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Let me make it a little bit clearer, then. Why is it that the majority of scrolls found are ones that are not usable by the majority of people? The only person who might be interested in a HULP scroll is a bard; a cleric will be able to learn the spell WELL before they have the scholarship to study the scroll temporarily.
This is why it is my heartfelt desire to have a more consistant means of obtaining scrolls than what is already a very small random chance, which is subdivided into even smaller random chances. I would love to run across a scroll of Ball Lightning or Fortress of Ice, and be able to play around with the spells without having to choose them first. Or a scroll of shadows, or clear vision, or sphere of protection, or minor physical protection, courage, or whatnot.
Give me more options than 'Huldah's Pall' for scrolls, and give me an alternative way to acquire them (besides buying them from fellow players), other than hunting and opening boxes for days on end just to find a mentor newletter.
Orpheus: "You've been powering this machine with a forsaken child?"
Venture: "What? It's not like I used the whole thing."
OLESH
WEILM
Re: Ranged enchantments
03/05/2005 06:07 PM CST
>>If the scroll system randomly generates a scroll, why are so many scrolls that I find Huldah's Pall? Why are the scrolls with first tier TM spells, which are being horded by certain people, so difficult to find outside of those few people?
As one of the other posters mentioned, it is because not all spells that can come on scrolls have the same probability of being generated on a scroll. And I suspect that blackfire is set a lot lower than a 1% chance.
And the first tier spells were removed from the treasure system around the time that scrolls were worked on as part of the Magic v2.1 system. Mainly because they were a bad thing.
As a matter of fact, it was specifically mentioned that the magic shops that sold scrolls were going to have first tier scrolls removed from their stocks, as well. So, the hoarders with first tier spell scrolls have had them since before the change went into effect.
>>Spells which are 'guild-defining' are already safe from tampering by other guilds, so why not up the frequency of scrolls by adding a reliable method of obtaining them?
What game do you play? And what guild? Thanks to an immense supply out there, several of our "guild defining" spells have long been available to most anyone. FS is available on a fairly common runestone that, last time I checked, was still being sold in Shard. And FB and LB are available on self-casting devices, also still available in Shard. And it takes less MD skill to use any of those devices than it takes Scholarship to use a scroll.
Heh. Sorry about that, one of my triggers, going back many, many years. To about not long before ES was removed as a first spell choice for new Warrior Mages. And when it was still possible to use LB on the ferries...
~Kyn (Kynevon)
Info Page http://kynevon.info
Mac OS X FE http://tinyurl.com/4btcl
Amagaim's What to Hunt Chart
Excel format: http://tinyurl.com/44jlt
HTML format: http://tinyurl.com/6tpls
As one of the other posters mentioned, it is because not all spells that can come on scrolls have the same probability of being generated on a scroll. And I suspect that blackfire is set a lot lower than a 1% chance.
And the first tier spells were removed from the treasure system around the time that scrolls were worked on as part of the Magic v2.1 system. Mainly because they were a bad thing.
As a matter of fact, it was specifically mentioned that the magic shops that sold scrolls were going to have first tier scrolls removed from their stocks, as well. So, the hoarders with first tier spell scrolls have had them since before the change went into effect.
>>Spells which are 'guild-defining' are already safe from tampering by other guilds, so why not up the frequency of scrolls by adding a reliable method of obtaining them?
What game do you play? And what guild? Thanks to an immense supply out there, several of our "guild defining" spells have long been available to most anyone. FS is available on a fairly common runestone that, last time I checked, was still being sold in Shard. And FB and LB are available on self-casting devices, also still available in Shard. And it takes less MD skill to use any of those devices than it takes Scholarship to use a scroll.
Heh. Sorry about that, one of my triggers, going back many, many years. To about not long before ES was removed as a first spell choice for new Warrior Mages. And when it was still possible to use LB on the ferries...
~Kyn (Kynevon)
Info Page http://kynevon.info
Mac OS X FE http://tinyurl.com/4btcl
Amagaim's What to Hunt Chart
Excel format: http://tinyurl.com/44jlt
HTML format: http://tinyurl.com/6tpls
DRWOLF
Re: Ranged enchantments
03/05/2005 06:35 PM CST
<<Even if the quests to reduce the min prep are years away, I would like to see 'soon' a reasonable, reliable, and possibly life-threatening method of obtaining a scroll of incinerate or otherwise temporarily memorizing the spell (to avoid people getting the scroll and selling it to others), because as it currently stands, the spell is entirely inaccessible to everyone who does not already own a scroll.
I agree. The Scroll system as a whole is silly, and could use an over-haul. However, the big problem with Incinerate (and it always WILL be with Blackfire I feel...) is that it is not just a spell. It's a choice of RP. I feel, personally, there is no way of learning Incinerate (or any sorcery) and being able to play your character the same again. Once you study the spell, you get marked as a 'Sorceror' or someone practicing an illegal magic. I'm all for more people 'playing' with Incinerate, as long as they just don't want the spell for the sake of "I heard it's good in PVP". It doesn't teach well folks. Hell, it's not even that useful - in most situations I'd rather cast a 35 mana (yeah that's the min prep) CL, FB, ALA, etc. The only reason I use incinerate is to RP. It is one of the very few spells in DR that I see not as a spell, but an RP avenue one chooses to take. I hope this is why they are changing Blackfire spells to make them more accomodating, because, for all the fail-safes it is just not worth it. And, it was said at least years Simucon they want to make Blackfire more an RP device and give it substance. Rigby was the one whom said Incinerate is the trial version...I hope in the end it works out as such and DHOI or whatever comes next will impress me more.
Until then, I'll keep the RP up and try and get more people involved.
~The Blackfire Mage Magmus
I agree. The Scroll system as a whole is silly, and could use an over-haul. However, the big problem with Incinerate (and it always WILL be with Blackfire I feel...) is that it is not just a spell. It's a choice of RP. I feel, personally, there is no way of learning Incinerate (or any sorcery) and being able to play your character the same again. Once you study the spell, you get marked as a 'Sorceror' or someone practicing an illegal magic. I'm all for more people 'playing' with Incinerate, as long as they just don't want the spell for the sake of "I heard it's good in PVP". It doesn't teach well folks. Hell, it's not even that useful - in most situations I'd rather cast a 35 mana (yeah that's the min prep) CL, FB, ALA, etc. The only reason I use incinerate is to RP. It is one of the very few spells in DR that I see not as a spell, but an RP avenue one chooses to take. I hope this is why they are changing Blackfire spells to make them more accomodating, because, for all the fail-safes it is just not worth it. And, it was said at least years Simucon they want to make Blackfire more an RP device and give it substance. Rigby was the one whom said Incinerate is the trial version...I hope in the end it works out as such and DHOI or whatever comes next will impress me more.
Until then, I'll keep the RP up and try and get more people involved.
~The Blackfire Mage Magmus
GOOU
Re: Ranged enchantments
03/06/2005 07:00 AM CST
Pretty much the scroll system is mainly for Moon Mages <with unleash spell> and Bards. Now if its blackfire, its mainly for Warrior Mages, Bards, Rangers, and Moon Mages. <If I remember right, holy users have a hard time using them, but guess its still do able>. And then you got two or three scroll only spells thats only for a certain guild. I think Warrior Mages and Moon Mages fall in this catagory. Moving onto the thread, is it over yet?
Goou Laughter, protector of the bovines.
P.S. Don't harm the aurochs.
Goou Laughter, protector of the bovines.
P.S. Don't harm the aurochs.
OLESH
Re: Ranged enchantments
03/06/2005 10:43 AM CST
Considering that the spell requires Fire Shard as a rerequesite...
I'm still curious why blackfire is apparently not tagged as guild-defining the way that chain lightning or thoughtcast are - someone who isn't of the appropriate guild simply cannot use the spells. They go awry.
Orpheus: "You've been powering this machine with a forsaken child?"
Venture: "What? It's not like I used the whole thing."
I'm still curious why blackfire is apparently not tagged as guild-defining the way that chain lightning or thoughtcast are - someone who isn't of the appropriate guild simply cannot use the spells. They go awry.
Orpheus: "You've been powering this machine with a forsaken child?"
Venture: "What? It's not like I used the whole thing."
DRWOLF
Re: Ranged enchantments
03/06/2005 03:13 PM CST
<<. Now if its blackfire, its mainly for Warrior Mages, Bards, Rangers, and Moon Mages.
Blackfire is WM only, and will remain WM only (regardless of Unleash or Bard's ability). It is just one of 'those' things. It is tagged as WM only, I am pretty sure from a conversation with Rigby. The Holy/Elemental hybrid, FS pre-req, etc, keeps it very WM'ly. The fact is uses 'slivers' of holy mana is important, but not completely. Last I heard it was a 'different' kind of Sorcery, unlike Venom, Limb Disruption, etc. Those are true sorceries, where as Blackfire is 'Fire Sorcery'. Different. I hope...and if I see any non WM's using Blackfire, I'll be the first with torches and a pitch-fork.
And Blackfire.
~The Blackfire Mage Magmus
Blackfire is WM only, and will remain WM only (regardless of Unleash or Bard's ability). It is just one of 'those' things. It is tagged as WM only, I am pretty sure from a conversation with Rigby. The Holy/Elemental hybrid, FS pre-req, etc, keeps it very WM'ly. The fact is uses 'slivers' of holy mana is important, but not completely. Last I heard it was a 'different' kind of Sorcery, unlike Venom, Limb Disruption, etc. Those are true sorceries, where as Blackfire is 'Fire Sorcery'. Different. I hope...and if I see any non WM's using Blackfire, I'll be the first with torches and a pitch-fork.
And Blackfire.
~The Blackfire Mage Magmus
KINDREDCHORD
Re: Ranged enchantments
03/17/2005 10:13 AM CST
<<The only reason I use incinerate is to RP. It is one of the very few spells in DR that I see not as a spell, but an RP avenue one chooses to take.>>
Hear, hear!
~Fyriestorme
Hear, hear!
~Fyriestorme
