Aiming bug 12/10/2016 07:21 AM CST
I'm getting TWC messages when aiming, despite having no TWC training and using blunt and shield.

Failure to find an opening for off-hand strike.
Failure to find an opening for right hand strike.

Double messaging when critter is missing a body part.
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Re: Aiming bug 12/10/2016 11:20 PM CST
>I'm getting TWC messages when aiming, despite having no TWC training and using blunt and shield.

We typically need more details than this to go bug hunting. At a minimum, the location and foe engaged, and far better is a short log including a snapshot of the room, plus a character name.
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Re: Aiming bug 12/11/2016 06:01 AM CST
I believe character details are stored on the BUG I submitted.

Missed opening messages are against cerebralites (which as a giant I expect to get, but one handed messaging for 5s RT, not TWC messaging for 10s RT)
Double lacking body part messaging is against rift crawlers.

Plane 4 is the only place I've seen it, but is also the only place I normally see missing body part and missed opening messages. This week was also the first time I've been there in a few months.

Log clip with a few identifying details redacted (note that commands input by SF buttons do not get echoed so do not appear, my first swing is using the SF attack button and the second the SF ambush button to aim at the head)

...

[The Rift]
Lava boils over the ground, leaving you only narrow trails to walk between the streams of molten stone. Sticking out from the liquid rock are grasping hands, seeking assistance although surely the people they are attached to are dead. Suddenly, a body erupts from the magma. A scream of agony tears from its lips before the roiling river drags it back under. You also see the XXX disk and a glistening cerebralite.
Obvious exits: northeast, southeast
YYY followed.
>unsheath
>stance off
>wtr feint
...
You are now in an offensive stance.
[Roll result: 165 (open d100: 49) Bonus: 16]
You feint high, the glistening cerebralite buys the ruse and twists awkwardly to block the blow that never came!
Roundtime: 3 sec.
You swing ... at a glistening cerebralite!
A translucent shell appears around the cerebralite, absorbing most of the blow.
AS: +581 vs DS: +360 with AvD: +31 + d100 roll: +37 = +289
... and hit for 80 points of damage!
The glistening cerebralite is stunned!
A dark shadowy tendril rises up from a glistening cerebralite, writhes its way up a perfect mithril morning-star towards you and lashes out malevolently...
CS: +415 - TD: +387 + CvA: -26 + d100: +87 == +89
Warded off!
Nothing happens.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
YYY swings ... at a glistening cerebralite!
A translucent shell appears around the cerebralite, absorbing most of the blow.
AS: +574 vs DS: +333 with AvD: +40 + d100 roll: +20 = +301
... and hits for 132 points of damage!
A dark shadowy tendril rises up from a glistening cerebralite, writhes its way up a perfect vultite greataxe with vaalin-threaded silk wound about its haft towards YYY and lashes out malevolently...
CS: +415 - TD: +386 + CvA: -21 + d100: +88 - -5 == +101
Warding failed!
YYY cringes in pain.
... 38 points of damage!
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 10 sec.
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Re: Aiming bug 12/11/2016 07:42 AM CST
Here's another

[Icemule Trace, Forest]
The path curves to avoid a fir tree so wide you cannot stretch your arms even halfway around it. The remaining trees around it seem dwarfed by its immense size, although they, too, tower high above you. You also see a rabid squirrel and a rabid squirrel.
Obvious paths: north, southwest
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 10 sec.

Interestingly, when I put my shield away and just have an empty left hand, it works

[Icemule Trace, Hillside]
A narrow trail disappears into a thick tangle of evergreens. Small icicles cling to the bare limbs of a maple tree at the edge of the path. An unnatural chittering further up the hillside breaks the snowy silence. You also see a rabid squirrel.
Obvious paths: east, up
>
You swing a perfect mithril morning-star at a rabid squirrel!
AS: +499 vs DS: +29 with AvD: +36 + d100 roll: +72 = +578
... and hit for 250 points of damage!
Strike through eye, the rabid squirrel is lobotomized!
The rabid squirrel twitches its tail one last time and dies.
Roundtime: 6 sec.
R>
A rabid squirrel scampers in!
R>
...wait 1 seconds.
R>
You fail to find an opening for your strike.
Roundtime: 5 sec.
R>

...

When I have a blunt in both hands (and wouldn't fail to find openings at all normally)

[Icemule Trace, Forest]
The lowest branches of the trees have been cut away, allowing visibility further into the woods. Beyond the first row of pines you can see the dark boles of another row of trees. You also see a kobold and a kobold.
Obvious paths: northeast, east
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.

You are unable to find an opening for your left-handed strike.

Roundtime: 12 sec.

...

Similar when I have a skinning knife (untrained OHE) in my left hand

[Icemule Trace, Forest]
The path curves to avoid a fir tree so wide you cannot stretch your arms even halfway around it. The remaining trees around it seem dwarfed by its immense size, although they, too, tower high above you. You also see a kobold.
Obvious paths: north, southwest
>
You swing a perfect mithril morning-star at a kobold!
AS: +499 vs DS: +68 with AvD: +38 + d100 roll: +29 = +498
... and hit for 162 points of damage!
Knocked back several feet by blow to abdomen.
The kobold crumples to a heap on the ground and dies.
Roundtime: 6 sec.
R>
A kobold just arrived.
R>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.

You are unable to find an opening for your left-handed strike.

Roundtime: 10 sec.

...

When I have some powdered iron filings in my left hand

[Icemule Trace, Forest]
A low, snow-covered branch juts into the pathway, causing you to duck your head to pass beneath it. The ground beneath the trees is matted with fallen pine needles and traces of snow. Small tracks lead off the main path, but disappear without a trace into the woods. You also see a kobold.
Obvious paths: north, south
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 10 sec.
R>

...

and when I have a monir strongbox in my left hand

[Icemule Trace, Forest]
The air is still, heavy with the closeness of the spruce and fir trees. The movement of a bird or squirrel high above in the trees sends a cascade of snow from the upper branches down onto the path. You also see a rolton, a kobold, some light leather, a short sword, a reinforced shield and a short sword.
Obvious paths: north, south, west
>
A rolton tries to bite you!
AS: +36 vs DS: +187 with AvD: +7 + d100 roll: +18 = -126
A clean miss.
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 10 sec.

....
switching to a different blunt (still with the box in the other hand)

[Icemule Trace, Hillside]
Evergreens crowd the trail, making it difficult to see very far ahead. Despite the closeness of the trees, the air is refreshed by the chill breeze flowing down from the top of the hill. You also see a rabid squirrel.
Obvious paths: up, down
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 9 sec.
R>

...

UAC works normally (kicking with a the box still in hand)

[Icemule Trace, Forest]
The air is still, heavy with the closeness of the spruce and fir trees. The movement of a bird or squirrel high above in the trees sends a cascade of snow from the upper branches down onto the path. You also see a rabid squirrel, some light leather, a reinforced shield, a short sword, some light leather, a reinforced shield, some light leather and a reinforced shield.
Obvious paths: north, south, west
>
A rabid squirrel nips at you!
AS: +46 vs DS: +185 with AvD: +2 + d100 roll: +77 = -60
A clean miss.
>
You make a precise attempt to kick a rabid squirrel!
You fail to find an opening for your strike.
Roundtime: 5 sec.

...

Swinging with a brawling weapon doesn't.

[Icemule Trace, Hillside]
A narrow trail disappears into a thick tangle of evergreens. Small icicles cling to the bare limbs of a maple tree at the edge of the path. An unnatural chittering further up the hillside breaks the snowy silence. You also see a rabid squirrel, a rabid squirrel that appears dead and a rabid squirrel that appears dead.
Obvious paths: east, up
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 6 sec.

...

That's all the configurations I can think of trying.

Back in normal shield/blunt configuration for a double messaging clip.

[Frozen Bramble Patch]
The shrub has been hacked and cleaved here, a rusted longsword leaning against the growth. Whoever attempted to clear a path failed miserably however, the snow-dusted skeleton evidence of the attempt. You also see a writhing icy bush.
Obvious paths: southwest, northwest
>
You're now aiming at the neck of your target when using a ranged weapon, or while ambushing.
>
You cannot bearhug a writhing icy bush.
>
The icy bush does not have a neck!
The icy bush does not have a neck!



...
and since getting that clip cost me a head major off a critter I have something like 60 levels on, I didn't hang around for more checks on the messaging.
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Re: Aiming bug 12/11/2016 03:26 PM CST
I get the same bug if I try and open ambush when I have forgotten to stow a crystal weapon off a scout. Awl-pike right, sword left, bigger RT than expected for just ambushing the pike.

Sweet is the sound of the pouring rain,
And the stream that falls from the hill to plain.
Better than rain or rippling brook,
Is a mug of beer inside this Took.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/22/2017 12:48 PM CDT
I've been noticing a 10s RT on failed ambushes, I thought there was a change in the last couple months I was gone. Axe/Shield. I'll see if I can pull some up and contribute.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/22/2017 12:55 PM CDT
Here we go. Character name is Appoloin.

[Darkstone, Dungeon]
The cool, damp air is stale and difficult to breathe. Torches flicker with an unsteady light, threatening to plunge you into utter darkness. Now and then one flares unexpectedly, fraying your taut nerves just a bit more. You also see a stone sentinel, an intense shimmering circle and a broken iron door.
Obvious exits: north, south
>amb
You swing a hefty mithril handaxe at a stone sentinel!
AS: +159 vs DS: +87 with AvD: +25 + d100 roll: +9 = +106
... and hit for 1 point of damage!
Quick feint to the stone sentinel's right foot.
Little extra damage.
Roundtime: 6 sec.
>
The walls and floors creak under some gigantic weight as a loud, shrill whistle nearby causes you to hold your head in agony.
>
A stone sentinel sings a lilting melody in a strange but beautiful language.
>
* Taegok is going home on his shield!
>amb
You swing a hefty mithril handaxe at a stone sentinel!
By amazing chance, the stone sentinel evades the attack!
Roundtime: 6 sec.
>
A stone sentinel points at you!
>amb
The ground begins to shake violently, making it hard to stand.
You lose your balance and fall over.
>
You fail to find an opening for your right-handed strike.
Roundtime: 10 sec.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/22/2017 02:58 PM CDT
I noticed the same thing with my warrior when she was swinging her morning star the other day. At the time I figured it was just a fluke she got almost double her normal RT for failing to find an opening (like how my ranger or rogue 9-10sec on a failed hide attempt once in a blue moon). Now this has me wondering, though.

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/22/2017 05:33 PM CDT

could it be because you tried to aim while lying down?


Clunk

(Buy your swords at CBD weapons in Zul Logoth.)
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Re: Aiming bug 03/23/2017 07:00 AM CDT
Finros said it likely won't be fixed which is a right pain because the Rift has been unhuntable for about 6 months so far as a result of it and will likely remain that way for about 10 years (the time it'll take me to get far enough post cap to make Plane 4 trivial)

If you aren't trained well enough for the aimed shot (and giants can't be well enough trained because the skill caps before the too big penalty is trained away), and are using a shield, you are treated as if you were making a two weapon attack and given double RT for missing an opening with the shield as well as your main weapon.

>could it be because you tried to aim while lying down?

This will contribute to not being well enough trained to avoid missed openings, but you take 10s on a missed opening if you are using a shield regardless.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/23/2017 07:44 AM CDT
> Finros said it likely won't be fixed...

QQ

Glad I started training up ambush to help with open aiming.

> and giants can't be well enough trained because the skill caps before the too big penalty is trained away

Glad I picked a human for my paladin, if I ever make a giant, THW only.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/23/2017 02:29 PM CDT
Thanks for posting that, Rathboner, it will be good for me to keep in mind as my giantman warrior levels up since she uses a greatshield. In her early 40's, she doesn't NEED to aim her blows with most of what she's hunting, but I know it'll become more important later.

Good thing she already has a strong focus on cmans and shield maneuvers so I'll be able to disable most anything I have trouble hitting the head/neck of...

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/24/2017 09:47 AM CDT
>Thanks for posting that, Rathboner, it will be good for me to keep in mind as my giantman warrior levels up since she uses a greatshield. In her early 40's, she doesn't NEED to aim her blows with most of what she's hunting, but I know it'll become more important later.

Its only critters that are too small that you can't train sufficiently for. They are relatively few and far between, and I can't think of any I came across before cap that really have to be aimed at. Around your level there are mud wasps which can be taken out reasonably easily without aiming, and while 10s standing in front of a sand devil is a really bad idea, an extra 5s for a mud wasp to act is more of an annoyance. At cap its cerebralites, and giving them an extra 5s on a whiff is a really bad idea, as is using mstrike on them without enough TD make their Pain retributions autofail.
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Re: Aiming bug 03/24/2017 01:35 PM CDT
<<round your level there are mud wasps which can be taken out reasonably easily without aiming, and while 10s standing in front of a sand devil is a really bad idea, an extra 5s for a mud wasp to act is more of an annoyance.>>

Yea, I did those for a while with my sorcerer. I'm going to stick with Oteska's Haven for a couple more levels before moving on to the Keep, though. I COULD do the Keep now, but the lowest level critter there uses 712 and makes it more of a headache then it's worth for now.

I'm still trying to get her through Voln too, so I want at least one critter that's undead where ever I hunt to keep progress moving along.

Starchitin

A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
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Re: Aiming bug 04/26/2017 02:13 PM CDT
This is pretty severe bug to leave out there when time matters in the arena at duskruin. Especially when you pay for each attempt. It has also cost me a few deeds in the scatter.
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