I have recently been trying out different classes in F2P and notice a lot of [Because your account is free...you can purchase this in the shop] only to discover you cannot. I may be blind, but a majority of the shop items deal with lockers, chronomage and bounty passes. I was unable to locate spell rechargers, passes and the like. Were they eliminated?

I plan on addressing this tomorrow when I talk with the onsite staff. Because most people who use a F2P account appear to be using them as an alt account, and do all the SimuCoin purchases on their subscription account. This wasn't the intended use, because we didn't want subscribers getting confused, buying something, and being completely useless. But now most these items aren't being purchased because of the current setup.

It could also be what Doug is saying if you're not buying it on a subscribed account.

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Wyrom, APM

Well maybe the setup doesn't help. But overall my point is that all of this needs reviewed! Please help Wyrom. :)

Brief history of my playtime

I've played off and on since Prodigy. Never made it beyond level 10 (EDIT-almost 20 now!). Always thought someone with a Lord title was way cool. I've also played Dragonrealms a little bit. I read both forums every few years regardless if I'm playing. I'm not very good at either game.

I'll be referencing DR F2P a little bit in my post. When I do, I'll point it out. Otherwise I'm purely speaking about GS4.

Spell limitations

It's not fun to play a character and acquire a spell only to find out it has limitations on it. It's even worse when the limitations feel redundant or you have little recourse to overcome them. Limiting spells is the largest disappointed for me overall with the F2P setup.

Clarity of limitations-

The original posts about F2P and subsequent player documentation of actual limitations can be vague and inaccurate. It is immensely upsetting as a new player to work towards a spell that seems like it should work or you were told works with a pass to find out it doesn't. I've quit several times because of this. It'd be immensely helpful if a document could be released outlining which spells actually have limitations. PAFO is not okay here. Updating the play.net website seems like the best way of communicating this to a new player.

Mass attack spells-

There's a 5 minute cooldown if you hit someone with a mass spell. There's also a 30 second cooldown on using mass spells. Why are there two systems in place that do the same thing? This seems like a simple fix because there shouldn't be two penalties in place for the same thing.

For mass attack spells in general, I'd like to see a change to the current setup. Either allowing all spells to be used unrestricted with a 5 minute cooldown if you hit another person or updating the spells to use EVOKE (group friendly, unrestricted) or CAST (all targets, limited or restricted per existing rules) such as the updated Cone of Elements. I'd prefer the 5 minute cooldown across the board.

Item spells-

There are two types of spells in this category. Consumables and enchanting. Consumables are things such as scroll infusion, magical item creation, imbuing, etc. Enchanting covers the other creation systems that create permanent items. Could the consumable system be opened for F2P? I understand restricting enchantment system because then you run into mules who just exist for their times, but the consumable system seems like it wouldn't matter as much. I chased 714 because someone said I could use it with a pass. I couldn't. I quit. I'm currently chasing 420 cause someone else said I could use it with a pass. Almost there! I have a feeling I'm going to quit again. A possible solution for all creation spells is making the item bind to the character or self-only. This would allow the F2P to enjoy the spells but not profit from them.

As a note here, none of the Dragonrealms creation systems have any limitations whatsoever on them. The crafting economy is even larger in that game than it is here, since they don't have random gear drops. The F2P characters didn't take over or saturate the market there.

Simucoin Store

Overall the store needs to be revamped. There's lots of spell resets - why not just roll them all into one? Why doesn't Gift of Lumnis include the experience passes? Why do many of the passes have such strange limitations (ex. casting pass 15 minutes, experience pass 3 hours)? Loresinging one Simucoin purchase at a time? The system feels like it was created to never be used. Some things need to be combined, some need to be increased in duration or charges, and some need to be adjusted in price.

The huge one here are the experience passes. There's only one duration and that's for 3 hours. I was thinking about it last night since I'm nearing 20 and the xp penalty is going to get progressively worse. I have to buy a pass every 3 hours? There should be experience passes for longer durations. Dragonrealms has 3 day and 30 day passes.

If the suggested changes above regarding spells aren't possible (mass attack spells, item spells), it'd be nice to have options in the store to truly overcome limitations. Such as a pass that allows item creation or unrestricted mass attack spells. There's a pass currently in the store that lets you reset your 30 second cooldown for mass attack spells. It's one use at a time. Meaning I have to go back to the store every 30 seconds and purchase another one.

With both of the above complaints, I asked other players what they thought. The reaction I got was to buy a bunch of passes and make macro or script to pop them as needed. That's the advice for a new player. Script through the problem. That's not the correct answer for this.

Overall thoughts and impressions

Having played through Dragonrealms and GS4 F2P a little bit, Dragonrealms seems to have a better model. The Simucoin purchases are optional. They exist to speed you up, not as a method for you to actually experience the game. And by speed you up, I mean bring you to the base level of a subscriber. There's so many restrictions in GS4 F2P model that I feel overwhelmed as a newish player. And I'm not talking about societies or guilds because I've never done those before. It truly feels like the F2P model was created not from the viewpoint of a new player, but from that of an existing player that means to abuse the system somehow.

All of the above comments are made from the point of view of a player who *will never subscribe to this game.* I have no intention of ever subscribing. I do want to throw copious amounts of money at Simutronics through the Simucoin store. I have spent money in the store. I stopped though as I progressed and realized how poorly setup the system is.

Great feedback. Thank you for the well-thought out and organized post. I'll see what we can tackle to make the F2P experience better.

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Wyrom, APM

<< Rhazin, if you narrow it down. What were positives? >>

Purely nostalgia. The way the system is now, it's either going to remind you about the game and make you resub your old accounts or it's going to frustrate you as a new player into subbing. If you play in the current system with the goal of just dipping your toes in sporadically and seeing some numbers fly by when you kill monsters, then it's fine and you can enjoy your nostalgic moment. Then turn it off and go back to your life.

The other thing that I feel is a positive is the new player sprite quest. I mentioned this in my original thread, but the person who made that did a very good job. Returning after forever and never really having understood much about the game, it helped me get the basics down. It'd be nice to see another layer to this at a bit higher level (5? 10?) that explained more complicated bits about the game, such as Loresinging, the Abandoned Inn Crystal, padding, weighting, etc. Then another at a higher level that explained more.

It's easy to forget for people who have played this for so long, but there are so many layers to GS4 that are hard for the average newb to really understand. I've been playing off and on for two decades and reading the forums throughout and I still don't understand how things work. This aspect isn't explained away as simply as "talk to other players and they'll explain" because really, the average player might not know about Lich or Players Corner or just doesn't connect with the right people to answer basic questions.

Sorry I'm always long winded.

tldr - nostalgia and sprite quest are good. ;)

>I've been playing off and on for two decades and reading the forums throughout and I still don't understand how things work.

Just out of curiosity, what did you think about the overall speed of combat? Too fast? Too slow? Just right? I ask because Simu's had this thing lately where they want to slow combat down because they're worried it'll be too fast and confusing for new F2P players. I know you're technically not a new player, but yeah.

~ Methais

Reading the wizard nerfs:
http://i.imgur.com/hNaDm98.gif

<< Just out of curiosity, what did you think about the overall speed of combat? Too fast? Too slow? Just right? I ask because Simu's had this thing lately where they want to slow combat down because they're worried it'll be too fast and confusing for new F2P players. I know you're technically not a new player, but yeah. >>

I'll make a new thread over in General for this.

>It's easy to forget for people who have played this for so long, but there are so many layers to GS4 that are hard for the average newb to really understand. I've been playing off and on for two decades and reading the forums throughout and I still don't understand how things work. This aspect isn't explained away as simply as "talk to other players and they'll explain" because really, the average player might not know about Lich or Players Corner or just doesn't connect with the right people to answer basic questions.

This is exactly what the Mentors are for! Any questions that you might have: either the sprite quest can take you there, or you can use DIR Silverwood. Once there you can ring the bell, and if there's a Mentor available they'll come help you out. Granted, staff (Mentors, Hosts, and GMs) can't really speak to 3rd party add-ons or forums like Lich or PC, but you can ring the bell no matter what your level.

That being said: The Wiki is prominently linked from the front page, and is the product of many decades of player and GM knowledge. Right now, there's over 5 THOUSAND entries, and one of them has a very nice writeup about the Lich software, two links away from the front page ("for more articles on getting started click here!", "Lich (Software)") with links at the bottom to the Players Corner Forum for more information.

As of right now 280 of 307 GS Prime players are actively using lnet, with 242 tuned to a specific channel - I'd be willing to bet that the average person would be happy to tell a new player about Lich and the Players Corner, but because they're OOC topics they're not discussed in public.

If reading the Wiki isn't your thing and you learn better when someone's there to answer questions, then you can still rely on the Mentors. They have classes from time to time on such topics as Loresinging, Chrism Making, and Runestones, to name just a few. You can even suggest classes that you think would benefit players to know more about!

>If reading the Wiki isn't your thing and you learn better when someone's there to answer questions, then you can still rely on the Mentors. They have classes from time to time on such topics as Loresinging, Chrism Making, and Runestones, to name just a few. You can even suggest classes that you think would benefit players to know more about!

One problem: F2P characters can't make or use chrisms, nor can they loresing. Yay runestones?