I am having a very difficult time training summoning in any meaningfull way. I open Focus Damage, I cast Fireballs as I am fire aligned... I get 1 to 2/34 that it. I stuff 50 mana into the fireballs.
Why cant I learn summoning? Can someone please give me some tips on how to move this skill IF it is possible to move this skill in a meaningfull way in combat or even out of combat.
Thank you,
THOMPSONM10
GRACERLZ
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/27/2013 11:01 AM CST
More mana into a spell doesn't seem to make any difference as it pertains to gaining charge from spells, so casting more often would help. Fireball and MoA both teach decently with smaller amounts of mana, so that may be the way to go for someone fire aligned. I can cast quickly with a 15 mana FB with 420 TM and 10 mana MoA with 480 debil as a refence.
A shadowy black death spirit says, "Give us the annoying one, and the rest of you shall live."
* Mudge was just struck down!
The cackling continues. "The Darkness is pleased with your sacrifice."
A shadowy black death spirit says, "Give us the annoying one, and the rest of you shall live."
* Mudge was just struck down!
The cackling continues. "The Darkness is pleased with your sacrifice."
GRACERLZ
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/27/2013 11:02 AM CST
bah, no edit feature - 16 mana Fireball.
A shadowy black death spirit says, "Give us the annoying one, and the rest of you shall live."
* Mudge was just struck down!
The cackling continues. "The Darkness is pleased with your sacrifice."
A shadowy black death spirit says, "Give us the annoying one, and the rest of you shall live."
* Mudge was just struck down!
The cackling continues. "The Darkness is pleased with your sacrifice."
THOMPSONM10
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/27/2013 11:09 AM CST
>>More mana into a spell doesn't seem to make any difference as it pertains to gaining charge from spells, so casting more often would help.
Right but what exactly teaches this infernal skill? Casting spells from your alignment with an aligned pathway open or....? And the charges gaining charges what does that mean exactly and what do I do with said "charges"?
Sorry about the barrage of questions but I am trying to understand this skill no clue what it is how it works or what it does. IF there is some sort of comprehensive explanation somewhere someone can point me to I'd gladly read it.
Right but what exactly teaches this infernal skill? Casting spells from your alignment with an aligned pathway open or....? And the charges gaining charges what does that mean exactly and what do I do with said "charges"?
Sorry about the barrage of questions but I am trying to understand this skill no clue what it is how it works or what it does. IF there is some sort of comprehensive explanation somewhere someone can point me to I'd gladly read it.
GRACERLZ
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/27/2013 11:25 AM CST
>>Right but what exactly teaches this infernal skill?
Having a pathway up or summoning a familiar.
>>And the charges gaining charges what does that mean exactly and what do I do with said "charges"?
When you cast spells to the element you're aligned to, you build elemental charge. When you cast spells to the element you're opposed to, you lose elemental charge. You can also use SUMMON ADMITTANCE to gain charge - I would use this out of combat, because you automatically sit down to do it. You use that charge to feed your 'summoning' abilities - one of the two methods above I mentioned that actually train the Summoning skill.
>>IF there is some sort of comprehensive explanation somewhere someone can point me to I'd gladly read it.
There isn't much more to it with Summoning, but Elanthipedia has some information: http://elanthipedia.org/w/index.php/Warrior_Mage_3.0#Summoning
A shadowy black death spirit says, "Give us the annoying one, and the rest of you shall live."
* Mudge was just struck down!
The cackling continues. "The Darkness is pleased with your sacrifice."
Having a pathway up or summoning a familiar.
>>And the charges gaining charges what does that mean exactly and what do I do with said "charges"?
When you cast spells to the element you're aligned to, you build elemental charge. When you cast spells to the element you're opposed to, you lose elemental charge. You can also use SUMMON ADMITTANCE to gain charge - I would use this out of combat, because you automatically sit down to do it. You use that charge to feed your 'summoning' abilities - one of the two methods above I mentioned that actually train the Summoning skill.
>>IF there is some sort of comprehensive explanation somewhere someone can point me to I'd gladly read it.
There isn't much more to it with Summoning, but Elanthipedia has some information: http://elanthipedia.org/w/index.php/Warrior_Mage_3.0#Summoning
A shadowy black death spirit says, "Give us the annoying one, and the rest of you shall live."
* Mudge was just struck down!
The cackling continues. "The Darkness is pleased with your sacrifice."
DYERA7
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/27/2013 12:42 PM CST
Speaking of barrage, have you tried using barrage? It costs a lot of charge to use, but I've gotten a bunch of exp per use. This is with only ~120 ranks of summoning, so no idea about how it scales.
I've updated this a bit: http://elanthipedia.org/w/index.php/Warrior_mage#Summoning
Charge levels that I know of are on the Pathway command page.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/27/2013 03:33 PM CST
Out of combat it's simple to move; just SUMMON ADM a few times, then put up a pathway, and continue SUMMON ADM until you're locked. It should only take 10m or so.
In combat, put up a pathway and keep casting within your aligned book.
In combat, put up a pathway and keep casting within your aligned book.
SOMNIUM-VISUM
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/29/2013 10:17 AM CST
Outside of combat, I have been using "summon admittance". I tend to do this several times, then run a pathway, then repeat the summon admittance parts, and keep looping until locked.
In combat, I cant really find a good way to work it as yet, so I throw up RoS around me, and sit doing the summon admittance again
I'm still a bit unsure what this skill is actually used for. I rarely used pathways in the past, and probably still won't, so I am hoping we get something decent from this skill, or its a lot of training, to get a lot of ranks, for near nothing.
DANFORDS2
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/29/2013 11:04 AM CST
> I cant really find a good way to work it as yet
I'm right there with you. I aligned to Earth, start pathway power, and cast sts for TM. By the time TM is locked, I've run out of charge, and Summoning never gets above 10/34.
IMO, learning from Pathways needs bumped up a notch.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
I'm right there with you. I aligned to Earth, start pathway power, and cast sts for TM. By the time TM is locked, I've run out of charge, and Summoning never gets above 10/34.
IMO, learning from Pathways needs bumped up a notch.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
ELRIIC
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/29/2013 02:40 PM CST
Summoning is best learned outside of combat.
path focus damage
summon admittance
repeat.
Or, if you'd like to make the time really effective:
Top:
put path focus damage
put prep sw 25
put summon admitt
waitfor roundtime
pause 1
put cast
goto Top
You'll be locked in about ~5-10 minutes.
<<"earning too little skinning experience for a day or so isn't nearly as bad as having a spell that breaks your wings."
path focus damage
summon admittance
repeat.
Or, if you'd like to make the time really effective:
Top:
put path focus damage
put prep sw 25
put summon admitt
waitfor roundtime
pause 1
put cast
goto Top
You'll be locked in about ~5-10 minutes.
<<"earning too little skinning experience for a day or so isn't nearly as bad as having a spell that breaks your wings."
POWERHAUS
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/29/2013 05:43 PM CST
Assume all this is for Fire alignment with decent skill, you can adjust to your own settings.
Aligned Fire- I run conserve, it to pulses/teaches/drains faster than damage. In combat I might leave Damage running to help my cyclic TM. Outside of combat I adjust to how close to Mindlocked I am or whatever I'm doing.
For combat can just summon admit til you can't anymore before combat, and then turn it on and cast occassionally. It doesn't drain away on its own. With a full charge I can keep damage going for over 15 minutes or conserve for about 10 or less, toss in spells for extra.
-I've heard Barrage works for some people, for me I get 4 usees out of it with max alignment, and I'm better off letting a pathway bleed for exp.
To keep damage going I can cast fireball every few minutes to maintain the charge(since Damage and fire align causes it to half the smallest one). But that doesn't Teach too great, it's more for keeping steady training (usually stays at 10/34 - 18/34 in combat, wherever it ended after my summon admit cycle). With conserve up it drains faster, but I see a noticable increase in exp gain.
If you're cool with standing there, but not okay with sitting, you could cast ignite(foc some cambrinth for arcana on top of the utility exp) for a couple minutes instead of summon admit, you'll get extra exp as well as increasing the charge and being fairly safe. (Plus ignite is awesome.)
I've gone from 650 to 668 summoning, and I've barely paid any attention to it. I summon admit for a minute then just turn my pathway on, and summon admit again 30 minutes to an hour later, most of the time I got to turn it back on it, and it's still running from before.
I'm okay with it being at concentrating (9/34) or better; I could focus on keeping it ML'd but there's so much better stuff to be doing.
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
Aligned Fire- I run conserve, it to pulses/teaches/drains faster than damage. In combat I might leave Damage running to help my cyclic TM. Outside of combat I adjust to how close to Mindlocked I am or whatever I'm doing.
For combat can just summon admit til you can't anymore before combat, and then turn it on and cast occassionally. It doesn't drain away on its own. With a full charge I can keep damage going for over 15 minutes or conserve for about 10 or less, toss in spells for extra.
-I've heard Barrage works for some people, for me I get 4 usees out of it with max alignment, and I'm better off letting a pathway bleed for exp.
To keep damage going I can cast fireball every few minutes to maintain the charge(since Damage and fire align causes it to half the smallest one). But that doesn't Teach too great, it's more for keeping steady training (usually stays at 10/34 - 18/34 in combat, wherever it ended after my summon admit cycle). With conserve up it drains faster, but I see a noticable increase in exp gain.
If you're cool with standing there, but not okay with sitting, you could cast ignite(foc some cambrinth for arcana on top of the utility exp) for a couple minutes instead of summon admit, you'll get extra exp as well as increasing the charge and being fairly safe. (Plus ignite is awesome.)
I've gone from 650 to 668 summoning, and I've barely paid any attention to it. I summon admit for a minute then just turn my pathway on, and summon admit again 30 minutes to an hour later, most of the time I got to turn it back on it, and it's still running from before.
I'm okay with it being at concentrating (9/34) or better; I could focus on keeping it ML'd but there's so much better stuff to be doing.
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
DANFORDS2
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/29/2013 07:07 PM CST
>Summoning is best learned outside of combat
I understand that is currently the case. However, I think it's stupid. Currently the best (only?) way to train at higher levels is to use Pathways, an inherently combat ability. Perhaps rather than add more experience to Pathways, add some Summoning experience to any TM spell affected by a pathway, assuming you also learn TM.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
I understand that is currently the case. However, I think it's stupid. Currently the best (only?) way to train at higher levels is to use Pathways, an inherently combat ability. Perhaps rather than add more experience to Pathways, add some Summoning experience to any TM spell affected by a pathway, assuming you also learn TM.
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Summoning skill....?
01/30/2013 07:41 AM CST
I think the problem is that building/maintaining charge isn't entirely conducive to normal hunting routines, and sitting isn't fun to do in combat.
Two potential solutions could be A ) allowing charge to be built from pulsing cyclics, or B ) what Opi said, granting Summoning xp for building/reducing charge.
Two potential solutions could be A ) allowing charge to be built from pulsing cyclics, or B ) what Opi said, granting Summoning xp for building/reducing charge.
