They were talkin about this over in Discussions with GMs, general discussions for a while, and few people actually said it, "The Economy is NOT Broken." After thinking long and hard about it, I realized, they're right. Now hold down, calm your breath, I know people have TENS of thousands of plats in banks all over the Realms (I've got like 17 or 18 now, all totalled, heh) and that this select minority is now in position to essentially buy and darned thing they want from any auction they want and yadda yadda yadda. BUT, lets look at reality, shop prices are fixed, (Yes newer areas are more expensive, but with those new area shops were new area critters that are higher difficulty and pay more money, who'dda thunk it?) and what's more I wander through the market tent and the cost for forged and tanned items is still where it was, more or less, a year ago. 10s-100s of plats. Makes sense, holding steady. The ONLY items that really seem to sell for these ABSURD prices are the crazy unique ones, like ships. Makes sense to me. I've been playin DR since AOL went unlimited (Yes, I'm one of those damned AOL progeny that flooded the Realms and ruined it for the rest of ya'll yadda yadda) and because I kept farting around and trading characters I am able to honestly say that my 17 plat is the MOST MONEY I HAVE EVER HAD in game. The fact that it's "value" to other players, like Ruffles (Thas not a shot man, make yer coin, capitalism rules) is literally insignificant, practically coppers, doesn't bother me one bit. I'll still be able to save up and buy the stuff I want.

What's more, when DR2 rolls out, insane amounts of creation systems will roll out too, and the end product is going to be an overall increase in supply of everything from forged weapons to tanned leathers to, yup, thas right PC owned boats/ships. Hot damn. At that point, anybody who is persistent enough WILL be able to save up enough to buy whatever they want, eventually. Hey, that sounds kind of like that new guitar amp I want in real life. If I commit myself to saving up for it long enough, even with inflation and increased tuition, it will be mine and the whole block will tremble before my rumbling distortion. :::power chord::: In other words, you want something bad enough, you can work up enough to get it, unless you're worried about the actual size of your bank account. Boring.

Now, another thing that isn't considered is the possibility, that, heaven forbid, these obscenely rich people might quit playing DR! Simu would miss them, and I'm sure we all would too, but hey REAL LIFE happens and suddenly that "impossible elite upper class nobody new will EVER join" WILL be composed of TOTALLY different people than it is now. Heh, I might even be part of it. :::snickers:::

I've heard alot of people go "Look what happened to GS3s economy" and what not, well, ummm, reminder folks, this is just a game. Who cares if your IG currency is "worthless." It's ALREADY fictitous, is it not? Last I checked I could win Monopoly by a landslide and have half the game's currency in my possession and still have a hard time scraping together enough money for a pack of cigarettes. Folks need to calm down and remember it is just that, a game, and frankly, if you're clever enough at RPing, I imagine you could always buddy buddy up to somebody enough somehow to get crazy weird random items you could never dream of affording alone.

Moving along, I have seen VERY few suggestions for fixing the economy that would actually succeed at that. The VAST majority (hard caps on IG currency, Cost of Living expenses, bank robberies, furriers and gem shops being like pawnshops[EVERYTHING IS WORTHLELL, WOOT!]) aren't going to effect Ruffles and crew. Why? They HAVE 10s of thousands of plats. They can already afford everything they could possibly want to, now and forever. Who would have a problem with these things? New characters, that come into the Realms with 7.5 silver, and a 7.5 silver debt to match, that, once they finish training their first stats out is usually between a 1.7-2 gold debt. These kids can't afford cost of living, afford a bank robbery, or find out ALL the loot they brought in from the goblin hunt that nearly killed them isn't enough to pay for the dings in their sword and armor. Nobody wants that to happen, do they? The only reasonable solution I saw was bribing for offices of position IG, that was essentially a game mechanic silent auction where the filthy rich could blow plats at leisure buying silly post titles, but that alone wouldn't get rid of all that money out there.

Here's an idea, if you want to lower the cost of items, stop paying as much. You're a guild, of Traders, organize, and start working out new rates YOU set on items. If people aren't willing to pay ridiculous sums of plats, people wont be able to effectively charge ridiculous sums of plats. Somebody pointed it out, it's a sellers market. Somebody says "How much?" Seller says "Make me an offer" because they know somebody out there is willing to spend more than it's worth. (Based on Appraisals, EVERYTHING costs more than its worth) If you're willing to spend less, co-operatively, people will HAVE to sell for less, and prices WILL come down. (I'm sure there's a fancily named economic principle for this, but I'm no finance major)

Lastly, I've perused this board casually for a few weeks, I noticed several posts about "Fixing the Economy so that the guild that SHOULD be richest IS." That may be more paraphrase than a direct qoute, but its in there somewhere, and the guild those posters were referring to is obviously, the Traders. I know it "makes sense," but lets be honest with each other, and ourselves, that idea just REEKS of envy. "They've got more money than I do, and I'm mad, because I became a Trader to be the richest character ever, and I can't be!" Is it at that point that somebody should break out the pacifiers so everybody can go sulk in the corner?


The Alley Cat


Thanks to all the people who's ideas I borrowed/referenced in this thing.
Oh, and go ahead, call me stupid, and ignorant and yadda yadda yadda. In the end, I think it's just a game, I don't give a darn what you say, and I'll be perfectly okay with NEVER being able to afford "SuperCoolAuctionItemG13430RX" cuz I didn't decide to play this game for what is in the end, essentially, fluff.

>Is the economy really broken?

Yes, it is. Any time you have people running around with tons and tons of plats, and there's nothing worth buying, then I say the economy is broken (that you can get for plats anyways, there's lots of stuff worth buying that's only available if you sign up for a payquest and give Simutronics more $dollars). However, I wouldn't really say that the economy is 'broken' just because there are people with tons of money and prices of the few cool items around are going up to what the average player can't afford.

>Lastly, I've perused this board casually for a few weeks, I noticed several posts about "Fixing the Economy so that the guild that SHOULD be richest IS." That may be more paraphrase than a direct qoute, but its in there somewhere, and the guild those posters were referring to is obviously, the Traders. I know it "makes sense," but lets be honest with each other, and ourselves, that idea just REEKS of envy. "They've got more money than I do, and I'm mad, because I became a Trader to be the richest character ever, and I can't be!" Is it at that point that somebody should break out the pacifiers so everybody can go sulk in the corner?

Honestly I don't think it's selfishness or envy at all - it's really more the principle of the thing. Really, you rarely ever hear Traders complaining vehemently about how we don't make enough money, because even if we're not the richest guild around, we still make out alright. But how would Barbarians feel if they were alright at hunting, while certain other guilds totally outclassed them? Or how would Thieves feel if they could steal pretty well, but Rangers were actually way better? Even if they didn't make a huge fuss about it, I'm sure it wouldn't sit very well with them, and I don't think it would have anything to do with envy at all.

Apu

>They've got more money than I do, and I'm mad, because I became a Trader to be the richest character ever, and I can't be!" Is it at that point that somebody should break out the pacifiers so everybody can go sulk in the corner?

>Ruffles (Thas not a shot man, make yer coin, capitalism rules)

>Oh, and go ahead, call me stupid, and ignorant and yadda yadda yadda.

Between defending Ruffles and insulting our guild, then expecting Traders to return the insult, I'd have to say you don't have much experience with us or who we are as individuals, in game or out.

I believe the issue was Traders were just looking for a viable avenue to make the type of coin a forger has. Apu said it pretty nicely, being a Trader isn't about combat, or healing or saving folks in need, it is about finances and moving goods (notice some of our titles?).

Gidske

while delivering a few contracts for the construction at the barb guild in crossin in plat, i was giving serious consideration to this.

we all know that the buildings will be constructed as per GM "new stuff", although its good to include the traders in doing the "work" for the construction.

I think to make it actually DEPEND on traders whether it gets built or not would be the key element here.

That would of course require a certain amount of "keeping track" for the game engine, but it would be a way for Traders to actually make a difference in others getting "new stuff". :-)

Bags/Kesefa


~Weak of arm,lousy roars;
terrible aim, awful health;
broken fingers, no real stealth;
leave em dead,cause you cant do more; lost your coins,on the floor;
greetings! now you're out the door~
>

G'day,

Given something Solomon said at the State of Elanthia meeting at Simucon, I can easily see something like this happening, in conjunction with some other things. He mentioned that once careers have gotten off the ground, it is entirely possible that player craftsmen would be responsible for doing the work to build new shops, housing areas and the like, and that, within reason, these areas wouldn't open until the players had completed the work. Traders would play a crucial roll in getting raw materials to the work sites. I can even see them being able to bargain for higher prices if the project gets behind schedule. All sorts of good stuff.

Regards,

Godrich de'Finchal

"You are like a mouse arguing with an owl. You think the owl is wrong, he thinks you are dinner."

http://webpages.charter.net/plblack/trader.html