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>Then CS needs to have -50 when you're knocked over, -20 when you're stunned, etc. Actually we should get rid of it, just make everything use AS/DS.
This is disingenous. I don't know how you're hunting, but given a high enough endroll, the right CS-based spell will almost always instantly kill. 719? Meanwhile, your bolt AS could exceed a creature's DS by 300-400 and it still wouldn't be guaranteed death.
LADYFLEUR
LADYFLEUR
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 05:47 PM CDT
>If I were going to be getting hit on a regular basis I'd much rather have 520 than 716.
What? I thought you said you played a "real pure". BOTH sorcerers and wizards tank up so that they DON'T get hit, much less on a regular basis. The whole beauty behind 716 is that it flares, nearly every attack attempt, even on complete misses. It starts to stun and deal round-based rot flare damage to the creatures BEFORE they are able to recover and attack you. I've had bandits and other creatures flat out instantly die from 716's "reactive" flares before I can even attempt to attack it.
And all of that 716 damage/instant death is with zero lore on my sorcerers.
Maybe we should swap professions. Where's that class change option again?
What? I thought you said you played a "real pure". BOTH sorcerers and wizards tank up so that they DON'T get hit, much less on a regular basis. The whole beauty behind 716 is that it flares, nearly every attack attempt, even on complete misses. It starts to stun and deal round-based rot flare damage to the creatures BEFORE they are able to recover and attack you. I've had bandits and other creatures flat out instantly die from 716's "reactive" flares before I can even attempt to attack it.
And all of that 716 damage/instant death is with zero lore on my sorcerers.
Maybe we should swap professions. Where's that class change option again?
GS4-VIDUUS
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 06:30 PM CDT
Okay, but then where is the problem in keeping the instant kill option open at the high end of the lore thresholds? You know, to reward those who have trained a lot in a single lore?
What instant kill option? The incineration effect?
Viduus
What instant kill option? The incineration effect?
Viduus
FIREPHOENIX
GS4-VIDUUS
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 06:46 PM CDT
So, I'm trying something new.
-Disclaimer - everything under this line is my personal opinion and nothing more
>>520-Stoneskin
>>Earth elementals have a similiar yet more annoying ability as well.
>>You strike the earth elemental, but your warhammer connects awkwardly with a rocky protrusion! The jarring strike numbs your grasp!
>>Roundtime: 5 sec.
I think the base spell needs work. I think the above idea has merit.
>>Weaponfire proposal
>>Moving on to something to benefit warmages. I'm sure I saw someone talking about boosting weaponfire but I don't recall how. My vague understanding of immolater weapons is also the source of this idea.
>>Weaponfire- When cast on a weapon it creates an aura around the weapon allowing an additional flare on every swing. Have it be so the flare damage is a fairly static number of say 10-15 before lores. (similiar in potency to paladin crusade of heavy damage weighting pre/lore) With the proposed haste changes, what do you do during your haste cooldown? Why you wave the weapon at the creature causing damage like the immolate weapons do, perhaps a bonus to waving while in offensive stance to promote this usage more by warmages yet still giving the option to the casters.. Now to make this work factor in a new resource to give you your charges. Base this resource on your total number of elemental lore ranks. Either 1 lore rank=1 resource, or 1 lore bonus=1 resource. A swing reduces this number by 1, a wave of the weapon reduces it by something like 10-15. If you've used up your resource charges, the same cost in mana is applied instead. Resource regeneration I'd leave up to a NIR with a spreadsheet. The intent is that you have an alternate attack form during the haste cooldown period which last proposal would be between the minute 5 and 6 mark. Using this resource you could either try and knock out your hunt before minute 5, or ration your resource+mana to have an alternative for that minute.
I don't know that I feel warmages need any additional combat expansion if they have 100% uptime on haste, but the idea has merit so maybe useful for another class.
Viduus
-Disclaimer - everything under this line is my personal opinion and nothing more
>>520-Stoneskin
>>Earth elementals have a similiar yet more annoying ability as well.
>>You strike the earth elemental, but your warhammer connects awkwardly with a rocky protrusion! The jarring strike numbs your grasp!
>>Roundtime: 5 sec.
I think the base spell needs work. I think the above idea has merit.
>>Weaponfire proposal
>>Moving on to something to benefit warmages. I'm sure I saw someone talking about boosting weaponfire but I don't recall how. My vague understanding of immolater weapons is also the source of this idea.
>>Weaponfire- When cast on a weapon it creates an aura around the weapon allowing an additional flare on every swing. Have it be so the flare damage is a fairly static number of say 10-15 before lores. (similiar in potency to paladin crusade of heavy damage weighting pre/lore) With the proposed haste changes, what do you do during your haste cooldown? Why you wave the weapon at the creature causing damage like the immolate weapons do, perhaps a bonus to waving while in offensive stance to promote this usage more by warmages yet still giving the option to the casters.. Now to make this work factor in a new resource to give you your charges. Base this resource on your total number of elemental lore ranks. Either 1 lore rank=1 resource, or 1 lore bonus=1 resource. A swing reduces this number by 1, a wave of the weapon reduces it by something like 10-15. If you've used up your resource charges, the same cost in mana is applied instead. Resource regeneration I'd leave up to a NIR with a spreadsheet. The intent is that you have an alternate attack form during the haste cooldown period which last proposal would be between the minute 5 and 6 mark. Using this resource you could either try and knock out your hunt before minute 5, or ration your resource+mana to have an alternative for that minute.
I don't know that I feel warmages need any additional combat expansion if they have 100% uptime on haste, but the idea has merit so maybe useful for another class.
Viduus
ASPEN
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 06:49 PM CDT
>What? I thought you said you played a "real pure". BOTH sorcerers and wizards tank up so that they DON'T get hit, much less on a regular basis. The whole beauty behind 716 is that it flares, nearly every attack attempt, even on complete misses. It starts to stun and deal round-based rot flare damage to the creatures BEFORE they are able to recover and attack you. I've had bandits and other creatures flat out instantly die from 716's "reactive" flares before I can even attempt to attack it.
Like I said, IF I got hit on a regular basis.
Younger wizards, middle level wizards, still get hit and die. They would find much more value in a spell that keeps them from dying, vs a spell that allows them to more quickly kill things. Defense is always more valuable.
Also, it isn't even close to every attack, or "nearly every attack." But you're right, I've gotten a couple kills with it too. Must be all that necromancy.
GOLDENOAK2
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 06:51 PM CDT
Wow! I left my PC for an hour and came back to almost 50 new posts that said the exact same thing as the last 50 posts, but with the nouns and verbs in different order.
Its like one of those hamster wheels they keep running around but never get anywhere.
Its like one of those hamster wheels they keep running around but never get anywhere.
SILVEAN
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 06:54 PM CDT
>Recent Fleurs posts about sorcery.
I should add that Pestilence (716) without lore involves a 25% chance to activate, a hidden warding roll, and only works 5 times before needing to be recast. It's still a very nice spell though. You also use the example of 719 as a one-cast killing spell but it is heavily dependent on what sort of creature you are casting it on, i.e. whether they are "magical" and susceptible to crits.
I should add that Pestilence (716) without lore involves a 25% chance to activate, a hidden warding roll, and only works 5 times before needing to be recast. It's still a very nice spell though. You also use the example of 719 as a one-cast killing spell but it is heavily dependent on what sort of creature you are casting it on, i.e. whether they are "magical" and susceptible to crits.
RROY
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:01 PM CDT
<At first I looked at that wall and I was like whoa. Then I powered through it and I'm glad I did. Hilarious.>
~ Konacon
Heh he managed to say a lot of what I been saying over a ton of posts into one post... He just proved not only is he a smart coder, but efficient!
Just an elf about town...
BALEKIA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:25 PM CDT
The snarky Cynic in me wants to point out that this stuff HAS accomplished something I haven't seen on this board in a long time... untold cooperation among the players. I'm seeing people agree who I don't think I've ever seen agree on anything.
Me against my brother...
Me against my brother...
ERYKK2
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:28 PM CDT
| >Right... thats true, then again, they do hit everything in the room. Is there a mass stun everything in the room spell I'm not familiar with? I'm sure you're not walking about mass evil eye which requires so much setup, and to which so many things are straight up immune. Mass calm? I guess 1120 is pretty cool. It messes up bolt splash damage though. |
| 135 is the mass stun everything in the room spell. |
| >Still, ewave is a pretty awesome spell, there is probably not an empath or cleric in game that doesn't wish they had it. |
| It's nice when underhunting or hunting like level, but once you start to uphunt (second floor of Nelemar, the Scatter, warcamps), e-wave doesn't work nearly as well as the CS-based mass disablers. My empaths and cleric certainly don't wish they had it, even when solo'ing. The only reason I don't use 135 more often in bandits is because there's the chance to accidentally injure or kill others who may wander in at the wrong time. Otherwise, it's far more effective than 410. |
Another thing about CS-disablers is that they last FOREVER. Take a look at the duration of MjS spells. They're all crazy long.
201 is 5 * warding failure.
A 140 endroll = 200 seconds.
210 is 30s + 1s per warding failure.
A 140 endroll = 70 seconds.
212 is 10 + MjS ranks/5 + warding failure * 3. (Let's assume 50 spell ranks)
10+10 + 3*warding failure.
A 140 endroll = 140 seconds.
214 is 13s + warding failure in seconds.
A 140 endroll = 53 seconds
216 is 2 * warding failure.
A 140 endroll = 80 seconds.
I can't think of one elemental disabler that lasts that long. I also believe that Spiritual TD is lower than Elemental TD, so they tend to get higher endroll results on average.
505 is 5s + 1s per 2 warding failure.
A 140 endroll = 25 seconds
Maybe 505 should see a longer base stun, and 1s per warding failure, possibly with a TD pushdown. Plus, a multi-cast ability.
LADYFLEUR
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:31 PM CDT
>>520-Stoneskin
>>Earth elementals have a similiar yet more annoying ability as well.
>>You strike the earth elemental, but your warhammer connects awkwardly with a rocky protrusion! The jarring strike numbs your grasp!
>>Roundtime: 5 sec.
>I think the base spell needs work. I think the above idea has merit.
The above idea does have merit. Even better would be if it had a 25% base chance to deal damage to the attacker, you know from cutting their hands on your rocky skin. It could have a 5 hit use before needing to be refreshed, which I think is appropriate given it's a 20th level spell.
>>Earth elementals have a similiar yet more annoying ability as well.
>>You strike the earth elemental, but your warhammer connects awkwardly with a rocky protrusion! The jarring strike numbs your grasp!
>>Roundtime: 5 sec.
>I think the base spell needs work. I think the above idea has merit.
The above idea does have merit. Even better would be if it had a 25% base chance to deal damage to the attacker, you know from cutting their hands on your rocky skin. It could have a 5 hit use before needing to be refreshed, which I think is appropriate given it's a 20th level spell.
BALEKIA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:33 PM CDT
>> The above idea does have merit. Even better would be if it had a 25% base chance to deal damage to the attacker, you know from cutting their hands on your rocky skin. It could have a 5 hit use before needing to be refreshed, which I think is appropriate given it's a 20th level spell.
What if the damage was the lore effect? Negation + RT seems acceptable for base effect, and then reactive flare/damage as a lore kicker?
LALAKERCLAN
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:33 PM CDT
Will I be allowed to convert my 46 wizard into a sorc or cleric?
DRUMPEL
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:33 PM CDT
| I agree it's an issue. I think it's unlikely we completely redesign the lore progression, but I would like to implement some unique, awe-inspiring abilities for each lore in the 150-200 range to give a nice reward to those who dedicate themselves. |
| GameMaster Estild |
That'll be awesome to see some specialized abilities for those that focus a single lore. I'm still unimpressed by the rate of return for the dedicated lore training when compared to someone that dabbles in it.
At least I know it's "most likely" in the works down the road. Thanks.
-Drumpel
ZENDADA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:53 PM CDT
ESTILD, VIDUUS, KONACON, CONTEMPLAR, IXIX, CYRAEX, et al.,
Speaking for myself I am anxious for the changes that have been proposed. I'm ready for any challenge. Bring it.
This constant headache over things that have not happened yet is laborious and tiresome.
For myself I say throw out your chips. Lets get into it, lets get our hands dirty, THEN lets debate about it.
It is very gracious of you all to not only try to entertain players by providing new and interesting game mechanics but also to engage with players before those changes.
I appreciate everything done so far. Lets move forward!
Chad, player of a few
Speaking for myself I am anxious for the changes that have been proposed. I'm ready for any challenge. Bring it.
This constant headache over things that have not happened yet is laborious and tiresome.
For myself I say throw out your chips. Lets get into it, lets get our hands dirty, THEN lets debate about it.
It is very gracious of you all to not only try to entertain players by providing new and interesting game mechanics but also to engage with players before those changes.
I appreciate everything done so far. Lets move forward!
Chad, player of a few
ERYKK2
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 07:59 PM CDT
| >>520-Stoneskin |
| >>Earth elementals have a similiar yet more annoying ability as well. |
| >>You strike the earth elemental, but your warhammer connects awkwardly with a rocky protrusion! The jarring strike numbs your grasp! |
| >>Roundtime: 5 sec. |
| >I think the base spell needs work. I think the above idea has merit. |
| The above idea does have merit. Even better would be if it had a 25% base chance to deal damage to the attacker, you know from cutting their hands on your rocky skin. It could have a 5 hit use before needing to be refreshed, which I think is appropriate given it's a 20th level spell. |
I would prefer this over the current implementation.
Plus:
Earth lore also increases the base chance for the effect by 2 * seed 9 summation. <
Look! Seed 9!
KEITHOBAD
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 08:26 PM CDT
Preventing the resolution of the attack is the key part. After we're legged and stunned for 8rnds on the ground, neither the 5hp damage reduction nor the 40 damage flare is going to be doing much for us.
I personally prefer a reliable effect for defense, rather than a small % proc effect but almost anything would be better than the current 520.
HJELTE
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 08:29 PM CDT
Why would we dedicate two spells that have the same effects? We already have our pretty much watered down version of 319 in our 540 slot.
~Whirlin
~Whirlin
KEITHOBAD
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 08:54 PM CDT
That's a pretty good point, really. I think some type of crit divisor/crit padding/DF reducer thing would probably be better overall. Although if you add the weak %'s all together from 414, 540 and this proposal maybe we end up getting somewhere half decent.
Why use one spell slot when we can waste 3, isn't that the wizard motto?
HJELTE
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 09:01 PM CDT
| Why use one spell slot when we can waste 3, isn't that the wizard motto? |
I think so... I'm jealous of GS3 Empath's spell variety!
~Whirlin
ZENDADA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 09:15 PM CDT
| I think so... I'm jealous of GS3 Empath's spell variety! |
| ~Whirlin |
What makes you an expert?
Chad, player of a few
HJELTE
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 09:25 PM CDT
I stayed at a holiday inn last night.
And I read Empathic Healing 101... by Lady Eillie Lindenleaf, Last updated: 12-6-95... and it's AMAZING
http://www.tamcon.com/GS3/healtips1.html
~Whirlin
And I read Empathic Healing 101... by Lady Eillie Lindenleaf, Last updated: 12-6-95... and it's AMAZING
http://www.tamcon.com/GS3/healtips1.html
~Whirlin
THROGG
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 09:29 PM CDT
An excerpt from the introduction to said Empath guide:
>> While changes to our spell list in the future may change this, I expect we will always be the least effective hunters.<<
Muaahahahahahahaaha!
>> While changes to our spell list in the future may change this, I expect we will always be the least effective hunters.<<
Muaahahahahahahaaha!
HJELTE
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 09:32 PM CDT
There's all sorts of them...
http://www.tamcon.com/GS3/professions.html
This website makes me happy.
~Whirlin
http://www.tamcon.com/GS3/professions.html
This website makes me happy.
~Whirlin
THROGG
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 09:36 PM CDT
30 posts in 5 minutes. Can no one stop the madness?
Since Simu appears in favor of cooldowns, can we have a cooldown on posts in this folder? Once you make a post, you can't make another one for the next two hours.
Since Simu appears in favor of cooldowns, can we have a cooldown on posts in this folder? Once you make a post, you can't make another one for the next two hours.
PEREGRINEFALCON
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 10:41 PM CDT
I decide to go into the office to work today and when I come home... 274 new posts in this folder?!?!
So... 30 minutes of reading/skimming later:
>> Haste (506): we're still iterating over a new design for the spell. We'll release more details in the near future.
Looking forward to it!
>> Rapid Fire (515)
Personally not interested in seeing this move to 540. Let's put something smexy in 540 instead.
>> Cone of Elements (518) and Immolate (519)
Love the EVOKE idea and thank you very much for preserving the Immolation disabler goodness!
>> Enchant Item (925) updated proposal
I think that is an interesting and workable approach for those that want to focus on enchanting!
>> ... and nothing else has been suggested or requested... probably because you guys are too busy clinging to the old rather than embracing the new. -- Viduus
Hopefully I'm not taking this out of context I know I posted a suggestion about stacking flares for warmages that could effect AS, weapon speed, etc. Also suggested using enchanting to enhance common flares (better flares in terms of frequency or flare power). Also requested Stone skin as a stun reducer (and there were a decent number of posts with different ideas for stone skin in general).
AND I DEFINITELY ASKED FOR A WAR PONY WITH FLAMING NOSTRILS (or something like that).
>> Example: aivren bit me because warlock dispelled 503 and I instantly died on a 115 endroll. Suggestion improved 520 via blah blah blah. -- Viduus
I like games so I'll play!
An etherial triton sentry cast his spell of doom on me as soon as I walked in the room and BOOM! I'd like a chance to occasionally turn the tables on these evil doomcasters so how about modifying stone skin so that if has a small chance to reflect spells back at the caster so I can see how they like it!
The greater water elementals have some nasty killer shoop-de-whoop ability which seems to insta-kill me far too frequently. How about enhancing Temporal Reversion so that it works against these types of attacks as well (hidden warding roll? Maybe it already does but not sure that I've EVER seen it kick in for the water elemental insta-kill attack.
The voids in the rift are evil and seem to covet my eyes with their critical voidey-ness. For that matter, I am obsessively protective of my eyes and really don't like it when ANYTHING tries to harm their perfect orbiness. How about letting me cast some sort cool protective 'air goggles' spell that helps better protect my eyes and face from critical strikes?
I'm far too attached to my collectors edition runestaves to actually take any of them on an actual hunt. How about teaching my familiar to FETCH my runestave and return it to me should I drop it somewhere?
These are all serious suggestions (despite the silly delivery) so if they aren't quite what you were expecting/looking for give me a little feedback and I'll happily expand on each of these some more (and probably provide some additional ideas/suggestions in the process).
-- Robert aka Faulkil
"All wizards are beginners; some of us have just been beginning longer!"
So... 30 minutes of reading/skimming later:
>> Haste (506): we're still iterating over a new design for the spell. We'll release more details in the near future.
Looking forward to it!
>> Rapid Fire (515)
Personally not interested in seeing this move to 540. Let's put something smexy in 540 instead.
>> Cone of Elements (518) and Immolate (519)
Love the EVOKE idea and thank you very much for preserving the Immolation disabler goodness!
>> Enchant Item (925) updated proposal
I think that is an interesting and workable approach for those that want to focus on enchanting!
>> ... and nothing else has been suggested or requested... probably because you guys are too busy clinging to the old rather than embracing the new. -- Viduus
Hopefully I'm not taking this out of context I know I posted a suggestion about stacking flares for warmages that could effect AS, weapon speed, etc. Also suggested using enchanting to enhance common flares (better flares in terms of frequency or flare power). Also requested Stone skin as a stun reducer (and there were a decent number of posts with different ideas for stone skin in general).
AND I DEFINITELY ASKED FOR A WAR PONY WITH FLAMING NOSTRILS (or something like that).
>> Example: aivren bit me because warlock dispelled 503 and I instantly died on a 115 endroll. Suggestion improved 520 via blah blah blah. -- Viduus
I like games so I'll play!
An etherial triton sentry cast his spell of doom on me as soon as I walked in the room and BOOM! I'd like a chance to occasionally turn the tables on these evil doomcasters so how about modifying stone skin so that if has a small chance to reflect spells back at the caster so I can see how they like it!
The greater water elementals have some nasty killer shoop-de-whoop ability which seems to insta-kill me far too frequently. How about enhancing Temporal Reversion so that it works against these types of attacks as well (hidden warding roll? Maybe it already does but not sure that I've EVER seen it kick in for the water elemental insta-kill attack.
The voids in the rift are evil and seem to covet my eyes with their critical voidey-ness. For that matter, I am obsessively protective of my eyes and really don't like it when ANYTHING tries to harm their perfect orbiness. How about letting me cast some sort cool protective 'air goggles' spell that helps better protect my eyes and face from critical strikes?
I'm far too attached to my collectors edition runestaves to actually take any of them on an actual hunt. How about teaching my familiar to FETCH my runestave and return it to me should I drop it somewhere?
These are all serious suggestions (despite the silly delivery) so if they aren't quite what you were expecting/looking for give me a little feedback and I'll happily expand on each of these some more (and probably provide some additional ideas/suggestions in the process).
-- Robert aka Faulkil
"All wizards are beginners; some of us have just been beginning longer!"
LADYFLEUR
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 11:15 PM CDT
>The EVOKE version will not be able to instant kill the target, does not benefit from the extra EL:F crit, does not have the enhanced base damage, but it will disable the target similar to the existing version. This should give wizards the choice of how to use the spell (either as a lethal warding attack or as a non-lethal disabling spell).
Since it's CS-based, can the EVOKE version be a mass CS disabler similar to 135 (which is a minor circle spell)?
>Enchant proposal
Will it be possible to eliminate the 3% chance of catastrophic failure that exists now? Ensorcell is both much shorter in time required for actively played characters, is instant, does not require gear to be unusable for months on end, and has zero risk of negative consequences to the item itself. I would like to see something similar for Enchant Item.
Since it's CS-based, can the EVOKE version be a mass CS disabler similar to 135 (which is a minor circle spell)?
>Enchant proposal
Will it be possible to eliminate the 3% chance of catastrophic failure that exists now? Ensorcell is both much shorter in time required for actively played characters, is instant, does not require gear to be unusable for months on end, and has zero risk of negative consequences to the item itself. I would like to see something similar for Enchant Item.
GS4-VIDUUS
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 11:15 PM CDT
>>An etherial triton sentry cast his spell of doom on me as soon as I walked in the room and BOOM! I'd like a chance to occasionally turn the tables on these evil doomcasters so how about modifying stone skin so that if has a small chance to reflect spells back at the caster so I can see how they like it!
I'm not sure it fits for stone skin to do that. Our suspension of belief when it comes to lore training only goes so far! Maybe if it were water or ice skin you'd have a case!
>>The greater water elementals have some nasty killer shoop-de-whoop ability which seems to insta-kill me far too frequently. How about enhancing Temporal Reversion so that it works against these types of attacks as well (hidden warding roll? Maybe it already does but not sure that I've EVER seen it kick in for the water elemental insta-kill attack.
This may actually be a bug if it doesn't help, have you bugged it so we can take a closer look? I'm not up to speed on the "shoop-de-whoop" maneuver.
>>The voids in the rift are evil and seem to covet my eyes with their critical voidey-ness. For that matter, I am obsessively protective of my eyes and really don't like it when ANYTHING tries to harm their perfect orbiness. How about letting me cast some sort cool protective 'air goggles' spell that helps better protect my eyes and face from critical strikes?
You mean like a helm?
>>I'm far too attached to my collectors edition runestaves to actually take any of them on an actual hunt. How about teaching my familiar to FETCH my runestave and return it to me should I drop it somewhere?
Interesting suggestion, but wouldn't it be better suited for ACs?
Viduus
I'm not sure it fits for stone skin to do that. Our suspension of belief when it comes to lore training only goes so far! Maybe if it were water or ice skin you'd have a case!
>>The greater water elementals have some nasty killer shoop-de-whoop ability which seems to insta-kill me far too frequently. How about enhancing Temporal Reversion so that it works against these types of attacks as well (hidden warding roll? Maybe it already does but not sure that I've EVER seen it kick in for the water elemental insta-kill attack.
This may actually be a bug if it doesn't help, have you bugged it so we can take a closer look? I'm not up to speed on the "shoop-de-whoop" maneuver.
>>The voids in the rift are evil and seem to covet my eyes with their critical voidey-ness. For that matter, I am obsessively protective of my eyes and really don't like it when ANYTHING tries to harm their perfect orbiness. How about letting me cast some sort cool protective 'air goggles' spell that helps better protect my eyes and face from critical strikes?
You mean like a helm?
>>I'm far too attached to my collectors edition runestaves to actually take any of them on an actual hunt. How about teaching my familiar to FETCH my runestave and return it to me should I drop it somewhere?
Interesting suggestion, but wouldn't it be better suited for ACs?
Viduus
LADYFLEUR
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/02/2015 11:20 PM CDT
>I'm not sure it fits for stone skin to do that. Our suspension of belief when it comes to lore training only goes so far! Maybe if it were water or ice skin you'd have a case!
What about for 540 to reflect spells then? The DS boost/time warp is nice, but it is generally not what saves the day. A TD booster such as 115 provides would even be more useful in general.
>This may actually be a bug if it doesn't help, have you bugged it so we can take a closer look? I'm not up to speed on the "shoop-de-whoop" maneuver.
I think he's talking about the whirlpool. Though you should really leave the room if the GWE has reached that stage.
>Call Familiar
Is there any plan to give them some functional use in combat, similar to what all of the other professions with "pets" enjoy?
What about for 540 to reflect spells then? The DS boost/time warp is nice, but it is generally not what saves the day. A TD booster such as 115 provides would even be more useful in general.
>This may actually be a bug if it doesn't help, have you bugged it so we can take a closer look? I'm not up to speed on the "shoop-de-whoop" maneuver.
I think he's talking about the whirlpool. Though you should really leave the room if the GWE has reached that stage.
>Call Familiar
Is there any plan to give them some functional use in combat, similar to what all of the other professions with "pets" enjoy?
ARIETTA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 12:29 AM CDT
I like Temporal Reversion (540) just the way it is. I think it's an awesome defensive ability, thoroughly flavorful, and uniquely powerful. It is one of the most "wizardly" abilities. Moving it down to 515 would inevitably be accompanied with some kind of down-tweak. Please don't do that.
KEITHOBAD
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 12:52 AM CDT
>Interesting suggestion, but wouldn't it be better suited for ACs?
What do you see as the purpose of familiars? Because, from what I see in game, it seems the answer is: "Not much."
Our 30th level professional spell is basically equivalent to a 1,250 silver item commonly found in the treasure system. It's ability to find people is both slow AND ineffective. We can't even keep one we like without careful maintenance because although we have a convoluted way of making talismans to do just that, they don't even capture the adjectives.
It's a mess.
Considering this thing is taking up TWO high level professional circle slots, it would be nice if it was improved. Saving weapons would be great. Adjacent teleporting would be great. Hell, even making it so finding people worked more than 50% of the time would be an improvement. Albeit a weak one.
I agree with Arietta, although from a position of ignorance. As a warmage 540 actually sounds pretty useful but I'm not quite there yet. I don't want it nerfed before I get to try it :(
520 has seen a multitude of suggestions over the years, but I think giving it an armor-like nature would be best. Whether that means DF reduction, crit divisors or crit padding, I dunno. But if you want warmages swinging slowly, we could use some protection for when we inevitably get nailed.
ARIETTA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 01:04 AM CDT
I think Rapid Fire (515) should remain in its current location. The stated purpose of the changes is to make it more situational. Even some of the most vocal detractors of change have agreed with that idea. It will still be a great spell. And the removal of the "auto prep" function may make it even more usable and attractive to a majority of mages. I think a cooldown period seems reasonable, for both mechanical and IC reasons. Surely such a flurry of casting would cause some fatigue, after all. It's not always all about mechanics.
~ GtG
~ GtG
ARIETTA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 01:08 AM CDT
I use Haste (506) for a variety of purposes, mostly convenience. The only time I like to keep it "always on" is when hunting bandits. It's super useful not only to lessen RT from maneuvers, but to help search for ambushes. The rest of the time, I use it for foraging, searching for heirlooms, eating herbs, certain climbs, swims, etc. I also like to keep pickers, empaths and loresingers hasted. It's a wildly useful ability that cuts down on tedium.
A couple observations, however. One, is it fair that wizards, and only wizards, have native access to this time-saving ability? Granted, we can cast it on others. But not too many players have wizards available to keep them hasted. And sure, we can imbed it for others. But a wizard is still required, and magic items are consumable. Wizards are the only ones with the ability to mitigate something that every character suffers from.
[Before someone raises the point, I know bards have Tonis...but it offers nowhere near the reduction in RT that wizards receive from haste.]
The other factor is, of course, the use of haste in combat. I believe that is mainly where the issue lies. If so, I wonder if there's not a way of differentiating haste used in combat from when it's used in more mundane circumstances?
All considered, I think it's reasonable for Haste to have a cooldown. When you consider the actual implications of being "hasted" from an in-character standpoint, it makes sense that a period of rest might be required. Some may remember, the original Haste spell from AD&D actually induced fatigue, and supposedly aged the character considerably. Those were effective deterrents to its continued use.
~ GtG
A couple observations, however. One, is it fair that wizards, and only wizards, have native access to this time-saving ability? Granted, we can cast it on others. But not too many players have wizards available to keep them hasted. And sure, we can imbed it for others. But a wizard is still required, and magic items are consumable. Wizards are the only ones with the ability to mitigate something that every character suffers from.
[Before someone raises the point, I know bards have Tonis...but it offers nowhere near the reduction in RT that wizards receive from haste.]
The other factor is, of course, the use of haste in combat. I believe that is mainly where the issue lies. If so, I wonder if there's not a way of differentiating haste used in combat from when it's used in more mundane circumstances?
All considered, I think it's reasonable for Haste to have a cooldown. When you consider the actual implications of being "hasted" from an in-character standpoint, it makes sense that a period of rest might be required. Some may remember, the original Haste spell from AD&D actually induced fatigue, and supposedly aged the character considerably. Those were effective deterrents to its continued use.
~ GtG
FIREPHOENIX
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 02:07 AM CDT
Responding to message 2175 from Whirlin. You provided the baseline critical rate for most of the bolts. I think Taverkin initially stated it to be around 25% earlier.
Melees have been brought up a few times in this debate as a comparison although it's moved to empath/cleric/sorcerer lately.
Warrior baseline AS at level 100 is 302 weapon ranks, 101 CM, 25 str bonus, +35 society and lets even say a 7x weapon (+35) with weapon bonding (10) and weapon spec (10). This is an attack strength of 518. Lets say it's the Cone of Maul type build so assume 30 ranks of ambush (70% location hit) and 55 MOC (3 focused strikes) with the maul DF.
Maul crit divisors seem to be head at 6, neck is 5, eye is 5, chest is 6, abdomen is 6, back is 6, arms/legs is 7.
Against a 300 health creature in chainmail at level 100 with 350 DS on a crit divisor of .375 DF this warrior needs a 260 endroll. Assume plane 4 rift crusaders are the template, but critable in this example.
A mstrike is 11 seconds of RT for 3 focused attacks so we're going to feint and a neck ambush for the level 5 crit divisor or head for 6 taking 7 seconds.
518 AS vs +350 DS vs AVD +26 (made up for chain) +d100 roll = 74 or higher to accomplish the level 6 critical divisor. 25% of the time this warrior can generate the end roll result to hit the crit kill, but will only hit that aimed location 70% of the time (30ambush/max CM) resulting in a scored hit in a different location.
I'm curious what this baseline crit kill % is because I want to know when I'm a killing machine. When I was younger as a sword and board warrior I'd have taken the 25% crit kill rate in a heartbeat, but I'm curious when I start generating some really nasty kill ratios.
Some help on my math and understanding? Before the "warriors wear platemail" responses we're in hard RT for 7-11 seconds with limited bolt DS and automatic death/disable to most/all CS castings. Stance dancing isn't an end-game style for any class.
-G
Melees have been brought up a few times in this debate as a comparison although it's moved to empath/cleric/sorcerer lately.
Warrior baseline AS at level 100 is 302 weapon ranks, 101 CM, 25 str bonus, +35 society and lets even say a 7x weapon (+35) with weapon bonding (10) and weapon spec (10). This is an attack strength of 518. Lets say it's the Cone of Maul type build so assume 30 ranks of ambush (70% location hit) and 55 MOC (3 focused strikes) with the maul DF.
Maul crit divisors seem to be head at 6, neck is 5, eye is 5, chest is 6, abdomen is 6, back is 6, arms/legs is 7.
Against a 300 health creature in chainmail at level 100 with 350 DS on a crit divisor of .375 DF this warrior needs a 260 endroll. Assume plane 4 rift crusaders are the template, but critable in this example.
A mstrike is 11 seconds of RT for 3 focused attacks so we're going to feint and a neck ambush for the level 5 crit divisor or head for 6 taking 7 seconds.
518 AS vs +350 DS vs AVD +26 (made up for chain) +d100 roll = 74 or higher to accomplish the level 6 critical divisor. 25% of the time this warrior can generate the end roll result to hit the crit kill, but will only hit that aimed location 70% of the time (30ambush/max CM) resulting in a scored hit in a different location.
I'm curious what this baseline crit kill % is because I want to know when I'm a killing machine. When I was younger as a sword and board warrior I'd have taken the 25% crit kill rate in a heartbeat, but I'm curious when I start generating some really nasty kill ratios.
Some help on my math and understanding? Before the "warriors wear platemail" responses we're in hard RT for 7-11 seconds with limited bolt DS and automatic death/disable to most/all CS castings. Stance dancing isn't an end-game style for any class.
-G
FIREPHOENIX
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 02:09 AM CDT
Whirlin also references this along with the unaimed body location chart on crit divisor for my crush example above:
Crush: Head T5, Neck T5, Eye T7, Chest T9, Ab/Back T8
Crush: Head T5, Neck T5, Eye T7, Chest T9, Ab/Back T8
DARAGON99
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 05:17 AM CDT
>>520-Stoneskin
>>Earth elementals have a similiar yet more annoying ability as well.
>>You strike the earth elemental, but your warhammer connects awkwardly with a rocky protrusion! The jarring strike numbs your grasp!
>>Roundtime: 5 sec.
>>I think the base spell needs work. I think the above idea has merit.
This is a decent idea, but I think 520 also needs it's damage absorbtion increased as well, right now it's pretty pathetic.
So here is a proposal, increase the damage absorbtion for this spell, add the rocky protrusions, and to balance is out, give it a weakness as well like:
Casting stone skin hinders one's actions cause you are turning your skin to stone, so baseline it adds 5 second physical RT. With training in (Stone or Air) decreases the 5 second rt by 1 per 10 ranks to a maximum decrease of 4 seconds. This time would also not be decreased by haste.
Just an idea.
ZENDADA
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 05:27 AM CDT
| I stayed at a holiday inn last night. |
| And I read Empathic Healing 101... by Lady Eillie Lindenleaf, Last updated: 12-6-95... and it's AMAZING |
| http://www.tamcon.com/GS3/healtips1.html |
| ~Whirlin |
And thats almost 20 years old.
Levity appreciated.
Chad, player of a few
VERSIN
BLACKKOBOLD
Re: Upcoming Spell Changes
09/03/2015 08:39 AM CDT
<All considered, I think it's reasonable for Haste to have a cooldown. When you consider the actual implications of being "hasted" from an in-character standpoint, it makes sense that a period <of rest might be required. Some may remember, the original Haste spell from AD&D actually induced fatigue, and supposedly aged the character considerably. Those were effective deterrents to <its continued use.
That's rather arbitrary isn't it? If you follow that logic, who deserves unique abilities? Did clerics deserve 319? I could just up and say that it's too powerful when an overtrained cleric can automatically block nearly all incoming first attacks. They completely bypass the RT of those bandit attacks, for instance. What about the monk provoke ability that increases the local spawn rate? If it really matters to me that monsters generate faster, who else can do that and is it fair they can cause extra targets to spawn? It seems purely a matter of preference to me which abilities we deem "overpowered" on the basis that nobody else has access to that power. It's a race to the bottom to decide how we can restrict every class's most powerful abilities so that they don't have any unique advantages over others, and when they do they are only situationally useful.
I do agree on 540, though. Leave that spell alone. It may not be what it used to be with a spell like 319 in existence, but it's a great spell for wizards and fits in perfectly with what wizards are supposed to be about. I would say the same about haste.
~Taverkin
That's rather arbitrary isn't it? If you follow that logic, who deserves unique abilities? Did clerics deserve 319? I could just up and say that it's too powerful when an overtrained cleric can automatically block nearly all incoming first attacks. They completely bypass the RT of those bandit attacks, for instance. What about the monk provoke ability that increases the local spawn rate? If it really matters to me that monsters generate faster, who else can do that and is it fair they can cause extra targets to spawn? It seems purely a matter of preference to me which abilities we deem "overpowered" on the basis that nobody else has access to that power. It's a race to the bottom to decide how we can restrict every class's most powerful abilities so that they don't have any unique advantages over others, and when they do they are only situationally useful.
I do agree on 540, though. Leave that spell alone. It may not be what it used to be with a spell like 319 in existence, but it's a great spell for wizards and fits in perfectly with what wizards are supposed to be about. I would say the same about haste.
~Taverkin
