The discussion about racism in the game on another thread elsewhere got me wondering about this. So I'd like to ask everyone what they think about how they separate a characters rudeness from a players rudeness, or do they not separate them at all?
Please reply. I really would like to get an idea of how players may typically perceive this possible duality.
The good life is one inspired by love and guided by knowledge. Bertrand Russell
Read more at: https://www.brainyquote.com/search_results.html?q=love
GODKING
TOTLIIO
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/09/2017 07:46 PM CDT
can you link me the thread? Im interested in reading it.
JJ113
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/09/2017 07:50 PM CDT
Players cannot distinguish between the two. Consequently word of mouth concerning a player's reputation out of character in a chat room or skype call is what people typically rely on.
Unique role played characters are usually driven from the game in this fashion because a misunderstanding with the wrong connected person will haunt a player for months, precipitating each interaction.
PRIMEQ
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/09/2017 11:01 PM CDT
If a character is being rude, I generally give the player the benefit of the doubt and assume it's just the character. If I have any doubt I will OOC whisper to them about it to see if we need to clear something up. It's really pretty simple.
There are rare occasions where a character is being rude in a way that is VERY obviously OOC. In this case, the appropriate response is to REPORT and then ignore.
- Navesi
There are rare occasions where a character is being rude in a way that is VERY obviously OOC. In this case, the appropriate response is to REPORT and then ignore.
- Navesi
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/10/2017 12:58 AM CDT
IMO the best way to spot someone role playing any level of antagonist is if the person doing it considers if the people in the other side of the fence are having as much fun as they are.
While some players might take an antagonist too seriously, and they don't properly grasp the results of their actions, that doesn't mean a "good" antagonist would just blindly trudge onward without any regard for that. They react to their audiences to make things enjoyable for everyone.
This really goes for any kind of roleplay; it's just easier to spot it being done poorly when an antagonist is in the mix.
It's hard to do properly, and to make things worse for the game many are either ambivalent or openly hostile to the idea of making the game's story entertaining for more than just themselves.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
While some players might take an antagonist too seriously, and they don't properly grasp the results of their actions, that doesn't mean a "good" antagonist would just blindly trudge onward without any regard for that. They react to their audiences to make things enjoyable for everyone.
This really goes for any kind of roleplay; it's just easier to spot it being done poorly when an antagonist is in the mix.
It's hard to do properly, and to make things worse for the game many are either ambivalent or openly hostile to the idea of making the game's story entertaining for more than just themselves.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
SHIFT3
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/10/2017 08:24 AM CDT
> So I'd like to ask everyone what they think about how they separate a characters rudeness from a players rudeness, or do they not separate them at all?
> Players cannot distinguish between the two.
I think it depends on the player. If you can whisper a player and say, "OOC: I'm not having fun with this storyline. Let's switch to something else" and they do then it's the character. If they don't or they double down, it's the player.
DR-HELJE
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/10/2017 06:42 PM CDT
A post was hidden.
Helje
DragonRealms Senior Board Moderator
Helje
DragonRealms Senior Board Moderator
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/15/2017 12:23 AM CDT
Roleplaying racism, rudeness, or antagonism is difficult already, but the nature of roleplay in Dragonrealms makes it especially so.
Finding conflict roleplay "fun" requires an open mind and a disassociation between player and character. This is much easier in an intimate setting like a D&D tabletop campaign. DR's MMO aspects make this harder to achieve.
DR also puts a paywall between audience and content, and that transforms many people's perceptions or expectations regarding roleplay. Almost anyone will try an exotic new food for free, but once you to go a restaurant and start charging entree prices, many people stop looking for new experiences and only want something that "tastes good."
Kudos to anyone trying to actually roleplay a villain here.
Finding conflict roleplay "fun" requires an open mind and a disassociation between player and character. This is much easier in an intimate setting like a D&D tabletop campaign. DR's MMO aspects make this harder to achieve.
DR also puts a paywall between audience and content, and that transforms many people's perceptions or expectations regarding roleplay. Almost anyone will try an exotic new food for free, but once you to go a restaurant and start charging entree prices, many people stop looking for new experiences and only want something that "tastes good."
Kudos to anyone trying to actually roleplay a villain here.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/15/2017 11:32 AM CDT
>>Finding conflict roleplay "fun" requires an open mind and a disassociation between player and character.
I think it's critical to acknowledge that this is a two-way street. If player A has no interest in their character being tied to the railroad tracks, player B needs to realize they're roleplaying toward the wrong audience, or at least they need to re-examine what they should be doing if they wish to make the story entertaining.
To put it another way:
When GMs do invasions where they just shake the bucket of invasion mobs over the entire town and have the low level mobs running around with the high level mobs, the players go "Hey, this looks fun, but unless you're a high level player there's nothing for low level players to do but run around screaming"
In response, GMs have decided to do things like "Okay, I'm going to put the high level mobs HERE, the mid level mobs THERE, and the low level mobs ALLLLL the way in THAT area." That's creating a conflict but also responding to an audience's wants in order to get maximum participation.
Sometimes, when players decide to play team-evil (which is fine to play), there's a "Look, my character stabs everyone they see wearing blue, so just don't wear blue or set your profile to closed or go far away you big baby who can't handle the I KEEL YOU fire" attitude, and that's detrimental not just toward that specific roleplay, but the inclination for anyone to want to participate in those situations at all.
After all, if the gross number of players in an instance decided to stop participating in city invasions because GM A, who refused to compartmentalize critter difficulty, caused some previous bad experiences, would that help or hurt future invasions by GMs B-Z?
Of course, this is a two-way street, so team-good/protagonists can't necessarily expect things to work out for them, only them, and never the other side of the people playing, but realistically if you're the ones creating the roleplay "event", you should expect to have more ownership of it which includes a larger share of the "burden" when it comes to "are people having fun"?
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
I think it's critical to acknowledge that this is a two-way street. If player A has no interest in their character being tied to the railroad tracks, player B needs to realize they're roleplaying toward the wrong audience, or at least they need to re-examine what they should be doing if they wish to make the story entertaining.
To put it another way:
When GMs do invasions where they just shake the bucket of invasion mobs over the entire town and have the low level mobs running around with the high level mobs, the players go "Hey, this looks fun, but unless you're a high level player there's nothing for low level players to do but run around screaming"
In response, GMs have decided to do things like "Okay, I'm going to put the high level mobs HERE, the mid level mobs THERE, and the low level mobs ALLLLL the way in THAT area." That's creating a conflict but also responding to an audience's wants in order to get maximum participation.
Sometimes, when players decide to play team-evil (which is fine to play), there's a "Look, my character stabs everyone they see wearing blue, so just don't wear blue or set your profile to closed or go far away you big baby who can't handle the I KEEL YOU fire" attitude, and that's detrimental not just toward that specific roleplay, but the inclination for anyone to want to participate in those situations at all.
After all, if the gross number of players in an instance decided to stop participating in city invasions because GM A, who refused to compartmentalize critter difficulty, caused some previous bad experiences, would that help or hurt future invasions by GMs B-Z?
Of course, this is a two-way street, so team-good/protagonists can't necessarily expect things to work out for them, only them, and never the other side of the people playing, but realistically if you're the ones creating the roleplay "event", you should expect to have more ownership of it which includes a larger share of the "burden" when it comes to "are people having fun"?
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
DISCOTEQ21
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/15/2017 09:59 PM CDT
None of this is that hard.
Don't forget to vote for dragonrealms:
http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-DragonRealms.html
Don't forget to vote for dragonrealms:
http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-DragonRealms.html
DR-PERSIDA
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/17/2017 07:32 AM CDT
>> If anybody has more then one pair of feelings then I would live hear about it.
While this is a crude way of putting it, this is sort of what people are getting at when they say separating character from player, and it is the basic building block of roleplaying. The idea is that you the player have feelings, which of course are impacted by your real life, but that you shelve those feelings to a large extent while roleplaying, in favor of playing out what the persona of your character would feel in reaction to things that happen to the character in the game.
Of course, this might be significantly harder to do depending on the particular character's persona versus how you, the player, are feeling that day, especially when emotional extremes are involved. This is why many roleplayers have more than one character, each with often very different types of personalities, that they might play depending on how they're feeling IRL. Or conversely, they might just choose to not play a roleplaying game if their emotional state IRL is strong enough to preclude them from being able to act as their character at that moment.
Most people who value roleplay do so precisely because it is different than them just logging in and doing things exactly like how they as a player feel at the time or how they the player might react IRL to any given situation presented to their character. They enjoy playing a role, and part of that is to immerse yourself in the fictional emotional life of the character, which is often very different from that of the player.
-Persida
While this is a crude way of putting it, this is sort of what people are getting at when they say separating character from player, and it is the basic building block of roleplaying. The idea is that you the player have feelings, which of course are impacted by your real life, but that you shelve those feelings to a large extent while roleplaying, in favor of playing out what the persona of your character would feel in reaction to things that happen to the character in the game.
Of course, this might be significantly harder to do depending on the particular character's persona versus how you, the player, are feeling that day, especially when emotional extremes are involved. This is why many roleplayers have more than one character, each with often very different types of personalities, that they might play depending on how they're feeling IRL. Or conversely, they might just choose to not play a roleplaying game if their emotional state IRL is strong enough to preclude them from being able to act as their character at that moment.
Most people who value roleplay do so precisely because it is different than them just logging in and doing things exactly like how they as a player feel at the time or how they the player might react IRL to any given situation presented to their character. They enjoy playing a role, and part of that is to immerse yourself in the fictional emotional life of the character, which is often very different from that of the player.
-Persida
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/17/2017 10:12 AM CDT
For what it's worth, there have been times when my character has been sad/distressed/frustrated/terrified and it was incredibly fun to deal with.
The "my character reflects me" tends to happen more if I, as a player, am having an "off" day, similar to how if I'm not in a social/friendly mood I wouldn't go out with friends.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
The "my character reflects me" tends to happen more if I, as a player, am having an "off" day, similar to how if I'm not in a social/friendly mood I wouldn't go out with friends.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
TIM
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/18/2017 01:50 AM CDT
I was going to add that I look at it as a giant play, and I'm an actor in the play.
But then I realized this may be bad advice seeing that some serious actors have hurt themselves over some of their roles. o_O
Just don't take it too serious! I mean it is just a game. ^_^
And remember your lines. ;D
But then I realized this may be bad advice seeing that some serious actors have hurt themselves over some of their roles. o_O
Just don't take it too serious! I mean it is just a game. ^_^
And remember your lines. ;D
GUNSLINGER5
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/18/2017 07:25 PM CDT
<<The discussion about racism in the game on another thread elsewhere got me wondering about this. So I'd like to ask everyone what they think about how they separate a characters rudeness from a players rudeness, or do they not separate them at all?
Please reply. I really would like to get an idea of how players may typically perceive this possible duality.>>
I play Ianhanse, a S'Kra Mur Bard. I find it pretty easy to keep my game and RL personas separate. Part of this may be due to the fact that RACE in DragonRealms doesn't generally refer to ones skin color/where they are from...it's ELF / DWARF / HUMAN / ETC. And Ianhanse is racist (He'll occasionally imply that Elves taste like chicken and then gnaw on an old bone kept in his cloak, or if you look at one of his altered items it shows he dislikes Prydaens), firmly believing that S'Kra Mur are superior and the hairy races, especially, are gross and inferior. I also play him as generally grumpy and intolerant towards the majority of his own guild because he is pretty old (88) and doesn't do the whole singing and dancing thing, so I am sure that a lot of people see Ianhanse as a rude character at times.
As far as how others perceive Ianhanse and how they interact, I've had a few times where I was whispered to by someone who was bothered by his attitude. I adjusted, generally by leaving the area so as to remain true to the character or just ignored them instead of interacting further. I don't actively try to ruin another player's enjoyment of the game so sometimes it just comes down to going separate ways for a short time or for good.
I also try to use my RP points to reward people who DO engage him, despite his less-than-rosy demeanor.
Please reply. I really would like to get an idea of how players may typically perceive this possible duality.>>
I play Ianhanse, a S'Kra Mur Bard. I find it pretty easy to keep my game and RL personas separate. Part of this may be due to the fact that RACE in DragonRealms doesn't generally refer to ones skin color/where they are from...it's ELF / DWARF / HUMAN / ETC. And Ianhanse is racist (He'll occasionally imply that Elves taste like chicken and then gnaw on an old bone kept in his cloak, or if you look at one of his altered items it shows he dislikes Prydaens), firmly believing that S'Kra Mur are superior and the hairy races, especially, are gross and inferior. I also play him as generally grumpy and intolerant towards the majority of his own guild because he is pretty old (88) and doesn't do the whole singing and dancing thing, so I am sure that a lot of people see Ianhanse as a rude character at times.
As far as how others perceive Ianhanse and how they interact, I've had a few times where I was whispered to by someone who was bothered by his attitude. I adjusted, generally by leaving the area so as to remain true to the character or just ignored them instead of interacting further. I don't actively try to ruin another player's enjoyment of the game so sometimes it just comes down to going separate ways for a short time or for good.
I also try to use my RP points to reward people who DO engage him, despite his less-than-rosy demeanor.
JULIAN
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/20/2017 08:05 AM CDT
TBH these days I have the most RPing in DR when I turn off AIM, play an anonymous character no one knows is me, and pretend everyone I run into is a really well (or poorly) scripted NPC in a single-player game. Then it doesn't matter what anyone's intentions are or really what happens to my little noobler.
Sometimes it's harder to have fun and RP with Maz because I've been playing for so long that I know everyone and everyone knows me, so there is OOC context that is always in the background (or foreground) that is hard to separate from.
Mazrian
Sometimes it's harder to have fun and RP with Maz because I've been playing for so long that I know everyone and everyone knows me, so there is OOC context that is always in the background (or foreground) that is hard to separate from.
Mazrian
DSLITE
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/20/2017 09:05 AM CDT
<<TBH these days I have the most RPing in DR when I turn off AIM, play an anonymous character no one knows is me, and pretend everyone I run into is a really well (or poorly) scripted NPC in a single-player game. Then it doesn't matter what anyone's intentions are or really what happens to my little noobler.
<<Sometimes it's harder to have fun and RP with Maz because I've been playing for so long that I know everyone and everyone knows me, so there is OOC context that is always in the background (or foreground) that is hard to separate from.
Which has become a more common theme. Begs the question, if role play enjoyment is conditional relative to player anonymity?
<<Sometimes it's harder to have fun and RP with Maz because I've been playing for so long that I know everyone and everyone knows me, so there is OOC context that is always in the background (or foreground) that is hard to separate from.
Which has become a more common theme. Begs the question, if role play enjoyment is conditional relative to player anonymity?
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/20/2017 03:43 PM CDT
>>However, I disagree with how people react...I think they're a little uptight.
Similar to the other thread, it's worth recognizing that the characters might come off as uptight. This is not explicitly an issue with players. With that in mind, someone might just be roleplaying someone who is being uptight, or what your character (or you!) have decided to perceive as uptight. That's also why some players might double check to make sure that someone is saying something through the lens of their character than themselves, because it never hurts to check.
>>These people don't even seem like they're roleplaying to me.
This is an issue with some people who play DR, but it's also kinda always been a thing.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
Similar to the other thread, it's worth recognizing that the characters might come off as uptight. This is not explicitly an issue with players. With that in mind, someone might just be roleplaying someone who is being uptight, or what your character (or you!) have decided to perceive as uptight. That's also why some players might double check to make sure that someone is saying something through the lens of their character than themselves, because it never hurts to check.
>>These people don't even seem like they're roleplaying to me.
This is an issue with some people who play DR, but it's also kinda always been a thing.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
DR-HELJE
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/20/2017 08:13 PM CDT
A post was moved to the Equine Cemetary
Helje
DragonRealms Senior Board Moderator
Helje
DragonRealms Senior Board Moderator
GUNSLINGER5
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/25/2017 07:05 PM CDT
Your mind hears Deaglan thinking, [General] "Thanks for giving me the oportunity Zehira. Your not as smart as you think you are."
[General] Your mind hears Ianhanse thinking, "You're"
Your mind hears Mitkiahn thinking, [General] "That's what he said."
Your mind hears Nebby thinking, [General] "That's what I heard too"
A short time later:
Your mind suddenly receives a searing jolt! You hear a brief babble of Nebby's thoughts as the pain fades away.
This made me chuckle. Apparently this is what people do when they find Ianhanse rude... :) OH NOES!!!!
BADGOPHER
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/25/2017 08:04 PM CDT
Since the Gweths are verbal-thought equivalent, rather than written, you were being horribly out of character. There's no way for your character to determine a thought was spelled wrong, or punctuated incorrectly.
GUNSLINGER5
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/25/2017 08:15 PM CDT
Eye sea watt ewe mean.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/26/2017 09:22 AM CDT
>Since the Gweths are verbal-thought equivalent, rather than written, you were being horribly out of character. There's no way for your character to determine a thought was spelled wrong, or punctuated incorrectly.
Well, yes, but one of the gweths being left out is someone involved in this exchange correcting another persons gwething 'inteligence'.
Lets not pretend we don't know how gwethsmashing is used these days. Spoiler alert - it isn't to simply rectify out of character behavior.
Well, yes, but one of the gweths being left out is someone involved in this exchange correcting another persons gwething 'inteligence'.
Lets not pretend we don't know how gwethsmashing is used these days. Spoiler alert - it isn't to simply rectify out of character behavior.
DSLITE
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/26/2017 09:48 AM CDT
<<Lets not pretend we don't know how gwethsmashing is used these days. Spoiler alert - it isn't to simply rectify out of character behavior.
People could see how a grammar correction might be out of character and people have a lot to say about gweth smashing. What is the correct response to each in their own case then? Are not both acts in character?
Couldn't a misspelled word be a mispronunciation and gweth smashers are for any and all reasons at the discretion of the players.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/26/2017 10:28 AM CDT
In a world where we seem to accept people gwething in the lingo or cadence their characters speak in ("keel" or "Ah jes dunno whacha mean"), gwethsmashing as a resolution to slapfighting or typos/misspellings seems to be par for the course. Lets call a spade a spade though, and not pretend it's because people are being pissy about grammar or punctuation.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/26/2017 10:41 AM CDT
And to be clear, if people want to slapfight on the gweths and gwethsmash for it, have at it.
1982MB
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/27/2017 01:07 PM CDT
your knot
gwethsmashers a.k.a mind thump
GUNSLINGER5
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/28/2017 07:49 PM CDT
A bit of tonight's gweth chatter:
Your mind hears Apophys thinking, [General] "...word..."
Your mind hears Chubbington thinking, [General] "Mo like clown tards. Amirite"
Your mind hears Nebby thinking, [General] "yinz ain't wrong"
Your mind hears Korutu thinking, [General] "totes"
Your mind hears Chubbington thinking, [General] "Thas rite. I be aksin them each time. Urry time. And I'm all like yo...I need my space lunchlady. They -steeeel- get up on it."
BENNETTJ13
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/28/2017 09:47 PM CDT
Hey... it's just RP. Right?
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
BADGOPHER
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/28/2017 09:55 PM CDT
It is, in fact, RP.
Even if I find it OOC racist and in really poor taste, someone's free to do the equivalent of thought-blackface if they want to.
Better than a pedant correcting thought-grammar. And even if you don't like it, at least they've donned a persona and are pretending to play pretend.
Even if I find it OOC racist and in really poor taste, someone's free to do the equivalent of thought-blackface if they want to.
Better than a pedant correcting thought-grammar. And even if you don't like it, at least they've donned a persona and are pretending to play pretend.
BENNETTJ13
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/29/2017 01:38 AM CDT
Except that it's absolutely against the genre that is supposed to be enforced.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
Monster Elec
You hear the distant echo of a savage Horde snarling in barbaric disapproval of your deeds.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/29/2017 07:29 AM CDT
Yeah, that isn't RP, and I wish people deigned to enforce it more than they cared about pedantically correcting typos or talking about their in game mawwaiges
STELLARMAGUS
Re: Rudeness as character and rudeness as a player.
04/30/2017 07:12 PM CDT
That sort of gwething is why I keep my gweths off. It's very unfortunate.
