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I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/26/2012 03:08 PM CST
So I made an excuse to attack a lot of them.

It's called Grounding Field [GF]:

The Grounding Field spell establishes an electrical field about the magician that redirects hostile energies harmlessly into Elanthia. When establishing a field it must be attuned to fire, cold or electrical sources specifically. While much trial and hardship has resulted in a stable barrier that will not interfere with the caster's own attacks be warned that the field will amplify energy sources it is not attuned to.




The skinny: Esoteric Warding in the Lighting book. It requires ES, LB and 70th circle. 2 slots. When cast you must specify cold, fire or electrical.

The way it works is slightly complex, but the basic logic it should follow is this:

If the attack is purely elemental and the primary element is what you're attuned to, the attack will be stopped entirely.

If the attack is both elemental and physical, and the primary element is what you're attuned to, the elemental component will be stripped away entirely.

If the attack's primary element is not what you are attuned to, the any damage from both elements you are not attuned to will be increased. Any damage from the element you are attuned to will still be nullified (though for brevity this isn't messaged).

This is not a trivial spell, and we're going to be watching it's power level closely. It's also a little tricky how it works so please bring forth anything unusual you see it doing.

-Raesh

"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/26/2012 03:59 PM CST
Very cool concept for a spell.

Thanks for the release!
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/26/2012 05:42 PM CST
Sounds nifty.

> stopped entirely

So does this spell not have potency, then? Just duration and integrity?
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/26/2012 09:00 PM CST
Essentially.

-Raesh

"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/26/2012 11:11 PM CST
lol awesome.

http://www.divine-journeys.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/energy-shield.jpg

~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 08:14 AM CST
Correct me if I'm wrong, but there is actually no Holy type, right?
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 09:35 AM CST
Fire electric cold and physicals as far as I know. Holy spells are typically fire and impact, though I think HE dabbles in all three elements for most bang.



Adding nothing to the conversation since 1834.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 12:25 PM CST
My understanding is that holy is generally a mix of all three elements.



When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 01:17 PM CST
Seems a pretty risky spell; considering the number of magics that aren't elemental in nature, potentially upping the damage received by an incoming spell seems overboard for stopping just one type.

Maybe make the barrier a bit more dynamic, and enable swapping to a different element with a small RT? I'll have to fiddle with it.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 02:26 PM CST
I hate Warrior Mages too.

~~~
True heroism is remarkably sober, very undramatic. It is not the urge to surpass all others at whatever cost, but the urge to serve others at whatever cost.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 02:35 PM CST
It's an insanely powerful spell when used at the right times against the right people. And it's also a very neat tool for discovering which spells lean heavily on elemental damage. Try it against burn, heh.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 02:37 PM CST

One minor thing with the messaging: it says the caster drops to one knee, but doesn't mention them standing back up. Just looks kind of funny.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 03:14 PM CST
>>It's an insanely powerful spell when used at the right times against the right people. And it's also a very neat tool for discovering which spells lean heavily on elemental damage. Try it against burn, heh.

Another reason to bemoan the lack of CRS in the Moon Mage 3.0 Spell book. :-(


TG, TG, GL, et al.

"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 04:43 PM CST
hmm...
well.. years ago I once suggested a magnetic Earth spell that made an anti-elec pillar to nullify CL.
This seems a lot more useful, but I'm not sure how often outside of PvP(specially with enchanting) it'll be used:

- Seords, Fire sprites, Fire maidens, sky giants(couldn't get them to cast any spells), sew bizars(couldn't get them to cast GZ), frostweyr bears(i couldn't get one to cast frostbite), frostweavers(does frost scythe exist for them?), rock and swamp trolls(al damages doesn't it). Haven't had a chance to get it to work, I think.

>>A suw bizar gestures.
- unless that's it working and their spell failing.

I like that it has trade-off's, curious to play with it though. Also a quick snap would seem best, since having a long duration could be bad?

suggestion: to add water and ice as syntax alternatives to cold.

suggestion or upgrade: made it an area effect... the duration is pretty short and that might make it more interesting/viable.

Looks a little funny in water-
You firmly press your palms into the ground.
You contribute your harnessed streams to increase the pattern's potential.
It occurs to you that you'll need to find a dry place to establish a proper ground.

_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 05:10 PM CST
<Another reason to bemoan the lack of CRS in the Moon Mage 3.0 Spell book. :-(

Heh yeah that sucks, CRS was badass. Was the perfect spell to snap off just before a nice PD or burn killcast.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 05:57 PM CST
<<One minor thing with the messaging: it says the caster drops to one knee, but doesn't mention them standing back up. Just looks kind of funny.>>

I stood up after casting it by typing Stand. I don't think the spell does it for you.



<<The real thing DR needs is to get out there to the kids who actually read books.>>
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 07:55 PM CST
Will this spell work against enchanted weapons? I think it should.



Individuals, families, countries, continents are destroyed at the heavy hand of Vinjince.

-GM Abasha
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 08:59 PM CST
>>Seems a pretty risky spell; considering the number of magics that aren't elemental in nature, potentially upping the damage received by an incoming spell seems overboard for stopping just one type.

Stopping one type of damage can be devastating.

Some guilds can really only do one type of damage (Never mind people who don't have a wide range of spells) and it just shuts down some critter's to an absurd degree.

>>One minor thing with the messaging: it says the caster drops to one knee, but doesn't mention them standing back up. Just looks kind of funny.

I'll fix that next time I sync things up.

>>A suw bizar gestures.

I think this is a TM bug, I was getting some reports of other critter's casting TM spells and while I was watching I saw all the messaging but the targets weren't. Could you try and collect more data on that please, preferably with others watching and multiple creatures?

>>suggestion: to add water and ice as syntax alternatives to cold.

Maybe.

>>suggestion or upgrade: made it an area effect... the duration is pretty short and that might make it more interesting/viable.

No.

>>Looks a little funny in water-

I futzed around with it, but it's going to be a notable amount of work to get it to properly message in water (the new Breath of Storms I'm working on has a similar problem, plus other spells I'm sure). May just be something we live with, may be we can find a work around.

>>Will this spell work against enchanted weapons? I think it should.

It doesn't matter where the elemental damage is coming from, it'll step in.

-Raesh

"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 10:18 PM CST
>Stopping one type of damage can be devastating.

If you can give ballparks, will stopping 1 element of a multi-element spell make up for the boost the other elements get? Or will it be a net increase to damage if, say, you're facing 1/3 fire/elec/cold?

I guess I'm asking for a rough comparison of boost vs. negation. Since negation is total.



Adding nothing to the conversation since 1834.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 10:20 PM CST
>a multi-element spell

How many of these are there? I thought the reason Aether stopped having attack spells is because they were all so drastically overpowered, combining every (almost?) damage type.

Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 10:30 PM CST
>>If you can give ballparks, will stopping 1 element of a multi-element spell make up for the boost the other elements get

If you're warded against the primary element, then the other things don't get a boost.

Say you're set to block fire.

So if something is mainly fire, but with a touch of electric on the side, then both get blocked.

If something is mainly electric, with a touch of fire on the side, the fire gets blocked but the electric is boosted.

If something is mainly fire with some impact on the side, then only the impact gets through (with no boost or reduction).

If something is mainly fire with some impact and cold on the side, then the fire is blocked, the cold is blocked, but the impact gets through.

If something is mainly electric with a touch of fire, cold, and slice on the side, the fire is blocked, the electric and cold is boosted, and the slice is normal.



When in doubt, http://elanthipedia.org/
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:25 PM CST
Looking over the warmie spell list, it's all over the board.

Moonies do fire with Burn, and cold with SLS (not sure what's happening with SLS in 3.0?)

Clerics do fire with FoU.

Bards do fire (and possibly ice) with Pyre, and Lightening with BoS?

Necromancers do random damage with ACS and USOL (HA!), Fire with BLB

I'm probably missing some stuff, but I feel like this spell is potentially a bit underwhelming if it primarily blocks against one trick pony Warmies who don't think to switch to a different element. Since so many guilds can do at least a few types of damage, it doesn't seem like it's a good shut down, and because it amplifies off barrier type magic, it seems like it's potentially quite risky.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:30 PM CST
> Moonies do fire with Burn, and cold with SLS (not sure what's happening with SLS in 3.0?)

I think DO does a little cold.

> Bards do fire (and possibly ice) with Pyre, and Lightening with BoS?

Pyre is either fire or fire/ice; it'll be interesting to test it with this to see which element is dominant in the second version. From the sounds of things, BoS will be getting a lightning/ice version as well.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:34 PM CST
The way I'm looking at it is that it is a spell that when used in the right situation is amazing. In a normal day to day it may or may not have use and in rare cases could be poor choice. Won't be everyone's cup of tea, but then some of the most recent spells are designed with the unique in mind.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:46 PM CST
DO does some cold, but whatever its ratio to physical damage is, it's nothing like burn. I tried it against a WM attuned to block fire and the amplification was meh.

As an example of what this spell is capable of, it turns a one shot burn kill into a scratch with no visible wound--even when the burn caster has over 600 more TM than the target has evasion, and is capping and fully targeting the spell. Granted, that shows that burn is obviously hugely dependent on fire damage, but I bet it's not the only spell out there like that. And there aren't really a lot of DFA options.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:50 PM CST
I'm fairly certain (but absolutely could be wrong) that DO just does slice. PD just does impact.

I guess my initial sentiment is just that it's too niche. Unless you identified a mage that ONLY casts Fire/Ice/Lightening spells, this isn't going to really serve much good. Considering Lightening isn't opposing Fire or Ice, switching over won't even hurt an attuned Fire/Ice mage.

But hey, maybe the reduction of Fire or Ice damage is substantial enough to render even the impact remaining from Fireball. What happens to spells like Tingle? Ice Patch? Does geyser do fire or cold damage?

I dunno, for a spell that can either completely eliminate a 'couple' (for flexible utility of the word) spells, it seems like there's far to many TM spells that don't do elemental damage, and any given caster has access to far too many spells to make a 1/3rd gamble very attractive in my mind.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:52 PM CST
EBWOP: Ah, I see the DO and Burn comment. I mean, that's neat, to be sure, but A ) Warmies already have an elemental damage reducer in the form of ES, and an anti-magic shield in the form of AC.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:54 PM CST
This spell is notably better than ES, if you're fighting something that can't just jump into another element.



The teeth lands a solid (5/23) hit that pokes the teeth into Turul's rear end (more embarrassing than painful!).
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/27/2012 11:55 PM CST
and B ) most mages have access to spells with minimal to no elemental components to them. What's the reduction on DO fired at a cold attuned GF?
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 12:43 AM CST
Definitely niche, but that niche is awesome in my opinion. I'd love to have a spell that killed LB, even at the expense of damage amplification for the others. You have to hit before you hurt, and DFA nullification is no joke. If this spell went to paladins, there'd be truck loads of booze showing up at Raesh's door.

If anyone happens to test LB vs this spell, please post. It would be interesting to see if LB leans on elemental damage as much as Burn.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 02:13 AM CST
Not every spell is for everybody, nor is every spell written for just PvP. In the right circumstances this spell will crush many creatures in PvE, which is where many of the limitations come in.

Aside from that the Hamster's flow chart is correct about how the damage is stopped.

Also just to clarify spells in 3.0 generally do damage in a few different ways:

1 type of damage

2 types of damage in equal amounts

2 types of damage skewed towards one

3 types of damage in equal amounts

-Raesh

"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 02:48 AM CST
>> Not every spell is for everybody, nor is every spell written for just PvP. In the right circumstances this spell will crush many creatures in PvE, which is where many of the limitations come in.

Yeah... I'm not sure why people are not thinking about PvE where 99% of gameplay is. This spell is ridiculously good. Even more in 3.0 when combat is cleaned up and spell casting creatures are more viable to hunt against and probably easier to make, thus seeing more of them.

You can literally not put up any other magic defense spells if you know the creature magic type you are hunting against.

This could also potentially protect you from errant fire rain? Anything else self inflicted that may pose a threat?
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 06:29 AM CST
>>2 types of damage in equal amounts

If a spell does 2 types of damage in equal amounts, what determines which is the primary element?

~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 07:42 AM CST
>If you're warded against the primary element, then the other things don't get a boost.

Oh, that makes the spell completely different. I was reading it as only the single element gets blocked then the others get boosted.

Though I'm still curious, in the case of a tri-elemental spell, all of it would get blocked?



Adding nothing to the conversation since 1834.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 07:51 AM CST
>>Though I'm still curious, in the case of a tri-elemental spell, all of it would get blocked?

Only if the primary element of that spell is the one you're attuned to.

~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 08:02 AM CST

It was quite effective at shutting down Malchata, with their fireballs and a special attack that dealt fire damage.


And once sky giant's can cast again, it would make their DFA lightning bolts something I could ignore and still work my TM against them (parry/shield are way over my evasion is why I can't effectively hunt them in Prime).

It is super niche, but it did turn a one-shot kill burn into 5% vitality loss. If you're fighitng against a MM or WM, you could negate their DFA spell almost entirely. Cleric spells rely on a lot of fire too. The damage boost that DO got didn't seem that drastic when tried against my fire field.
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 08:09 AM CST
Technically it's a >= in the equation, so in a tie it should ground out.

That said I'm not 100% sure at which point barriers get checked vs other factors in combat so it's possible it could change from cast to cast due to RNG and changing circumstances - I don't think it will, but I'm not certain enough on the combat math flowchart to say for sure.

-Raesh

"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 08:45 AM CST
>>If it's all a 50/50 split then I'm just scared that a War Mage will instantly be immune to every elemental spell/scream a Bard throws while having Will of Winter up by attuning to Ice :/

So stop Will of Winter?


TG, TG, GL, et al.

"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 08:46 AM CST
Posts deleted!

Also,

>>So stop Will of Winter?

Not that easy :/

~ Leilond
http://i67.photobucket.com/albums/h307/ss1shadow/Leilond_Progression.jpg
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Re: I hate Warrior Mages too! 12/28/2012 09:15 AM CST
One thing to keep in mind is there are very few (to the point that I can't think of one off-hand) pure elemental attacks in the game. Nullifying most elemental attacks' elemental properties is devastating, but doesn't leave the spell completely toothless.

-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
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