Given that Vvrael warlocks go into shock and have convulsions seems to at least indicate they have a nervous system.

Should they not go into shock from overcasting or should they be able to be killed from a rank 9 back plasma critical? These two seem irreconcilable. Am I understanding this correctly?

Basically, should I BUG this or not?

A blast of multihued plasma flares out from the center of the ethereal sphere, striking an arctic wolverine!

CS: +357 - TD: +69 + CvA: +25 + d100: +6 == +319

Warding failed!

The arctic wolverine is stricken for 79 points of damage!

... 75 points of damage!

The arctic wolverine's skeletal structure and muscle tissue reduced to fine ash!

The arctic wolverine is stunned!

The arctic wolverine is driven to her knees!

A blast of multihued plasma flares out from the center of the ethereal sphere, striking a halfling thug!

The entire skeleton and muscle were completely incinerated, yet this isn't a fatal critical? wat.

>>So....what is the cap? --FALAN

I haven't collected enough data to know for sure, but if I absolutely had to guess, I would say probably 133 max with +4 from my religion lore matches the 243 margin from above.

.

I can post the plasma_critical.json file along with the Ruby classes I use to parse the data if others want to mine their logs or track in real time.

3 Flares....

Crusade, ZEAL, AND my greater void flares from my katana went off at once. Pity the voids didn't strike more than once...but still.. grins


You swing a silver-edged black veil iron katana at an elven thug!
AS: +625 vs DS: +249 with AvD: +39 + d100 roll: +37 = +452
... and hit for 127 points of damage!
Awesome slash severs the elven thug's right arm!
A jagged stump is all that remains!
The thug's mace falls to the ground.

Your black veil iron katana surges with power as darkness coalesces around it!

... 10 points of damage!
Powerful burst to the elven thug's back causes excruciating pain.

Your black veil iron katana is suddenly set ablaze with night black flames that swirl in a violent vortex around it!

... 10 points of damage!
Burst of flames to back toasts skin nicely.

As you hit, the edge of your black veil iron katana seems to fold inward upon itself drawing everything it touches along with it!
... 25 points of damage!
Back snaps as ribs and vertebrae separate!

__________________________
- Kobold in Disguise Falvicar, Blade of the Night

You swing a silver-edged black veil iron katana at Sevynne!

* Sevynne drops dead at your feet!
* Sevynne just bit the dust!

Here we go.... those pesky bandits and their plate armor...


You swing a silver-edged black veil iron katana at a human brigand!
AS: +587 vs DS: +386 with AvD: +39 + d100 roll: +95 = +335
... and hit for 100 points of damage!
Spectacular slash!
The human brigand's left arm is neatly amputated!
The brigand's reinforced shield falls to the ground.
The human brigand is stunned!

Your black veil iron katana surges with power as darkness coalesces around it!

... 25 points of damage!
Glaring burst to the human brigand's chest dances across skin leaving smoking holes!

Your black veil iron katana is suddenly set ablaze with night black flames that swirl in a violent vortex around it!

... 15 points of damage!
Burst of flames char chest a crispy black.

As you hit, the edge of your black veil iron katana seems to fold inward upon itself drawing everything it touches along with it!
... 20 points of damage!
Knee shatters under sudden decompression!
It is knocked to the ground!

A nebulous dome of blue ether discharges from a silver-edged black veil iron katana and engulfs a human brigand!

... 20 points of damage!
Elbow shatters under sudden decompression!
... 15 points of damage!
Veins in neck swell!


So.. flares make up for it :-)

Crusade
Zeal
Void
Greater Void

__________________________
- Kobold in Disguise Falvicar, Blade of the Night

You swing a silver-edged black veil iron katana at Sevynne!

* Sevynne drops dead at your feet!
* Sevynne just bit the dust!

Something tells me this is a bug.

The grey luminesence surrounding Dhairn begins to swirl violently as it fills his eyes. Seemingly possessed by a divine entity, he suddenly unleashes a flurry of attacks!

Dhairn swings a perfect vultite handaxe at a half-elven robber!

AS: +815 vs DS: +278 with AvD: +40 + d100 roll: +8 = +585

... and hits for 169 points of damage!

Knocked back several feet by blow to abdomen.

The half-elven robber rolls over and dies.

Necrotic energy from Dhairn's vultite handaxe flares up momentarily!

Dhairn appears to gain succour from the unnatural energy!

The guiding force leaves Dhairn.

Dhairn's vultite handaxe returns to normal.

The evanescent shield shrouding Wintersylph fades briefly.

Dhairn swings a perfect vultite handaxe at Wintersylph!

Some frosty white vultite chain partially deflects the onslaught of the crushing attack.

AS: +765 vs DS: +301 with AvD: +40 + d100 roll: +79 = +583

... and hits for 101 points of damage!

Neck broken.

Wintersylph twitches several times before dying.

* Wintersylph drops dead at your feet!

Wintersylph seems hesitant.

Wintersylph becomes unbalanced for a second, then recovers.

Wintersylph appears to lose some internal strength.

An ethereal golden collection bowl drifts out of Wintersylph, then vanishes.

Wintersylph seems slightly different.

Wintersylph becomes solid again.

Wintersylph seems a bit less imposing.

The glowing specks of energy surrounding Wintersylph suddenly shoot off in all directions, then quickly fade away.

The bright luminescence fades from around Wintersylph.

The silvery luminescence fades from around Wintersylph.

The powerful look leaves Wintersylph.

The dim aura fades from around Wintersylph.

The air about Wintersylph shimmers momentarily before the evanescent shield surrounding her collapses.

A subtle light fades from Wintersylph's eyes.

A white glow rushes away from Wintersylph.

The opalescent aura fades from around Wintersylph.

The brilliant aura fades away from Wintersylph.

Wintersylph appears less confident.

The air shivers about Wintersylph, glistening faintly before stilling to normalcy.

Wintersylph begins to breathe less deeply.

The very powerful look leaves Wintersylph.

The white light leaves Wintersylph.

The dull golden nimbus fades from around Wintersylph.

The misty halo fades from Wintersylph.

The deep blue glow leaves Wintersylph.

The light blue glow leaves Wintersylph.

Wintersylph returns to normal color.

The brilliant luminescence fades from around Wintersylph.

Dhairn swings a perfect vultite handaxe at Snakegrin!

Some pristine brigandine armor partially deflects the onslaught of the slashing attack.

AS: +740 vs DS: +154 with AvD: +35 + d100 roll: +22 = +643

... and hits for 146 points of damage!

Hard slash to Snakegrin's side opens his spleen!

* Snakegrin drops dead at your feet!

The misty halo fades from Snakegrin.

The deep blue glow leaves Snakegrin.

Deep blue motes swirl away from Snakegrin and fade.

Snakegrin begins to breathe less deeply.

Snakegrin becomes unbalanced for a second, then recovers.

The light blue glow leaves Snakegrin.

Snakegrin appears to lose some internal strength.

The powerful look leaves Snakegrin.

The dim aura fades from around Snakegrin.

FALAN:

Is it me, or can you not do the emergency armor with just incarnate? IE: It seems like I need 1650 already prepped to do it which means during the "emergency", I'd likely be in hard RT / forced into something less than guarded etc while I get nicked.

Emergency uses of INCARNATE ARMOR can only be used while 1650 is active.

GameMaster Cyraex

I believe your referring to the fact that INCARNATE ONSLAUGHT struck two other players. This is NOT a bug, Onslaught will hit other players who are NOT part of your group. You must choose wisely when to utilize this ability as to avoid unintended consequences.

GameMaster Cyraex

Apologies. I should have specified what I thought was the bug. I'm not sure how I feel about that targeting mechanic. The modification to the wiki now reflects this targeting pattern (thanks Estild).

FALAN:

Any chance that this can change IF

1) Paladin has the mana

2) 1650 is not on cool down

and

3) Paladin has the Divine energy available?

This concept was discussed at length during the design phase of the project and ultimately we decided that 1650 has to be active for the emergency uses. That being said, some of the changes I hope to present to the team in the near future, if approved, may alleviate or at least improve this issue quite a bit. I can't share anymore with you at this time though and I don't want to promise anything yet. Stay tuned.

GameMaster Cyraex

I wanted to give my thoughts and feedback too, along with a handful of suggestions. I feel confident that whatever you already are planning is quality, but more ideas can't go too far amiss.

First: overall spell stuff.

The spell in concept and execution is great. I think it has started out at a very good place. It seems to mesh well with a good number of play styles and fill in a lot of gaps we had. That being said, I think there is still some room to make it even better without sacrificing too much balance for the game. My main concerns in terms of the overall spell design is the relative "up time" we have to work with. 1650 is indeed a powerful spell, it may even surpass something like core tap due to the variety in uses. But, I do not think it is so far beyond other spells that it needs to suffer quite so many limitations to it's use.

Idea 1: Some sort of trade off between energy used and cooldown. It could even be as simple as cooldown = 5 min +(5 min)x(energy used/energy max). If you make full use of the spell the cooldown is exactly the same as now. If you use any energy there is a cooldown past the expiration of the spell. If you use none, you can recast right away. This sort of setup would remove the "I gotta use all the energy" feel of the current spell and would remove the concerns I sometimes have in the hunt about when to activate my usable 5 minute window. Paladins would get the same number of uses of each skill in the 10 minute window, they would just have more leeway as to when it happens (at the added cost of another 50 mana over that timeframe if they did not use them in the expected first cast)

Idea 2: A training option to extend the available time or reduce the cooldown. This idea would put it more in line with rapid fire, which is a spell that seems very similar in application to me. I would not expect to be able to use training to remove the cooldown completely, but some sort of way to work towards it would be nice.

___________________________________________
Second: incarnate onslaught.

For my applications, onslaught is perfect. It answers a major issue I had with paladins, the total lack of a true AOE attack. The number of uses is a little low at maximum 3/10 minutes. But given the power of those uses and the fact that they can be activated in quick succession makes it a trade off I find acceptable. If I compare it to the most alike spell- core tap- I find the power appropriate for a semi's capstone spell vs a pure's capstone.

All that being said, I have seen some paladins hate on the ability and I think I know the difference. Menos uses an awl-pike and most of those folks seemed to be sword/board or blunt/board users. They have the exact same costs and speed as me with onslaught, but do way less damage. The spell is just perfect for people like me for whom one weapon swing at a weakened target is good, but for folks with a less overwhelming weapon style the single hit seems a bit underpowered.

Idea 1: A DF boost based on the inverse of weapon base speed. Since the issue is with smaller/faster weapons having exactly the same cost, give them a boost based on how much less time their weapon should have needed to attack. Think of it like this, Menos' attack takes 3 seconds but theirs should have taken some time less. They use that spare time to put more ummph into the swing. DF boost would be something like (20%/weapon base speed). So folks like me with a lance/pike/greatsword are going to see a quite modest 2% boost to DF but someone using a mace/longsword type weapon would see a respectable 5% increase. It fits in thematically with 1605 and would preferentially improve the spell for folks not now seeing as good a result.

Idea 2: Lower energy cost based on weapon base RT. An idea much like the above. Change the energy cost to be (6 + weapon base speed). Everything is unchanged for heavy weapons and lighter weapons get more uses per 1650 cast. This sort of fits in with mstrike stamina costs calculations and would also address the issue I see with the spell.

__________________________________________________
Third: Incarnate smite

This is another one where I am very happy with the implementation as it works with my character. It gives paladins an actual maneuver based attack. With most other classes having some sort of CML/maneuver to work with, paladins were very much lacking without it. That lack is why I was arguing at the time web got updated that it should have a maneuver option to balance with e-wave. My only real concern is how it works for paladins with a less absurd number of paladin spell ranks. The damage seems good for me, but I have heard some rumblings from folks without all my post cap exp that the damage is less good. I have not tested the spell with any other number of spell ranks, so I do not have a feel for how much of an issue this really is. I would encourage you to make a copy of some less spell heavy paladins at sort of normal 50, 75 and recently capped skill points, use the skill on some like level foes and be sure the damage is in line with what you want.

Idea 1: It would be nice if there was a second damage type choice for this spell. Plasma is a very strong flare type but it does have some interactions with room hazards. If someone was to also have fire or plasma as a deity flare, they would be stuck with all 3 spell attacks being impractical for those grounds. Maybe a flag to switch between plasma and one of the physical flare types like slash or crush? Those flare types are below the average elemental flare effectiveness in my experience but offer a way to mitigate environmental hazards. This might be a niche concern but the balance cost would be effectively zero and it would free up people to pick deities based more on character and less on mechanics... They could pick that fire based deity with plans to use smite over 1615 in those rooms.

_____________________________________________________
Fourth: incarnate armor

This is the ability that needs the most love. Conceptually it is by far my favorite. It is definitely the one that is thematically the best fit for Menos. I play my paladin 100% in the "tank" build so common in RPGs. I should love incarnate armor more than plate armor.... but I have not used it a single time. I have been actively trying to test out 1650 as much as possible, and yet I have not had a single instance in my hunting where incarnate armor was the practical choice. The combination of limiting when we can use it and the time it lasts means that the appropriate window for wanting resistance and being able to activate it has not yet been open to me at all. That is not to say that it will never be there. I can remember times in hunts or invasions when armor would have been just the ticket. However, those times are far enough apart that none has happened since the spell was released. It is a terrible waste to have such a cool ability if it is months between instances when it can be used.

I think armor is so hard to make use of because it is the only inherently defensive ability from incarnate. It is always harder to know when you will need defenses vs when you can use an offensive ability. There is a nod to this in the availability of the emergency use. That emergency option greatly increases the times when the ability would be useful, but even with that increase I have not yet seen one of them with Menos. I know other paladins who have used it and loved the effect, but my experiences say the right balance is not yet struck between usefulness and not-overpowering. The effect could be ameliorated much by my first cooldown suggestion above, but there are other possibilities too.

Idea 1: (expand the emergency use bit) This one has been suggested already, but I will add myself to the list. If incarnate armor could force the activation of 1650 when not on cooldown, it would have much wider application. My main problem with this idea is that it would encourage people who wanted to use armor (like me) to prefer to not keep 1650 active. But even with that negative, it would let me play a build where armor would be more practical to use and would thus be a net positive change.

Idea 2: (expand the every day use of armor) If armor had some application outside of the short burst of protection, than the very very limited use of the "burst defense" wouldn't be as much of a concern. Paladins already have alot of short window of protection abilities. We have shield mind, steely resolve, wall of force, faith shield, spirit guide.... Incarnate armor does have advantages against many of those, but it is a niche filled with alot of different things. Expanding the utility of incarnate armor would make those overlaps less of an existential problem. The idea would be to offer a version of armor that is much lower in power but has a longer duration. Maybe something like duration = 30 seconds + (% reduction/20 x 30 seconds. So, a full power use of armor would be the same as before but the paladin could elect for an 80% reduction in power to extend it to 2.5 minutes.

Idea 3: Like idea 2 but simpler. Just make a flat out passive boost option for like 10% reduction that runs for the full 5 minutes of 1650.

Idea 4: Give it a cloak of shadows/mage armor type ability where you can set armor to activate on a stun or perhaps on a rank 1 injury.

______________________________________________________
Incarnate zeal.... I need to go get breakfast and start the drive home from my weekend in the great city of Savannah. I'll post on this one when I get home.



Sweet is the sound of the pouring rain,
And the stream that falls from the hill to plain.
Better than rain or rippling brook,
Is a mug of beer inside this Took.

Otherwise.. I'm having fun with it. sometimes I use Zeal, and Crusade with my greater void flaring katana for other reason than to drive a certain person mad <grin> You know who you are if you are reading this <3 -- FALAN

You know, I've been laboring under the assumption that flares occupied the slot as many other desirable abilities; using that framework, I massively undervalued flares on items because I thought the opportunity cost was too high. This changed around 2017-08-27. Flares! Flares for everyone!

I need to properly evaluate the lethality of flares before I can really make a claim about the value of flares. So, in that vein, I created a few Ruby classes that parse my critical JSON file with the lethality of the corresponding damage_type, body_part, critical_rank. The weighted percentage uses the non-corp table from the research I posted years ago, found here: https://gswiki.play.net/Research:Unaimed_body_location_assignment.

Example: Plasma, All Body Parts, Using the Standard Flare Framework of critical ranks being capped at rank 7.

Damage Type	Plasma
Body Part	All
Lower Bound	1
Upper Bound	7
Fatal	9
Total	91
Unweighted Lethality	9.89%
Weighted Lethality	9.61%

The assumption I'm currently working with is that the distribution of critical ranks is uniform. That is to say, the chance for a rank 1 critical, is the same as getting a rank 7 critical, is the same as getting a rank 4 critical, and so on. That would be roughly 14.29% for each critical rank. I'll have to mine my logs for thousands of occurrences to verify this assumption. I suspect it isn't a uniform distribution. That said, if it is, a nearly 10% chance for a lethal critical given a 20% chance of flare occurrence results in a 2% chance of lethal critical on any given successful AS/DS resolution. I do know that flares vs creatures with crit padding have the upper bound reduced significantly to the point of being 5 or 6 depending on the amount of crit padding. This is, of course, only measuring the value of flares through the lens of lethality.

So, for now, more research needs to be done on the value of flares. What percentage of lethality do players find reasonable? Underpowered? Overpowered?

Parting thought: Lightning flares are absolutely B-AN-AN-AS

I parsed all my logs for GuidingLight flares.

The distribution is definitely skewed toward rank {3, 4, 5}, provided the creature doesn't have crit padding, which surprisingly many do.

Once I collect more data, I'll post the chart of it.

You left an 'UN' out of there. As in, "Unsurprisingly", many creatures have crit padding.... -- KRAKII

How many creatures do you know have crit padding?

I'm fairly certain all trolls, giants, illoke, griffins, aivren, n'ecare have crit padding.

For OTF:
Ithzir don't (maybe champions do?)
gemlocks don't
taints don't

For Nelemar:
Triton don't (don't remember them having it at least).

General:
bandits don't

Do you have a list of creatures and their amount of crit padding? I'd be interested to see what percentage of creatures have crit padding and to what degree.

>>But padding is an easy GM solution to "make these guys live longer and be a threat."

""That is brand new information!" -- Phoebe Buffay" -- Michael Scott

>>No idea, to be honest.

That's my position for the most part, which is why I thought it was surprising so many creatures I evaluated have crit padding. I had a feeling that specific creature types did, but didn't know with any certainty. I just assumed the null hypothesis. Now, I can definitely say with certainty that a creature has crit padding, although not the degree. I would have to mine my AS/DS resolutions for the degree of crit padding. That wouldn't be terribly difficult to do, though. To the research cave!

SMR increase per spell level is not 10 as I said before, it's 1.

>incarnate smite target

Calling upon your patron to guide your attack, you watch as a grey luminescence wraps around your spikestar. Gripping your spikestar tighly, you attack an Ithzir herald, sending the grey luminesence flying towards it!

[SMR result: 97 (Open d100: 39)]

An Ithzir herald dodges out of the way!

Roundtime: 3 sec.

R>

An Ithzir herald swings a curved silvery blade at you!

With blinding speed, you block the attack with your greatshield!

R>>spell

Your spell lists:

Minor Spiritual...20

Paladin Base......51

>

Skill goals updated!

R>>spell

Your spell lists:

Minor Spiritual...20

Paladin Base......52

Further information can be found in the FAQs.

>incarnate smite target

Calling upon your patron to guide your attack, you watch as a grey luminescence wraps around your spikestar. Gripping your spikestar tighly, you attack an Ithzir herald, sending the grey luminesence flying towards it!

[SMR result: 68 (Open d100: 9)]

An Ithzir herald dodges out of the way!

Roundtime: 3 sec.

R>

An Ithzir herald directs her alien song at you!

The song mesmerizes you, causing you to falter slightly.

R>incarnate smite target

Calling upon your patron to guide your attack, you watch as a grey luminescence wraps around your spikestar. Gripping your spikestar tighly, you attack an Ithzir herald, sending the grey luminesence flying towards it!

[SMR result: 30 (Open d100: -27)]

An Ithzir herald dodges out of the way!

Roundtime: 3 sec.

Roundtime changed to 6 seconds.

R>

An Ithzir herald swings a curved silvery blade at you!

AS: +411 vs DS: +523 with AvD: +21 + d100 roll: +88 = -3

A clean miss.

R>bese

You beseech your deity for some divine assistance.

You are left with an empty feeling as your request for aid goes unheard.

>incarnate smite target

Calling upon your patron to guide your attack, you watch as a grey luminescence wraps around your spikestar. Gripping your spikestar tighly, you attack an Ithzir herald, sending the grey luminesence flying towards it!

[SMR result: 27 (Open d100: -40)]

An Ithzir herald dodges out of the way!

Roundtime: 3 sec.

Roundtime changed to 6 seconds.

R>

An Ithzir herald's voice sounds as if she is speaking through a long metal tube as she cocks her head, saying, "Munarop ptath lethi ka hrax?"

The Ithzir herald cocks her head at you.

An Ithzir herald starts singing an alien song in a reverberating, sonorous voice.

R>incarnate smite target

Calling upon your patron to guide your attack, you watch as a grey luminescence wraps around your spikestar. Gripping your spikestar tighly, you attack an Ithzir herald, sending the grey luminesence flying towards it!

[SMR result: 152 (Open d100: 93)]

An Ithzir herald is struck by the influx of divine energy, causing 91 damage!

An explosive burst engulfs her!

... 50 points of damage!

The Ithzir herald's eye bubbles and bursts along with most of the head!

The Ithzir herald falls to the ground in a crumpled heap.

The tingling sensation and sense of security leaves an Ithzir herald.

The brilliant luminescence fades from around an Ithzir herald.

The silvery luminescence fades from around an Ithzir herald.

The bright luminescence fades from around an Ithzir herald.

Roundtime: 3 sec.

Roundtime changed to 6 seconds.

R>

Your heightened awareness of your foes fades away.

>loot

You search the Ithzir herald.

She had a curved silvery blade.

You discard the herald's remaining useless equipment.

She didn't carry any silver.

She had nothing of interest.

An Ithzir herald's body shimmers slightly, then fades from view like a dissipating phantom.