So as recently as about a week ago, I finally dropped my first points into multi opponent combat. I had never realized it before, but as I put those points in, I realized the number to the right of MOC was half of the numbers to the right of the skills around it. So we can only single MOC, I thought... Surely there's a good reason they don't let rogues double MOC? Maybe monks don't get to double amb...er, nope, they do, I checked my monk. Well maybe...nope, no good reason I can see. The cost is irrelevant, and tripled stalking and hiding comes nowhere near close to making that balanced design. Why shouldn't rogues, who are a square, be able to double MOC? I'm curious if there's a reason floating around out there...
LORDDEMANDRED
AFALLACE
Re: I'm curious
08/28/2020 04:47 PM CDT
Wait until you find out rogues can't 3x physical fitness.
.jaired
>LIKE A BOSS
Please rephrase that command.
.jaired
>LIKE A BOSS
Please rephrase that command.
LORDDEMANDRED
Re: I'm curious
08/28/2020 07:25 PM CDT
Wait what? We can't? Isn't that like, THE core redux skill?
GS4-NAIJIN
Re: I'm curious
08/29/2020 08:39 AM CDT
> Wait what? We can't? Isn't that like, THE core redux skill?
Rogues are indeed squares but they are not as hardy (as indicated by 2x PF) as Warriors/Monks, or even Empaths. They are also more focused on dispatching enemies one on one (as indicated by their MoC costs), much like Rangers who have similar MoC costs.
Rogues are indeed squares but they are not as hardy (as indicated by 2x PF) as Warriors/Monks, or even Empaths. They are also more focused on dispatching enemies one on one (as indicated by their MoC costs), much like Rangers who have similar MoC costs.
THROGG
Re: I'm curious
08/30/2020 03:13 PM CDT
>"much like Rangers who have similar MoC costs."<
Ha, ha, ha! You are having a little joke, yes?
High level Rangers don't NEED weapon MOC. Ever seen a Ranger clear out a room with Nature's Fury? Rogues have nothing even resembling that.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
Ha, ha, ha! You are having a little joke, yes?
High level Rangers don't NEED weapon MOC. Ever seen a Ranger clear out a room with Nature's Fury? Rogues have nothing even resembling that.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
OM1E5GA
Re: I'm curious
08/30/2020 03:37 PM CDT
<Ever seen a Ranger clear out a room with Nature's Fury? Rogues have nothing even resembling that.>
Divert is a rogue's crowd control. They aren't meant to take on large groups, they're meant to take down single targets or small groups quickly.
A rogue's skills are centered around taking advantage of weaknesses and creating those weaknesses when necessary. Sure there's room for improvement for rogues, but I never did understand the tendency to push for professions to have the abilities of other professions. If the hunting style of a warrior or ranger appeals more, play that profession instead.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
Divert is a rogue's crowd control. They aren't meant to take on large groups, they're meant to take down single targets or small groups quickly.
A rogue's skills are centered around taking advantage of weaknesses and creating those weaknesses when necessary. Sure there's room for improvement for rogues, but I never did understand the tendency to push for professions to have the abilities of other professions. If the hunting style of a warrior or ranger appeals more, play that profession instead.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
THROGG
Re: I'm curious
08/30/2020 08:17 PM CDT
>"If the hunting style of a warrior or ranger appeals more, play that profession instead."<
Oh, I do; I have 9 characters, 4 of them capped. My rogue is actually my favorite, especially from an RP standpoint. But she's not nearly as vicious in combat as my spell casters,
however. Although I have worked to change that around a bit by giving her spells. She's up to 425 at this point.
>"Divert is a rogue's crowd control."<
I have tried this; it doesn't work that well in swarmy areas. I divert something from the room, and 2 seconds later it or some other creature wanders back in.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
Oh, I do; I have 9 characters, 4 of them capped. My rogue is actually my favorite, especially from an RP standpoint. But she's not nearly as vicious in combat as my spell casters,
however. Although I have worked to change that around a bit by giving her spells. She's up to 425 at this point.
>"Divert is a rogue's crowd control."<
I have tried this; it doesn't work that well in swarmy areas. I divert something from the room, and 2 seconds later it or some other creature wanders back in.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
THROGG
Re: I'm curious
08/30/2020 09:01 PM CDT
Also, if Divert i supposed to be a rogue's "crowd control", how about having a mass version that affects multiple targets? It could be made available once you had 3 (or more) ranks of the individual version, and cost more stamina.
And why is there a bonus to divert for high charisma? I'd say maybe Wisdom would be a better choice. It shouldn't matter how likable you are, success should depend on
your mental acuity to devise an appropriate ruse.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
And why is there a bonus to divert for high charisma? I'd say maybe Wisdom would be a better choice. It shouldn't matter how likable you are, success should depend on
your mental acuity to devise an appropriate ruse.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
KRAKII
Re: I'm curious
08/31/2020 08:44 AM CDT
"how about having a mass [Divert] version that affects multiple targets?" -- Throgg
shout Look over there!!!
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<flee!>
shout Look over there!!!
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<flee!>
THROGG
Re: I'm curious
08/31/2020 06:34 PM CDT
>"shout Look over there!!!"<
Thbbbp!
Seriously; how does Divert work? I am tossing a rock into the next room, or throwing my voice to create a distraction, or some such ruse. All the critters in the room should be aware of what I have done. Hence, it is not unreasonable to have more than one of them react to the stimulus.
If you don't want o go to the trouble of creating a separate CMan, just give the current version the ability to affect more than one target. The chance to do so would increase the more ranks you have in the skill.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
Thbbbp!
Seriously; how does Divert work? I am tossing a rock into the next room, or throwing my voice to create a distraction, or some such ruse. All the critters in the room should be aware of what I have done. Hence, it is not unreasonable to have more than one of them react to the stimulus.
If you don't want o go to the trouble of creating a separate CMan, just give the current version the ability to affect more than one target. The chance to do so would increase the more ranks you have in the skill.
"So, what does that green line on the graph represent?"
"Oh, that's the projection of a hypothetical offspring from a union between Sauron and Cruella de Ville;
we use that as a baseline for determining character alignment."
