to get str/stam/agil/ref to 99 and do some testing of the berserks, granted if the re-write hasn't happened at that time.

Well heck you could do some testing now? Can you stack blood, stone, and Cyclone together without callapsing? If so can you stack all 4? (add nightmare)

Your highest berserk, how does that perform?


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<<So, can you say dances equal stacked 'zerks till that range, but start to pull ahead, or do berserks simply completely eclipse dances until you hit 50+? >>

Berserks are better than dances for everything except stealth/ranged hunting and general PvP until at least 50th, assuming you don't need to retreat. Once you hit that point dances are about equal for power but still non-stackable. By 70th dances performed noticeably better.

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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Downing_effect
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dunning_kruger_effect

Those stats make me one sad barb. I can't fathom someone completely tanking their ability to learn to swing heavier weapons, stack berserks that you can't really end, and tank your ability to see hiders(which will come into play when you have to move into juvies). Out of curiosity, what kind of pulses do you see on your primary weapons, Wartug?

I also want to add that the biggest predictor of pulse size is whether or not the skill is primary/secondary/tertiary.

Barbs are the only guild that are weapon primary. Weapon is the skillset that has the most weapons skills, and a lot of TDP potential there. If you're draining faster than you can fill all of the skills, it's not really worth it anyways. So, it's more about the rate which you can fill all your skill pools, rather than the rate at which you drain it, especially if you want to keep your secondary defense somewhat in line.

Early on really doesn't mean anything. Everyone learns well early on, even if you don't train mentals. It's when you get into the celpeze+ levels that it gets rough. When you start getting open rolled, stamina won't mean anything. Get a strong hit that explodes the chest and that 99 stamina is worthless. When you get into that range, you WILL need to retreat. Wanting to get to 99 agility and reflex early is one thing, getting all physicals when that much strength and stamina really won't help you is another. With 60 in both int and wisdom, my primary still pulses under .006.

>>Won't this start to show when your defenses slack way behind your weapon skills? Unless you are stancing and working enough weapons to counter-act it, which makes your post rather disingenious.

I think you missed the point. I'm saying more wisdom and intel, and training fewer weapons will only make the gap between primary and secondary larger. Training more weapons with lower absorption rates makes the gap smaller, and also gives you more TDPs for what you hunt. It's a more well-rounded approach at the cost of a bit of progression speed.

>>et a strong hit that explodes the chest and that 99 stamina is worthless. When you get into that range, you WILL need to retreat. Wanting to get to 99 agility and reflex early is one thing, getting all physicals when that much strength and stamina really won't help you is another.

1. Wearing thicker armor is the best protection against open rolls. It's harder to dance in plate than to zerk in plate.
2. Even though stamina doesn't mean much now, there may be changes on the horizon to affect how stamina helps with receiving damage as mentioned before last year.
3. If your chest is exploded, it's kind of hard to retreat-- even if your dancing.

I've seen a Barb or 2 whine about being pretty useless in invasions and fighting against GMPCs. If all you do is berserk and use melee weapons then you will get smashed, especially if you get a spell cast on you. Of course, the same people usually complain about stealths when they get in just one spar.

If you are content in being horrible in PvP (if you actually socialize with others a lot then you may find yourself in this position anyway one day), never utilizing BMR to its full potential, being horrible at stealths, being horrible at using ranged weapons, then berserking works wonderfully I imagine.

Personally, I think being great at dances AND berserks (without lacking mentals) is the best way to get more tdps.

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Individuals, families, countries, continents are destroyed at the heavy hand of Vinjince.

-GM Abasha

I think people sorely underestimate the way my character performs or possibly overestimate the bad points of berzerking and having low mentals.

1st Highest: Brawling - 483
2nd Highest: Twohanded Edged - 439
3rd Highest: Heavy Crossbow - 425

I don't know why it would make someone horrible at using ranged weapons, I don't tend to have an issue with it. Heavy Crossbow allows me to stand at melee using an arm-worn shield and I can brawl while aiming.

As for open rolls, I've been killed once in celps by an open roll, but that's it, and it would have done it whether I was dancing dragon or berzerking stone. After learning 80 ranks from celps, one death isn't too bad. Usually stone can take out the damage and make open rolls lowered to a light bleeder hit and high stamina keeps me from being stunned. In fact, I usually have a single bleeder once every couple of days and that's the worst of it. I can't remember the last time I was stunned in combat or beaten down other than that one random open roll.

Not sure why people think high strength is useless, though, that's confusing to me. At only 439 ranks of 2HE I can almost always one-shot celps swinging a 102 stone greatsword at minimum rt without the use of any abilities and never feeling any fatigue. With 477 perception, I don't have issues searching out people around my level even with bad mentals, either.

The no retreat has never been an issue for me. I simply zerk stone while training and when I'm ready to go I just kill everything and leave. The only time it was a pain in the rear is passing through a room that automatically puts you at pole range with advacing creatures, for obvious reasons.

PROS: Can hunt above level with 4 creatures easily without taking damage, can kill things in very few hits, don't take stuns, very rarely killed, higher combat stats circle for circle than most

CONS: BMR is lower than it could be with higher mentals as they count twice as much as physical stats, I don't learn as quickly as someone with high mentals, can't retreat when desired, not as viable for PVP due to stealths/no retreat

Train how you want, and I'll train how I see my character. But the reality is, in your head my character is useless, but in usage he is actually incredibly proficient for what I do, which is hunt in PVE.

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Battle Lord Wartug Skullcleaver
Gor'Tog Barbarian

"You live and die by the only thing you can control: your choices. Choose wisely."