I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 05:43 PM CST
Dusted off the bard. Last played before the Voln and UAC revisions, so I FIXSKILL'd to a polearm user.

Stats and skills:

Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 78 17
Combat Maneuvers...................| 78 17
Polearm Weapons....................| 128 34
Physical Fitness...................| 78 17
Dodging............................| 78 17
Harness Power......................| 74 16
Elemental Lore - Air...............| 78 17
Mental Lore - Telepathy............| 35 7
Perception.........................| 78 17
Climbing...........................| 50 10
Swimming...........................| 25 5

Spell Lists
Minor Elemental....................| 1

Spell Lists
Bard...............................| 16

Race: Sylvankind Profession: Bard (not shown)
Gender: Male
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 80 (15) ... 80 (15)
Constitution (CON): 60 (5) ... 60 (5)
Dexterity (DEX): 68 (19) ... 68 (19)
Agility (AGI): 77 (18) ... 77 (18)
Discipline (DIS): 77 (8) ... 77 (8)
Aura (AUR): 98 (29) ... 98 (29)
Logic (LOG): 67 (8) ... 67 (8)
Intuition (INT): 47 (-1) ... 47 (-1)
Wisdom (WIS): 47 (-1) ... 47 (-1)
Influence (INF): 97 (23) ... 97 (23)

I'm thrusting a lance at 7 seconds, which really doesn't seem like a good idea. I only need one extra point of AGI or DEX to get it down to six, though. My big concern is that my DS seems to be terrible. If I don't dodge or parry, the odds are too high of getting hit, even in defensive. Is that just what happens with newer polearm users?
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 06:49 PM CST
Song of Valor keeps growing for DS (and also mana cost) as you learn more songs, and you're just a couple away from Mirrors, too. (Which will help with the E[vade] part of EBP.)

Make sure that you are not over-armored.

And yes, with your AGI/DEX stats being 55 points/28 bonus away from cap, that's nearly two seconds of additional removed RT still in your future. Lances are slow. <shrug>
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 07:18 PM CST
So stop whining and stick it out?

LBP right now; cuirbolli next rank.
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 07:32 PM CST
Generally speaking, the two-hand pole arms are going to hit pretty hard. Have you considered using something faster, like a halberd or naginata?
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 09:15 PM CST
So, some random thoughts from my end to add to the pile.

First, for the RT, you should be able to swing a hammer of kai (or jeddart-axe) in 5 seconds. A naginata would give you some room for being encumbered as it is a slightly faster weapon... but I would avoid halberds. A plain unechanted halberd is basically a -4x (yes, negative 4x) nagi. Regardless of what you decide, any two handed weapon is going to hit significantly harder than a falchion or axe so don't be afraid to pick up a quicker one and give it a go.

For the defense, are you are using some form of rigid leather that's 4x enchant and are you running 1003 and 1010 all the time? If so your pretty much stuck with what you've got. You do have the option to use a spear or trident with a one handed grip while using a shield if you want to adjust your training a bit, but at that point your basically OHE user that's spending extra TP's to gain some flexibility. Your best bet if you don't want to do something in that vein may be to drop your air lore, pick up some MIU, and learn to love small statues as well as the whatever other imbeds you can get your hands on. Outside spells from any source could be a boon for you.

Tal, player of.
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 09:20 PM CST
>Generally speaking, the two-hand pole arms are going to hit pretty hard. Have you considered using something faster, like a halberd or naginata?

I am now! As far as the DS goes: Is that normal to be low without outside help, and does it get better over time? Or am I hoping songs like mirrors helps me avoid the attack altogether?
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/06/2016 10:08 PM CST
Here's my low level bard that swings polearms. I do pretty good with him. I do rely on finding a kind wizard to provide elementals, strength and thurfel's. I go without blurs and colors for the most part.
I run around with the spells from a wizard, 1003, 1010 and 1014 running. I also get help from an unamed society for an extra 35 DS. I do pretty good out there. I've surprisingly put a shan cleric to sleep using lullaby that recently popped to my location at the lake in Solhaven. It gets a tad hectic out there so I don't hunt it very often yet.

Skill Name | Current Current
| Bonus Ranks
Armor Use..........................| 96 22
Combat Maneuvers...................| 96 22
Polearm Weapons....................| 144 44
Multi Opponent Combat..............| 70 15
Physical Fitness...................| 96 22
Dodging............................| 96 22
Harness Power......................| 96 22
Mental Lore - Manipulation.........| 96 22

Spell Lists
Bard...............................| 23

Yeah, don't ask me why I have 23 bard songs, I don't remember the reasoning behind me wanting to have so many and why I only focused on bard songs. I started this character roughly 2 years ago and I don't remember my reasoning behind these choices. I do plan on getting myself 2 more ranks in Armor Use so I hit 24 for maneuver penalty on studded leather. I want to free up points to throw into EL:A. You know, I noticed I'm missing out on Climbing - I should pick up 10 ranks as soon as I can.

Race: Erithian Profession: Bard (not shown)
Gender: Male Age: 0 Expr: 531459 Level: 21
Normal (Bonus) ... Enhanced (Bonus)
Strength (STR): 77 (8) ... 77 (8)
Constitution (CON): 67 (18) ... 67 (18)
Dexterity (DEX): 70 (10) ... 70 (10)
Agility (AGI): 77 (13) ... 77 (13)
Discipline (DIS): 85 (22) ... 85 (22)
Aura (AUR): 87 (18) ... 87 (18)
Logic (LOG): 55 (7) ... 55 (7)
Intuition (INT): 57 (3) ... 57 (3)
Wisdom (WIS): 67 (8) ... 67 (8)
Influence (INF): 90 (30) ... 90 (30)
Mana: 66 Silver: 453

My DEX and AGI are a bit low, but I swing a 4x acid flaring naginata and right now it does pretty well. 5 second RT and it hits hard enough. I also have 3 ranks in CMAN TRIP in case something turtles, I have a pretty decent shot to putting it to its knees or on its back.

I kind of have a slightly odd build going on right now, but I'm managing just fine. Make sure you get elemental spells (401, 406 & 414) and strength cast on you when you can. If you can manage blurs, colors and thrufel's - even better! Always keep up 1003 and 1010 and if you're not in a society, fine one that suits your needs so you can make use of the society skills that help boost your DS. One last thing, when I'm in a pinch or I have to hunt a very dangerous creature, I keep a couple small statues on me for that extra +20 to the DS.

Keep at it, you'll find things improve. Just get those few extra things to help boost your DS and you'll do just fine.

-Drumpel
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/07/2016 07:49 AM CST
Drumpel, with a 30 INFluence bonus you should be regularly able to sleep things in the high-20s/low-30s.
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/08/2016 12:00 PM CST
Hi there, good to see some old bards getting dusted off and trotted back out to the battlefield.

To the first poster, I think you'll find bards are not nearly as self-sufficient as other professions early on, I always got outside spells colors, blurs, and guards before hunting. There's no shame in getting some outside magic, a white crystal and a statue rub goes a long way if you want to rough it. Looking at your training plan. I would probably flip the air and telepathy lore ranks early on for the increased song duration and extra +1 or 2 AS from Kai's Triumph (1007). Another tactic I used was to swing from advance or forward stance, it helped me be less reliant on successful stance dancing, and I generally had way more AS than necessary to hit like level targets.

Drumpel given how high your influence bonus is, and the fact that you solely focused on songs, it seems like perhaps you were trying to make your bard songs as powerful as possible? Your 1002 with 1x manipulation lore should guarantee nothing you fight has a weapon or shield for long. And as Krakii pointed out your lullabye (1005) should be very reliable, and when you do get to 1025 its AS should be very respectable with your extra manipulation ranks, 1x cman, and 2x polearm weapon training.

Archales
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/08/2016 01:56 PM CST
Drumpel given how high your influence bonus is, and the fact that you solely focused on songs, it seems like perhaps you were trying to make your bard songs as powerful as possible? Your 1002 with 1x manipulation lore should guarantee nothing you fight has a weapon or shield for long. And as Krakii pointed out your lullabye (1005) should be very reliable, and when you do get to 1025 its AS should be very respectable with your extra manipulation ranks, 1x cman, and 2x polearm weapon training.
Archales


That seems like a very plausible reasoning behind my bard's training. I know he's rather fun to run around and and shatter shields/weapons and put things to sleep while while I crush them with my naginata.

I don't have a planned training path for him anywhere that I can find in my saved files - I have a file saved on each character with their general outlined training path, but not for him. So I'm not entirely sure what my true intentions were with him. Based on his skills and such, I think maybe I wanted to train him to be able to stand his ground (considering he's got 15 ranks of MOC) against multiple foes without faltering. He's half way to a 2 hit focused MOC strike, I may as well stay the course and hit 30 ranks of MOC. I suppose I'll just see where my fingers take his training over the next 5-10 levels.

Hopefully VICIMER is able to overcome any current shortfallings for his bard's DS issues and get out there and keeps swinging.

-Drumpel
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Re: I Think I Suck 11/08/2016 02:02 PM CST
I guess I'll just load up on tinctures. Thanks, everyone.
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Re: I Think I Suck 01/30/2017 06:21 PM CST
Well, now that free stat re-allocations are given to anyone up to level 20, I find myself able to change stats. I feel like I loaded up too much on prime stats. I don't want to optimize at cap; I don't play him a ton. Thoughts?

>info start
Level 0 Stats for Coleraine, Sylvankind Bard

Strength (STR): 75
Constitution (CON): 55
Dexterity (DEX): 60
Agility (AGI): 70
Discipline (DIS): 75
Aura (AUR): 93
Logic (LOG): 65
Intuition (INT): 40
Wisdom (WIS): 38
Influence (INF): 89
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Re: I Think I Suck 01/31/2017 07:32 AM CST
Set the stats you want high for level 50ish, those that are still important to you for cap, and take the points to do it from the others.

These are the settings that just hit 100.

Strength (STR): 70
Constitution (CON): 77
Dexterity (DEX): 49
Agility (AGI): 62
Discipline (DIS): 88
Aura (AUR): 58
Logic (LOG): 88
Intuition (INT): 82
Wisdom (WIS): 73
Influence (INF): 33

I'd put INF between 70 and 80, and be wary about having any of the others higher than those values. I'm not sure where the best place to take the 60 or so that needs to go away from them would be though.
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Re: I Think I Suck 02/05/2017 01:46 PM CST
Here's what I'm looking at:

STR 80
CON 50
DEX 65
AGI 64
DIS 72
AUR 70
LOG 88
INT 41
WIS 60
INF 70


That's the minimum AGI/DEX to swing a pole at level 20. Losing some TPs in the short term, so I have to drop Perception to .5x.
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