Hi,
I hail originally from Dragonrealms, and I've been settling in lately trying to learn about the various races of GemStone. In DR, there is a really handy page that details some of the important aspects of the races in relation to each other:
https://www.play.net/dr/info/races/racecharts.asp
It shows things like charts of their relative heights, lifespans, and which races can interbreed (which, by the way, in DR always results in a pure-blood child of one race or the other). I have found the height/lifespan info but I am curious about the breeding, or if there is other general race information that is important to know about.
Is there such a thing as a quarter-elf? Does everybody ask this question? Please forgive me.
DIAGONALIZE
MOURNE
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 03:19 AM CDT
Re: breeding, there's a small amount of discussion of it in some racial documentation:
Half-elves are the product of human and elf (sylvankind, dark elf, or city elf). In the half-elf documentation, you'll find these tidbits:
So half-elves can breed with humans and elves and create quarter-elves and three-quarter elves, etc. Over the years when dicussion's been raised on the subject, it's generally been recommended that if you're planning to play a percentage that isn't strictly 100% or 50%, you should pick whatever race they're most likely to pass as (human, half-elf, or the particular type of elf).
Example of the second bit demonstrated in game is the Malwind family, that rules Vornavis. Baron Dunrith Malwind is a half-elf. His adult children pass for human. I'm not sure if it's been explicitly stated whether those quarter-elf children are experiencing an extended lifespan at all. And their kids may well look more elven:
One of my characters is a half-elf who I've made to look much older than he otherwise might, indicating he favors his human side and may be aging more quickly than a more balanced halfbreed. That's a reflection of this snippet of lore:
https://gswiki.play.net/Half-Elves:_From_Outsiders_to_Heroes
Krolvin can apparently conceive with humans, giantkin, elves and halflings, but the elf and halfling pregnancies were all miscarriages and the halflings, and most of the elves, died from it.
https://gswiki.play.net/Regarding_the_Half-Krolvin#The_Breeding_of_the_Half-Krolvin
I want to say these are the only places where it's explicitly called out who can breed with whom, but I haven't combed every racial document.
I personally operate under the assumption that any kind of elf can breed with any other kind of elf (and have interacted with a few played as elf mixes), but since there's no mechanical half-this-elf half-that-elf support, it's best to show that kind of thing in features and general roleplay rather than expect someone to recognize you as a mix at a glance.
While Aelotoi were originally human before they were messed with genetically by the Kiramon, I'd be surprised if they could still breed with humans.
---
Cendadric says, "Hmm, a most impressive weapon of note. I'll give you 110 silver coins for it."
Half-elves are the product of human and elf (sylvankind, dark elf, or city elf). In the half-elf documentation, you'll find these tidbits:
| "Children of the original founders [of Oblone, who were half-elves] mostly married humans, thus elven genetic features and cultural traditions faded through the generations." |
| "The children of half-elves usually strongly resemble their full-blooded parent in regards to racial features and physiology. Genetically speaking, the existence of hybrids seems to be extremely fleeting, with the dominant race quickly overpowering the other. For instance, the child of a half-elf and an elf will usually retain few notable human characteristics and in most cases can pass for full elven." |
So half-elves can breed with humans and elves and create quarter-elves and three-quarter elves, etc. Over the years when dicussion's been raised on the subject, it's generally been recommended that if you're planning to play a percentage that isn't strictly 100% or 50%, you should pick whatever race they're most likely to pass as (human, half-elf, or the particular type of elf).
Example of the second bit demonstrated in game is the Malwind family, that rules Vornavis. Baron Dunrith Malwind is a half-elf. His adult children pass for human. I'm not sure if it's been explicitly stated whether those quarter-elf children are experiencing an extended lifespan at all. And their kids may well look more elven:
| "It is possible that a child of two half-elves will appear to be mostly human or mostly elven, just as a first-generation half-elf may more strongly favor one race over the other. 'Throw backs' are also seen on rare occasions, where a child who may only be 1/16 elven actually appears to be half-elven or even, to some less discerning eyes, full elven." |
One of my characters is a half-elf who I've made to look much older than he otherwise might, indicating he favors his human side and may be aging more quickly than a more balanced halfbreed. That's a reflection of this snippet of lore:
| "Half-elven life spans can vary dramatically. Some half-elves are heavily influenced by their elven blood and live for more than a millennium. Like elves, the aging process is arrested at maturity for an extended time. Other half-elves are more heavily influenced by their human blood and have a relatively short life span of only a few centuries." |
https://gswiki.play.net/Half-Elves:_From_Outsiders_to_Heroes
Krolvin can apparently conceive with humans, giantkin, elves and halflings, but the elf and halfling pregnancies were all miscarriages and the halflings, and most of the elves, died from it.
https://gswiki.play.net/Regarding_the_Half-Krolvin#The_Breeding_of_the_Half-Krolvin
I want to say these are the only places where it's explicitly called out who can breed with whom, but I haven't combed every racial document.
I personally operate under the assumption that any kind of elf can breed with any other kind of elf (and have interacted with a few played as elf mixes), but since there's no mechanical half-this-elf half-that-elf support, it's best to show that kind of thing in features and general roleplay rather than expect someone to recognize you as a mix at a glance.
While Aelotoi were originally human before they were messed with genetically by the Kiramon, I'd be surprised if they could still breed with humans.
---
Cendadric says, "Hmm, a most impressive weapon of note. I'll give you 110 silver coins for it."
INIQUITY
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 07:08 AM CDT
Age Comparison Chart (bottom):
https://gswiki.play.net/AGE_(verb)
Height and Lifespan Table (under "Playable Races"):
https://gswiki.play.net/Race
You need to take the age and lifespan limits with a grain of salt. It is the rules imposed on player characters, but with Elves particularly it is outright contradicted by the historical documentation. One of the members of the Council of Thrones in Ta'Illistim was the monarch 4,000 years ago. There is game lore showing Elves living 5,000+ years and she-elfs having children at 3,000+ years old. There are some 3,000+ year old player characters as well because the ceiling was twice what it is now at one point.
Interbreeding is a shady subject because it is only so well defined and the only half-races walking around, ipso facto, are half-Elves and half-Krolvin (unless the Erithians are somehow distantly half-Elves, but there are no half-Erithians.) The trouble is that there are also a lot of creatures that are somehow derived from humanoid stock.
- Xorus' player
>'=explain Who would deny, after all, that a rhetorical question is merely a statement?
You may not explain with a sentence ending in a question mark.
https://gswiki.play.net/AGE_(verb)
Height and Lifespan Table (under "Playable Races"):
https://gswiki.play.net/Race
You need to take the age and lifespan limits with a grain of salt. It is the rules imposed on player characters, but with Elves particularly it is outright contradicted by the historical documentation. One of the members of the Council of Thrones in Ta'Illistim was the monarch 4,000 years ago. There is game lore showing Elves living 5,000+ years and she-elfs having children at 3,000+ years old. There are some 3,000+ year old player characters as well because the ceiling was twice what it is now at one point.
Interbreeding is a shady subject because it is only so well defined and the only half-races walking around, ipso facto, are half-Elves and half-Krolvin (unless the Erithians are somehow distantly half-Elves, but there are no half-Erithians.) The trouble is that there are also a lot of creatures that are somehow derived from humanoid stock.
- Xorus' player
>'=explain Who would deny, after all, that a rhetorical question is merely a statement?
You may not explain with a sentence ending in a question mark.
LUXELLE
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 11:44 AM CDT
Welcome, Diagonalize, I moved from DR to GS a little over 2.5 years and have never regretted it!
There's a small, but growing, number of others. You will LOVE it!
~L.
---
Rohese: "... the TownCrier (tune in if you haven’t, it’s without doubt the best thing to ever happen on LNet)"
There's a small, but growing, number of others. You will LOVE it!
~L.
---
Rohese: "... the TownCrier (tune in if you haven’t, it’s without doubt the best thing to ever happen on LNet)"
DIAGONALIZE
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 08:39 PM CDT
Thank you all for the information. Very helpful!
I'm a little surprised there's no breeding chart. So we have no idea if, for example, a halfling could breed with a gnome? Or a gnome with a giantman? (Believe it or not, the latter is possible in DR, though I've never known it to happen.) I would assume all inter-breeding is impossible, except that clearly there are some examples.
Another interesting case is the krolvin breeding. The lore you linked shows that it's clearly dangerous for an elf or a halfling to breed with a krolvin, which means the same might be true for those races and half-krolvin.
Another question: Are there any races that have trouble having children? For example, the elves in DR have a lot of difficulty with this, and it's spawned lore on several intricate marriage arrangements. In addition, it helps to know just how large (or how limited) the various populations are.
Finally, what about languages? I've seen the chart, but I take it there's no way to learn the language of another race in game? In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?
And Luxelle, thank you again! You already warmly welcomed me in another thread, and I've been using your advice. Thank goodness, my eyes are no longer crossing over the strange SAYs in this game. :)
I'm a little surprised there's no breeding chart. So we have no idea if, for example, a halfling could breed with a gnome? Or a gnome with a giantman? (Believe it or not, the latter is possible in DR, though I've never known it to happen.) I would assume all inter-breeding is impossible, except that clearly there are some examples.
Another interesting case is the krolvin breeding. The lore you linked shows that it's clearly dangerous for an elf or a halfling to breed with a krolvin, which means the same might be true for those races and half-krolvin.
Another question: Are there any races that have trouble having children? For example, the elves in DR have a lot of difficulty with this, and it's spawned lore on several intricate marriage arrangements. In addition, it helps to know just how large (or how limited) the various populations are.
Finally, what about languages? I've seen the chart, but I take it there's no way to learn the language of another race in game? In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?
And Luxelle, thank you again! You already warmly welcomed me in another thread, and I've been using your advice. Thank goodness, my eyes are no longer crossing over the strange SAYs in this game. :)
OM1E5GA
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 09:51 PM CDT
<So we have no idea if, for example, a halfling could breed with a gnome? Or a gnome with a giantman?>
Gnomes breed with whoever we wanna breed wit, thankyeaveramuch.
Starchitin
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
Gnomes breed with whoever we wanna breed wit, thankyeaveramuch.
Starchitin
A severed gnomish hand crawls in on its fingertips and makes a rude gesture before quickly decaying and rotting into dust. A gust of wind quickly scatters the dust.
MOURNE
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 10:30 PM CDT
>Another question: Are there any races that have trouble having children?
I've got some vague thought that it might be mentioned offhand in some document, somewhere, that elves have low conception rates, but I'm not sure if that's actually true or just my conflating GS with elf lore from other sources. I'd have to go hunting. I don't think I've read anything regarding conception issues with other races.
>Finally, what about languages? I've seen the chart, but I take it there's no way to learn the language of another race in game? In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?
There's no system to learn languages not inherently known on character creation at this time, though many of us have been wishing for one for years. There are relatively rare and prized items out there that will allow you to understand a different language when spoken (usually in the form of an earcuff) or read (usually in the form of spectacles), and I only know of one item that will allow you to understand and speak another language, but my knowledge of all the interesting little toys out there is not exhaustive.
Spell-wise, I'm not familiar with any existing spells that impart understanding or speaking of non-native languages. Maybe we'll see something like that when/if Savants get implemented.
Also, random crossbreed trivia:
There is what appears to be a elf-halfling crossbreed in Solhaven, in the form of the town's alchemist. To my knowledge there's no mention anywhere else but in the form of this NPC that this is a viable pairing.
>Wearing deep burgundy robes embroidered with silver geometric shapes and golden runes, Master Darbo Phoop bears the rounded facial features, pointed ears, light frame and large feet common to one of both halfling and elven lineage: an Elven-farthing in Solhaven parlance.
There is also a GM NPC tied to Solhaven, the Captain of the Guard of Vornavis, who is a half-ogre half-bull centaur.
>You see Gurbah Klaah, the half-ogre half-bull centaur.
>His age is impossible to determine. His long, white hair flows back into his mane, he has black eyes, and dark skin.
>His lower body is covered with fine grey hair, and his hooves appear to be shod with mithril shoes. He is wearing a dark green tabard and barding emblazoned on the chest and both flanks with a white swan rising, a heavy leather harness, some gleaming steel half plate, and some leather gauntlets.
---
Cendadric says, "Hmm, a most impressive weapon of note. I'll give you 110 silver coins for it."
I've got some vague thought that it might be mentioned offhand in some document, somewhere, that elves have low conception rates, but I'm not sure if that's actually true or just my conflating GS with elf lore from other sources. I'd have to go hunting. I don't think I've read anything regarding conception issues with other races.
>Finally, what about languages? I've seen the chart, but I take it there's no way to learn the language of another race in game? In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?
There's no system to learn languages not inherently known on character creation at this time, though many of us have been wishing for one for years. There are relatively rare and prized items out there that will allow you to understand a different language when spoken (usually in the form of an earcuff) or read (usually in the form of spectacles), and I only know of one item that will allow you to understand and speak another language, but my knowledge of all the interesting little toys out there is not exhaustive.
Spell-wise, I'm not familiar with any existing spells that impart understanding or speaking of non-native languages. Maybe we'll see something like that when/if Savants get implemented.
Also, random crossbreed trivia:
There is what appears to be a elf-halfling crossbreed in Solhaven, in the form of the town's alchemist. To my knowledge there's no mention anywhere else but in the form of this NPC that this is a viable pairing.
>Wearing deep burgundy robes embroidered with silver geometric shapes and golden runes, Master Darbo Phoop bears the rounded facial features, pointed ears, light frame and large feet common to one of both halfling and elven lineage: an Elven-farthing in Solhaven parlance.
There is also a GM NPC tied to Solhaven, the Captain of the Guard of Vornavis, who is a half-ogre half-bull centaur.
>You see Gurbah Klaah, the half-ogre half-bull centaur.
>His age is impossible to determine. His long, white hair flows back into his mane, he has black eyes, and dark skin.
>His lower body is covered with fine grey hair, and his hooves appear to be shod with mithril shoes. He is wearing a dark green tabard and barding emblazoned on the chest and both flanks with a white swan rising, a heavy leather harness, some gleaming steel half plate, and some leather gauntlets.
---
Cendadric says, "Hmm, a most impressive weapon of note. I'll give you 110 silver coins for it."
BRANDTJRT
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 10:39 PM CDT
>>In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?
There are, though for the most part, they are not in big supply. I think there is a krolvin language item you can get from the one quest, but overall they are rare. There are also some weird combos if you dig through them all, like the gnome cultures that can speak dwarven and/or elven. It would be neat if they were learnable for sure though.
I would also very much like a chart that shows breeding combos. I am especially curious with various elf combos, particularly involving dark elves.
_ _ _
Wyrom gestures at you, causing you to explode.
There are, though for the most part, they are not in big supply. I think there is a krolvin language item you can get from the one quest, but overall they are rare. There are also some weird combos if you dig through them all, like the gnome cultures that can speak dwarven and/or elven. It would be neat if they were learnable for sure though.
I would also very much like a chart that shows breeding combos. I am especially curious with various elf combos, particularly involving dark elves.
_ _ _
Wyrom gestures at you, causing you to explode.
INIQUITY
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 11:22 PM CDT
There is also a distinction to be made between "interbreeding" naturally and more unnatural forms of miscegenation. One of the more over the top examples is the vesperti, which are a cross between elves and bats. This was in no sense a case of elves and bats breeding together. It was done through the depraved experiments of a Fash'lo'nae worshipper. There are transformations from exposure to magical energies. Who knows how some of these other things actually originated before recorded history?
The Illistim elves documentation shows they have a concept of evolution distorted by the concept of progress. There is documentation implying the moon gods were responsible for originating some humanoid races. Some creatures were obviously made or transformed artificially. My own character happens to believe there was a single humanoid race in the very ancient past, and that most of the variation came not from evolution but active manipulation by higher powers. He believes humans are the closest to this ur-race (he views humans as inferior regardless), and uses this idea to explain why interbreeding is even possible at all, with further deviations from it making it more difficult.
<<Another question: Are there any races that have trouble having children? For example, the elves in DR have a lot of difficulty with this, and it's spawned lore on several intricate marriage arrangements. In addition, it helps to know just how large (or how limited) the various populations are.>>
I'm not sure if I can recall low birth rates being explicitly mentioned for Elves, if it was it would have been in really archaic pre-1996 documentation left over from Rolemaster. You know implicitly that the Elves have to be less fertile than the much shorter lived races. The Dhe'nar culture of Dark Elves was supposed to be almost infertile requiring its Temple caste to plan out breeding, but that was before they were officially incorporated into the game lore, so I doubt it is actually codified in any document.*
There is nothing anywhere about the various population sizes. I remember there have been arguments about this on the boards before, someone even posted a generator from the Internet about how many people should be in a medieval city based on whatever. It might have been this one (doesn't matter, we have no geographical distance scales):
https://donjon.bin.sh/fantasy/demographics/
<<Finally, what about languages? I've seen the chart, but I take it there's no way to learn the language of another race in game? In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?>>
I do not know if the situation has changed at all, but the old line on this issue is that languages are "hard coded", making it very difficult to implement the ability to learn other languages. One thing that does exist in the lore is the point that the Dark Elven language is mystically inborn, and that other races cannot speak or hear all of it properly. In theory I think you should still be able to learn how to read its written form, Grishom Stone (human mentalist/sorcerer NPC) demonstrated that ability once last year-ish.
I made a bunch of comparison charts between DragonRealms and GemStone III and GemStone IV at one point, but dropped the project for a while in favor of other things. I kind of made a mess of it trying to sketch out how the moon lores are deeply inconsistent and what that implies physically: https://gswiki.play.net/DragonRealms
- Xorus' player
* One of their founders claimed the Dhe'nar have "demon seed", making racial mixing impossible by killing the mother. This was ridiculed a lot back in the day but was not supposed to actually be true, just a myth to cover up for the infertility when the culture is supposed to be virile and focused on racial purity.
>'=explain Who would deny, after all, that a rhetorical question is merely a statement?
You may not explain with a sentence ending in a question mark.
The Illistim elves documentation shows they have a concept of evolution distorted by the concept of progress. There is documentation implying the moon gods were responsible for originating some humanoid races. Some creatures were obviously made or transformed artificially. My own character happens to believe there was a single humanoid race in the very ancient past, and that most of the variation came not from evolution but active manipulation by higher powers. He believes humans are the closest to this ur-race (he views humans as inferior regardless), and uses this idea to explain why interbreeding is even possible at all, with further deviations from it making it more difficult.
<<Another question: Are there any races that have trouble having children? For example, the elves in DR have a lot of difficulty with this, and it's spawned lore on several intricate marriage arrangements. In addition, it helps to know just how large (or how limited) the various populations are.>>
I'm not sure if I can recall low birth rates being explicitly mentioned for Elves, if it was it would have been in really archaic pre-1996 documentation left over from Rolemaster. You know implicitly that the Elves have to be less fertile than the much shorter lived races. The Dhe'nar culture of Dark Elves was supposed to be almost infertile requiring its Temple caste to plan out breeding, but that was before they were officially incorporated into the game lore, so I doubt it is actually codified in any document.*
There is nothing anywhere about the various population sizes. I remember there have been arguments about this on the boards before, someone even posted a generator from the Internet about how many people should be in a medieval city based on whatever. It might have been this one (doesn't matter, we have no geographical distance scales):
https://donjon.bin.sh/fantasy/demographics/
<<Finally, what about languages? I've seen the chart, but I take it there's no way to learn the language of another race in game? In DR there is a spell and several items that allow understanding or speaking other languages -- do these types of things exist here?>>
I do not know if the situation has changed at all, but the old line on this issue is that languages are "hard coded", making it very difficult to implement the ability to learn other languages. One thing that does exist in the lore is the point that the Dark Elven language is mystically inborn, and that other races cannot speak or hear all of it properly. In theory I think you should still be able to learn how to read its written form, Grishom Stone (human mentalist/sorcerer NPC) demonstrated that ability once last year-ish.
I made a bunch of comparison charts between DragonRealms and GemStone III and GemStone IV at one point, but dropped the project for a while in favor of other things. I kind of made a mess of it trying to sketch out how the moon lores are deeply inconsistent and what that implies physically: https://gswiki.play.net/DragonRealms
- Xorus' player
* One of their founders claimed the Dhe'nar have "demon seed", making racial mixing impossible by killing the mother. This was ridiculed a lot back in the day but was not supposed to actually be true, just a myth to cover up for the infertility when the culture is supposed to be virile and focused on racial purity.
>'=explain Who would deny, after all, that a rhetorical question is merely a statement?
You may not explain with a sentence ending in a question mark.
LUXELLE
Re: General Race Info
07/04/2017 11:28 PM CDT
There was an item that translated languages in The Great Auction last December.
---
Rohese: "... the TownCrier (tune in if you haven’t, it’s without doubt the best thing to ever happen on LNet)"
---
Rohese: "... the TownCrier (tune in if you haven’t, it’s without doubt the best thing to ever happen on LNet)"
JOSHUADEVON84
DIAGONALIZE
Re: General Race Info
07/06/2017 12:39 AM CDT
Thank you all again for the great information. Xorus, your lore mastery is impressive.
>>I would also very much like a chart that shows breeding combos. I am especially curious with various elf combos, particularly involving dark elves.
Out of curiosity, how involved are the GMs in the lore of this game? I'm not asking in order to make a judgment, just wondering if we made a request to the right place if we might hope for a response. In DR, we generally will just post to the forums and our questions might get picked up or might not, but in some cases it is possible to send an email request as well.
>>Spell-wise, I'm not familiar with any existing spells that impart understanding or speaking of non-native languages. Maybe we'll see something like that when/if Savants get implemented.
For what it's worth, the Bards get this spell in DR. There's also an artifact-like item that works if a Bard provides the appropriately mixed pigment. Not saying, of course, that GS has to be the same.
>>Also, random crossbreed trivia:
Wow. This would seem to suggest that all kinds of half-breeds could be possible. Cool.
>>I made a bunch of comparison charts between DragonRealms and GemStone III and GemStone IV at one point, but dropped the project for a while in favor of other things.
This was really neat to look over. I could probably wax on about the similarities and differences myself at this point, and I have a theory based on DR's Planar lore about how the two worlds MIGHT form a continuous timeline despite all the weird moon physics, but this isn't the thread for that. I just wanted to point out that the article mentions the Kaldar as being like humans and the Togs as like giantmen, but in actuality the Kaldar are the giantmen equivalent and the Togs are unique. Togs are 8-10' tall, completely hairless, and usually a shade of green.
>>I would also very much like a chart that shows breeding combos. I am especially curious with various elf combos, particularly involving dark elves.
Out of curiosity, how involved are the GMs in the lore of this game? I'm not asking in order to make a judgment, just wondering if we made a request to the right place if we might hope for a response. In DR, we generally will just post to the forums and our questions might get picked up or might not, but in some cases it is possible to send an email request as well.
>>Spell-wise, I'm not familiar with any existing spells that impart understanding or speaking of non-native languages. Maybe we'll see something like that when/if Savants get implemented.
For what it's worth, the Bards get this spell in DR. There's also an artifact-like item that works if a Bard provides the appropriately mixed pigment. Not saying, of course, that GS has to be the same.
>>Also, random crossbreed trivia:
Wow. This would seem to suggest that all kinds of half-breeds could be possible. Cool.
>>I made a bunch of comparison charts between DragonRealms and GemStone III and GemStone IV at one point, but dropped the project for a while in favor of other things.
This was really neat to look over. I could probably wax on about the similarities and differences myself at this point, and I have a theory based on DR's Planar lore about how the two worlds MIGHT form a continuous timeline despite all the weird moon physics, but this isn't the thread for that. I just wanted to point out that the article mentions the Kaldar as being like humans and the Togs as like giantmen, but in actuality the Kaldar are the giantmen equivalent and the Togs are unique. Togs are 8-10' tall, completely hairless, and usually a shade of green.
INIQUITY
Re: General Race Info
07/06/2017 04:45 AM CDT
<< I just wanted to point out that the article mentions the Kaldar as being like humans and the Togs as like giantmen, but in actuality the Kaldar are the giantmen equivalent and the Togs are unique. Togs are 8-10' tall, completely hairless, and usually a shade of green.>>
Fixed it. I would not have made that mistake if I had seen the height chart, I was probably going pretty fast over that point and never went back to it.
<<and I have a theory based on DR's Planar lore about how the two worlds MIGHT form a continuous timeline despite all the weird moon physics, but this isn't the thread for that.>>
Other people have said something similar to me on the subject. I have an email explaining that the original intent was for time to be "shattered" so that Elanthia was split into multiple "phases." It would have been equally true to say DR was either in the future or the past from GS since the difference would become "meaningless."
- Xorus' player
>'=explain Who would deny, after all, that a rhetorical question is merely a statement?
You may not explain with a sentence ending in a question mark.
Fixed it. I would not have made that mistake if I had seen the height chart, I was probably going pretty fast over that point and never went back to it.
<<and I have a theory based on DR's Planar lore about how the two worlds MIGHT form a continuous timeline despite all the weird moon physics, but this isn't the thread for that.>>
Other people have said something similar to me on the subject. I have an email explaining that the original intent was for time to be "shattered" so that Elanthia was split into multiple "phases." It would have been equally true to say DR was either in the future or the past from GS since the difference would become "meaningless."
- Xorus' player
>'=explain Who would deny, after all, that a rhetorical question is merely a statement?
You may not explain with a sentence ending in a question mark.
GS4-MIKOS
Re: General Race Info
07/06/2017 07:32 PM CDT
>>Also, random crossbreed trivia:
>>Wow. This would seem to suggest that all kinds of half-breeds could be possible. Cool.
FWiW-wise:
Darbo's been around since Solhaven opened, and his being an "Elven-farthing" underwent QC scrutiny before being included as part of the game reality. However, several years into his existence, one player took particular exception (on the forum) to Darbo's lineage as being inconsistent with game documentation. In contrast, no staff member has ever commented to me either way on Darbo's lineage.
Regarding Gurbah, he entered GS's reality as a guard in Jantalar's dungeon. A group of PCs encountered him during a rescue mission and talked him into returning with them to Vornavis. He's an example of PCs having an impact on the game reality, since he was created to be a one-appearance oddity for that particular event. He was designed and QC-approved as a one-of-a-kind/shaped-by-magic/some-mage's-idea-of-a-"good thing" creation, so I don't expect you'll see any more like him. But then I have no idea what direction GM Lydil's imagination may be twisting in.
As far as RPing a mixed-heritage PC goes, years ago a half-Elven PC named Nerilka was RP'd as a half-Elven centaur. The half-equine aspect of her existence was totally RP-based, and I'm sure would have been considered inconsistent with game documentation by some, but I found it impressive and original.
- Mikos
>>Wow. This would seem to suggest that all kinds of half-breeds could be possible. Cool.
FWiW-wise:
Darbo's been around since Solhaven opened, and his being an "Elven-farthing" underwent QC scrutiny before being included as part of the game reality. However, several years into his existence, one player took particular exception (on the forum) to Darbo's lineage as being inconsistent with game documentation. In contrast, no staff member has ever commented to me either way on Darbo's lineage.
Regarding Gurbah, he entered GS's reality as a guard in Jantalar's dungeon. A group of PCs encountered him during a rescue mission and talked him into returning with them to Vornavis. He's an example of PCs having an impact on the game reality, since he was created to be a one-appearance oddity for that particular event. He was designed and QC-approved as a one-of-a-kind/shaped-by-magic/some-mage's-idea-of-a-"good thing" creation, so I don't expect you'll see any more like him. But then I have no idea what direction GM Lydil's imagination may be twisting in.
As far as RPing a mixed-heritage PC goes, years ago a half-Elven PC named Nerilka was RP'd as a half-Elven centaur. The half-equine aspect of her existence was totally RP-based, and I'm sure would have been considered inconsistent with game documentation by some, but I found it impressive and original.
- Mikos
INIQUITY
Re: General Race Info
08/20/2017 09:40 PM CDT
Idle thought: I am unaware if it is written anywhere what it looks like if a Dark Elf and an Elf/Sylvan have a kid. There is an automatic issue with languages.
The Dark Elven language is supposed to be inherently inborn in offspring and all future generations: (Lothwyn posted this document in May 2008)
https://gswiki.play.net/Dark_Elven_languages
The Wiki says that Half-Elves of Ta'Faendryl speak both Faendryl and Dark Elven. That would seem to imply their physiological transformation for it is close enough to still be functional in spite of the human contamination. In that case you would expect something inherently "dark elven" in the make up from elven wedlock. I would think that the sheer ability to hear and speak it down the generations would eventually get corrupted from breeding back into the fair bloodlines and kept away from Rhoska-Tor. Unless it is a situation of really dominant traits. In that case it might be that an Elf/Dark Elf offspring is just a "Dark Elf" and that is unavoidable (cursed unto your children's children!)
I'm not sure how much sense it makes for things to be written in Dark Elven, either, because whatever the runes/letters are encoding refer to something that goes outside the sensory range of other races.(*) I would think there would be a bunch of symbols representing things that are just incomprehensible, like letters for sounds that only Dark Elves can hear if the form was a phonetic alphabet, and even then you would not be able to read it without culturally specific training. It is one thing for Dhe'nar, Faendryl, and whoever else outside of them to be able to innately communicate that way, but another thing entirely for it to have a universal written form. If there were such an innately known script I would expect it to be pretty much incomprehensible to anyone else, something like a Rosetta Stone might not even be possible even in principle.
- Xorus' player
(*) I remember Grishom Stone wrote something I was able to read in "Dark Elven" with the excuse presumably being his mentalism and it is a written form, which is somewhat dubious in itself, but if there are written forms I do not see how they could be culturally independent and probably have to be incomplete representations. It would have to be some construct of language scholars trying to model something totally foreign. By analogy, consider if the meaning of sounds and words in a spoken language were heavily dependent on visual body language or the speed of conveyance or any number of other sensory cues, or if the signal was partly conveyed telepathically. The alternative would be innate knowledge of some glyphical script, maybe plugging back into the rumored language of the Book of Tormtor and Despana somehow understanding it. Since there would be no "learning" of the language, the "words" would have to be some kind of dormant knowledge being invoked, so the glyphs could just as well be ideograms.
The Dark Elven language is supposed to be inherently inborn in offspring and all future generations: (Lothwyn posted this document in May 2008)
https://gswiki.play.net/Dark_Elven_languages
The Wiki says that Half-Elves of Ta'Faendryl speak both Faendryl and Dark Elven. That would seem to imply their physiological transformation for it is close enough to still be functional in spite of the human contamination. In that case you would expect something inherently "dark elven" in the make up from elven wedlock. I would think that the sheer ability to hear and speak it down the generations would eventually get corrupted from breeding back into the fair bloodlines and kept away from Rhoska-Tor. Unless it is a situation of really dominant traits. In that case it might be that an Elf/Dark Elf offspring is just a "Dark Elf" and that is unavoidable (cursed unto your children's children!)
I'm not sure how much sense it makes for things to be written in Dark Elven, either, because whatever the runes/letters are encoding refer to something that goes outside the sensory range of other races.(*) I would think there would be a bunch of symbols representing things that are just incomprehensible, like letters for sounds that only Dark Elves can hear if the form was a phonetic alphabet, and even then you would not be able to read it without culturally specific training. It is one thing for Dhe'nar, Faendryl, and whoever else outside of them to be able to innately communicate that way, but another thing entirely for it to have a universal written form. If there were such an innately known script I would expect it to be pretty much incomprehensible to anyone else, something like a Rosetta Stone might not even be possible even in principle.
- Xorus' player
(*) I remember Grishom Stone wrote something I was able to read in "Dark Elven" with the excuse presumably being his mentalism and it is a written form, which is somewhat dubious in itself, but if there are written forms I do not see how they could be culturally independent and probably have to be incomplete representations. It would have to be some construct of language scholars trying to model something totally foreign. By analogy, consider if the meaning of sounds and words in a spoken language were heavily dependent on visual body language or the speed of conveyance or any number of other sensory cues, or if the signal was partly conveyed telepathically. The alternative would be innate knowledge of some glyphical script, maybe plugging back into the rumored language of the Book of Tormtor and Despana somehow understanding it. Since there would be no "learning" of the language, the "words" would have to be some kind of dormant knowledge being invoked, so the glyphs could just as well be ideograms.
RAVANA729
Re: General Race Info
12/20/2017 06:58 PM CST
" The trouble is that there are also a lot of creatures that are somehow derived from humanoid stock. " -Xorus' player
That's a nice way of saying bestiality
*~Omni Exeunt in Mysterium~*
That's a nice way of saying bestiality
*~Omni Exeunt in Mysterium~*
CLUNK24963
Re: General Race Info
12/21/2017 06:00 PM CST
>>" The trouble is that there are also a lot of creatures that are somehow derived from humanoid stock. " -Xorus' player
deer-monkeys?
Clunk
(Buy your swords at CBD weapons in Zul Logoth.)
deer-monkeys?
Clunk
(Buy your swords at CBD weapons in Zul Logoth.)
