PRENTICE1
Shield vs Runestaff
01/03/2021 04:34 PM CST
Ok I currently have a 6x medium shield and have zero understanding of the runestaff. Here is the stats I have as of now
Maygog (at level 95), your current skill bonuses and ranks (including all modifiers) are:
Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 120 30
Shield Use.........................| 196 96
Combat Maneuvers...................| 99 23
Physical Fitness...................| 215 115
Dodging............................| 196 96
Magic Item Use.....................| 90 20
Harness Power......................| 279 179
Spirit Mana Control................| 120 30
Spiritual Lore - Blessings.........| 82 18
Spiritual Lore - Summoning.........| 182 82
Survival...........................| 170 70
Perception.........................| 196 96
Climbing...........................| 130 35
Swimming...........................| 130 35
First Aid..........................| 141 41
Trading............................| 5 1
Spell Lists
Minor Spiritual....................| 30
Spell Lists
Ranger.............................| 95
Is there a benefit for me to consider switching to a runestaff and pass me some knowledge. Thanks all.
OM1E5GA
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/03/2021 09:30 PM CST
<Is there a benefit for me to consider switching to a runestaff and pass me some knowledge. Thanks all.>
I would DEFINITELY log into the test server and try a few hunts there before trying to switch to runestaffs. If you're just thinking about it for RP or style reasons, that's a good way to experiment before committing to a fixskills.
At the moment, you have about 4.7 ranks/level in magical skills and the recommended minimum is 8... and I'm pretty you won't be able to close that gap until after you reach cap even if you drop both Shield Use and Dodging. If you wanna play around with your training to check, the following skills contribute to runestaff defense: Arcane Symbols, Harness Power, Magic Item Use, Spell Aiming, Spell Research, Mana Controls, Lores.
If you're having trouble with your defenses, adding Perception would be the cheapest way to increase your SMR defenses... or you can pick up ranks in Brawling to open up Parry DS with your empty hand. Getting a pair of enchanted UAC gloves and wearing them wouldn't hurt either.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
I would DEFINITELY log into the test server and try a few hunts there before trying to switch to runestaffs. If you're just thinking about it for RP or style reasons, that's a good way to experiment before committing to a fixskills.
At the moment, you have about 4.7 ranks/level in magical skills and the recommended minimum is 8... and I'm pretty you won't be able to close that gap until after you reach cap even if you drop both Shield Use and Dodging. If you wanna play around with your training to check, the following skills contribute to runestaff defense: Arcane Symbols, Harness Power, Magic Item Use, Spell Aiming, Spell Research, Mana Controls, Lores.
If you're having trouble with your defenses, adding Perception would be the cheapest way to increase your SMR defenses... or you can pick up ranks in Brawling to open up Parry DS with your empty hand. Getting a pair of enchanted UAC gloves and wearing them wouldn't hurt either.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
LIQUIDWOLF
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/03/2021 11:27 PM CST
<<Is there a benefit for me to consider switching to a runestaff and pass me some knowledge. Thanks all.
The benefit to the runestaff would be the ability to parry things. If you were to drop the shield and only have a runestaff, your raw DS would probably suffer some. Using a runestaff, precap @4-5ish magic ranks, gives you around the same raw DS as UCS depending on gear. Another benefit to consider is flares on a runestaff, which since our spells have been converted, acuity would help directly to the endrolls, etc. That being said, unless something has changed that I'm unaware of [extremely possible], you could go shield/staff with no change to your build.
The benefit to the runestaff would be the ability to parry things. If you were to drop the shield and only have a runestaff, your raw DS would probably suffer some. Using a runestaff, precap @4-5ish magic ranks, gives you around the same raw DS as UCS depending on gear. Another benefit to consider is flares on a runestaff, which since our spells have been converted, acuity would help directly to the endrolls, etc. That being said, unless something has changed that I'm unaware of [extremely possible], you could go shield/staff with no change to your build.
RATHBONER
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/04/2021 12:23 AM CST
You will lose defence. The equivalent to the pure's at least 8 ranks/level is at least 25 ranks/level for a semi or square. 8 ranks on a pure isn't a completely stupid thing to aim for, but 25 ranks on a semi is. (It is fairly stupid to aim for 8 even on a pure though, 4 and 11 ranks per level are breakpoints in the formula, but 8 isn't)
Runestaff defence is great as long as its free. If you haven't got enough DS, adding training for runestaff is the worst way to improve it.
If you have spare DS in your current training, you may not miss it. If you don't, you will find it hard to compensate with the TPs from losing shield. You can add AS and MIU because you intend to compensate by using more items and scrolls, but they aren't worth it to increase runestaff defence.
The main gain will be whatever fancy script you have on your runestaff. Scripts for runestaffs are far more powerful than scripts for shields.
>I would DEFINITELY log into the test server and try a few hunts there before trying to switch to runestaffs.
This. If you find its marginal on a basic runestaff there, it'll be gravy when you buy a decent staff.
Runestaff defence is great as long as its free. If you haven't got enough DS, adding training for runestaff is the worst way to improve it.
If you have spare DS in your current training, you may not miss it. If you don't, you will find it hard to compensate with the TPs from losing shield. You can add AS and MIU because you intend to compensate by using more items and scrolls, but they aren't worth it to increase runestaff defence.
The main gain will be whatever fancy script you have on your runestaff. Scripts for runestaffs are far more powerful than scripts for shields.
>I would DEFINITELY log into the test server and try a few hunts there before trying to switch to runestaffs.
This. If you find its marginal on a basic runestaff there, it'll be gravy when you buy a decent staff.
KRAKII
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/04/2021 09:00 AM CST
It's also cheaper to Enchant just one item (runestaff to 7x) than two (weapon & shield); obviously this doesn't apply if you were Ranged or 2Hand.
The benefit of being able to possibly Parry bolt/ball attacks--which is not normally possible for weapon users, barring some CMan [I think]--is a possible extra bonus.
Rathboner, where are you getting 25 ranks/level for a semi? "Equivalent DS" (to a singled 2Hand user) from runestaff ranks happens at 8 ranks/level, period.
Now, where the pure spellcaster shines is in being able to GET a lot more magical ranks (cheaper costs/rank), OR a lot more spells (more trainings available). But 8 ranks is 8 ranks.
But a Ranger who is singling in a bunch of magical ranks can still be getting CM and Dodging ranks a whole heap less expensively than those spellcasters, so there's a fine leg up, there.
The benefit of being able to possibly Parry bolt/ball attacks--which is not normally possible for weapon users, barring some CMan [I think]--is a possible extra bonus.
Rathboner, where are you getting 25 ranks/level for a semi? "Equivalent DS" (to a singled 2Hand user) from runestaff ranks happens at 8 ranks/level, period.
Now, where the pure spellcaster shines is in being able to GET a lot more magical ranks (cheaper costs/rank), OR a lot more spells (more trainings available). But 8 ranks is 8 ranks.
But a Ranger who is singling in a bunch of magical ranks can still be getting CM and Dodging ranks a whole heap less expensively than those spellcasters, so there's a fine leg up, there.
OM1E5GA
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/04/2021 10:25 AM CST
<But a Ranger who is singling in a bunch of magical ranks can still be getting CM and Dodging ranks a whole heap less expensively than those spellcasters, so there's a fine leg up, there.>
After playing around in the skills manager, my level 64 ranger could get the required training for both a runestaff and 1x in either Dodging or CM, but not both.... and she'd have to give up skills that (to me) make rangers fun, like S&H.
A dedicated weed mage could prolly do it without batting an eye... but I'd still try it on the test server first. When there aren't a lot of people doing something in GS, there's usually a pretty good reason for it... no matter how good it looks on paper.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
After playing around in the skills manager, my level 64 ranger could get the required training for both a runestaff and 1x in either Dodging or CM, but not both.... and she'd have to give up skills that (to me) make rangers fun, like S&H.
A dedicated weed mage could prolly do it without batting an eye... but I'd still try it on the test server first. When there aren't a lot of people doing something in GS, there's usually a pretty good reason for it... no matter how good it looks on paper.
Starchitin, the OG
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
KRAKII
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/04/2021 12:11 PM CST
What use is S&H, if you're a spell-slinger?
(Just asking, because I can't figure one out. Ambush adds don't work with spells... unless they've changed something, and I didn't hear about it)
(Just asking, because I can't figure one out. Ambush adds don't work with spells... unless they've changed something, and I didn't hear about it)
RATHBONER
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/04/2021 02:38 PM CST
>Rathboner, where are you getting 25 ranks/level for a semi? "Equivalent DS" (to a singled 2Hand user) from runestaff ranks happens at 8 ranks/level, period.
Only pures 1x weapons. Equivalence for 2x THW is at least 25 magic ranks.
Only pures 1x weapons. Equivalence for 2x THW is at least 25 magic ranks.
ECROCKEN
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/06/2021 03:43 PM CST
<<What use is S&H, if you're a spell-slinger?
I will always have S&H, simply for the RP aspect. That's enough of a reason, IMO.
A few other things:
I don't quite understand the logic of EVOKING 601 at a cost of 11 mana for a single cast opposed to CASTING it. Unless you are in a group of 11+ people, it's more mana efficient to cast it on each individual. After 11 trainings, is it feasible to have EVOKE cost 1 mana +1 mana/person in their group, capped at 11 mana?
Limiting the benefits of Barkskin (605) to one instance every five minutes makes this spell an afterthought. I won't use it, unless I know the next attack from a creature is going to land, and I know I'm scooting off right afterwards. Currently, this spell is the one I will use the least (Another 620). If the cool-off time was lowered, I would use it more often.
Otherwise, I'm LOVING the changes and look forward to figuring out how everything works together! Thanks for the love!
~EC
I will always have S&H, simply for the RP aspect. That's enough of a reason, IMO.
A few other things:
I don't quite understand the logic of EVOKING 601 at a cost of 11 mana for a single cast opposed to CASTING it. Unless you are in a group of 11+ people, it's more mana efficient to cast it on each individual. After 11 trainings, is it feasible to have EVOKE cost 1 mana +1 mana/person in their group, capped at 11 mana?
Limiting the benefits of Barkskin (605) to one instance every five minutes makes this spell an afterthought. I won't use it, unless I know the next attack from a creature is going to land, and I know I'm scooting off right afterwards. Currently, this spell is the one I will use the least (Another 620). If the cool-off time was lowered, I would use it more often.
Otherwise, I'm LOVING the changes and look forward to figuring out how everything works together! Thanks for the love!
~EC
KRAKII
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/06/2021 04:19 PM CST
Okay, I'm totally down with "character decisions because that's what this character DOES." Been there, done that, got the sub-optimal training path. :)
As long as we recognize that "more power is possible" if we're not doing S&H, so "not enough spell power" complaints have the appropriate note.
As long as we recognize that "more power is possible" if we're not doing S&H, so "not enough spell power" complaints have the appropriate note.
CAELRIC
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/06/2021 04:23 PM CST
>I don't quite understand the logic of EVOKING 601 at a cost of 11 mana for a single cast opposed to CASTING it.
Saves a lot of time if you are doing this for 2 or more people. And it higher levels, mana is not really a concern. Also, massies in TSC.
Saves a lot of time if you are doing this for 2 or more people. And it higher levels, mana is not really a concern. Also, massies in TSC.
LIQUIDWOLF
Re: Shield vs Runestaff
01/06/2021 11:13 PM CST
<<Limiting the benefits of Barkskin (605) to one instance every five minutes makes this spell an afterthought. I won't use it, unless I know the next attack from a creature is going to land, and I know I'm scooting off right afterwards.
The COMMUNE version I find useful. I added to my Transcendence macro, and the combination has already saved my life a couple of times to 917.
The COMMUNE version I find useful. I added to my Transcendence macro, and the combination has already saved my life a couple of times to 917.
