This is just an idea I've toyed with, it needs fleshing-out.
In most other instances of "Paladins" I have ever seen, they have some minor healing ability. I was thinking about a glyph that is activated in a similar manner as glyph of renew, but also requires an empath (and perhaps Cleric) to help.
So with this glyph a Paladin must first meditate to Hodierna, either at her altar, or with a blessed (need a Cleric) unicorn prayer bead/totem of some sort. The Paladin meditates for 5-minutes, and is granted access to the glyph, but the glyph is not ready to be deployed. The Paladin must then find an Empath to prep the Heal spell (need an Empath) and trace the glyph on the Empath who has prepped it. The Paladin will then have access to use this glyph once on the individual of her/his choosing (including her/himself). When traced, the glyph will heal all wounds (not scars) to some degree.
The strength of the glyph (how much of all the wounds it heals) will be determined by the Paladins Charisma, FA, and circle (or perhaps this Paladin-only skill if it every gets released). The glyph will be on a timer. Maybe 6RL hours. So the Paladin can't just keep using it every 5 minutes. It will require the 5-minutes of meditation each time it is to be used.
Just an idea from...
--Just a Squire
LENNONJON
2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/30/2015 04:14 PM CDT
This is a really cool idea. I thought healing abilities could never fly because of the empath guild, but this is a way of giving us a healing ability like paladins in other games traditionally have while keeping it so healing still requires an empath and can't be abused due to the cooldown.
2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 09:37 AM CDT
I think paladins should have some mild form of flush poison and blood staunching. It's just such a common part of just about every paladin theme out there.
DR-ARMIFER
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 09:47 AM CDT
>>It's just such a common part of just about every paladin theme out there.
Dissect that, though. Healing and such is a part of just about every paladin theme out there (which is to say, it comes to us from D&D) because Paladins in those cases are hybrid-Clerics and Cleric is a healer class. Paladin-as-healer has no cache in how the profession works in DR or where we want to try to take it (a hybrid-Empath is a Necromancer).
-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Calvino Italo
Dissect that, though. Healing and such is a part of just about every paladin theme out there (which is to say, it comes to us from D&D) because Paladins in those cases are hybrid-Clerics and Cleric is a healer class. Paladin-as-healer has no cache in how the profession works in DR or where we want to try to take it (a hybrid-Empath is a Necromancer).
-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Calvino Italo
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 10:21 AM CDT
First off, I like the idea. It reminds me of that vitality vessel spell.
That said, I wanted to give alternate interpretation of the concept:
1) Paladin links up to a cleric and/or empath via the glyph.
2) Paladin then runs out to location of wounded person/corpse/etc and traces glyph on the person.
3) Cleric and/or Empath can then remotely assist that person as long as the Paladin is still by the person's side
If we're going the "Paladin as a protector" route, I think this allows the Paladin a very unique way to assist both the person in need of help and those wishing to give help. The victim doesn't have to worry about being taken to a "safer" spot, and those wishing to help don't have to worry about being in a potentially dangerous area in order to assist.
>>(a hybrid-Empath is a Necromancer)
Translation: Necros are really selfish D&D Paladins. Woo!
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
That said, I wanted to give alternate interpretation of the concept:
1) Paladin links up to a cleric and/or empath via the glyph.
2) Paladin then runs out to location of wounded person/corpse/etc and traces glyph on the person.
3) Cleric and/or Empath can then remotely assist that person as long as the Paladin is still by the person's side
If we're going the "Paladin as a protector" route, I think this allows the Paladin a very unique way to assist both the person in need of help and those wishing to give help. The victim doesn't have to worry about being taken to a "safer" spot, and those wishing to help don't have to worry about being in a potentially dangerous area in order to assist.
>>(a hybrid-Empath is a Necromancer)
Translation: Necros are really selfish D&D Paladins. Woo!
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
DR-ARMIFER
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 10:26 AM CDT
>>Translation: Necros are really selfish D&D Paladins. Woo!
Fun fact: During early development the dev lead at the time pitched the idea of turning Necros into an Armor Primary guild that focused on a Y'shai-like implanted bone armor system.
Decided to not go that route, but it could've been cool too.
-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Calvino Italo
Fun fact: During early development the dev lead at the time pitched the idea of turning Necros into an Armor Primary guild that focused on a Y'shai-like implanted bone armor system.
Decided to not go that route, but it could've been cool too.
-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Calvino Italo
TEVESHSZAT
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 10:37 AM CDT
>>Fun fact: During early development the dev lead at the time pitched the idea of turning Necros into an Armor Primary guild that focused on a Y'shai-like implanted bone armor system.
>>Decided to not go that route, but it could've been cool too.
I can see one or two necro guildleaders loving the idea still, and only one of them is Perverse!
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
>>Decided to not go that route, but it could've been cool too.
I can see one or two necro guildleaders loving the idea still, and only one of them is Perverse!
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 11:01 AM CDT
I'm really just trying to imagine more interesting ways of cheating death than wearing plate or casting a barrier spell.
>Fun fact: During early development the dev lead at the time pitched the idea of turning Necros into an Armor Primary guild that focused on a Y'shai-like implanted bone armor system.
Cool, and it would've tied well with their weird body manipulation. I think it could still work with a less defensive focus. Like, maybe liches wouldn't need to wear armor because they can make their skin into hardened, ugly, spiny, quality bone armor. It'd be an interesting perk.
>Fun fact: During early development the dev lead at the time pitched the idea of turning Necros into an Armor Primary guild that focused on a Y'shai-like implanted bone armor system.
Cool, and it would've tied well with their weird body manipulation. I think it could still work with a less defensive focus. Like, maybe liches wouldn't need to wear armor because they can make their skin into hardened, ugly, spiny, quality bone armor. It'd be an interesting perk.
DR-RAESH
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 12:22 PM CDT
I'm not fundamentally opposed to Paladins "healing" as in helping out with vitality and stabilizing people (As noted, they already have one spell that does that). I don't see that expanding into actual wound healing through and the proper way for Paladins to interact with vitality is through the Sacrifice spellbook. Think of it as "Magic that deals with blood" as opposed to "blood magic"...
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
-Raesh
"Ever notice that B.A.'s flavor text swells in direct proportion to how much one of our characters is getting screwed?" - Brian Van Hoose
2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 01:08 PM CDT
It would be interesting to have more spells that interact with vitality but a self-cast component is important. Like, if I'm going to be able to give some of my life force to help someone temporarily reduce bleeding or whatever, that's cool but I'd want to be able to use it on myself if I were in similar danger. Aspirant Aegis is a good example of a successful Sacrifice spell since it has uses in solo play, which is where the vast majority of people find themselves most of the time.
Oh! I have an idea that fits Paladins well and would have amazing synergy with our mitigation defense. One of the most frustrating things in the world to me is dying from 80+% vitality due to critical body part destruction. It certainly takes away from that tanky feeling. Often times, at 100 stamina, that's how my character dies and it sucks because it makes all the stamina and heavy armor a little less useful. What about a spell or ability that somehow prevents critical body part destruction deaths? Like an impenetrable barrier under the skin. It won't prevent those massive bleeders or swift death by other means; it'll just severely blunt the very final attack to a critical body part.
Oh! I have an idea that fits Paladins well and would have amazing synergy with our mitigation defense. One of the most frustrating things in the world to me is dying from 80+% vitality due to critical body part destruction. It certainly takes away from that tanky feeling. Often times, at 100 stamina, that's how my character dies and it sucks because it makes all the stamina and heavy armor a little less useful. What about a spell or ability that somehow prevents critical body part destruction deaths? Like an impenetrable barrier under the skin. It won't prevent those massive bleeders or swift death by other means; it'll just severely blunt the very final attack to a critical body part.
VMILLER4
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 01:34 PM CDT
Stone skin! Thats a thing in a lot of the oldschool rpg's right? That could come with some really cool messaging about swords digging into skin and bone and then damaging the weapon instead of destroying us like it would have.
ABSOLON
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 01:48 PM CDT
'Stoneskin' as a mechanic already exists in DR in several forms, most notably damage reduction barriers like Aspirant's Aegis or Manifest Force, damage mitigators like Iron Constitution, and the passive vitality buffer every character has. Perhaps Paladins could get an ability that simply extended the length of the vitality buffer to 15% or 20% or something? I could also see something very much like Iron Constitution being given to Paladins.
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2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 02:06 PM CDT
>Perhaps Paladins could get an ability that simply extended the length of the vitality buffer to 15% or 20% or something?
There are a number of abilities and spells in the game that deal significant damage even at 100% vitality, which is one of the reasons hit and run works so well in PvP. The only way the vitality barrier, for lack of a better word, would be more useful IMO is if we had an ability or spell to increase its effectiveness. I would rather have, though, something to prevent critical body part destruction given how often I find myself getting 100-0, 80-0, 50-0 killed. I'm not thinking stoneskin, like AA. I'm thinking protection of vital organs, which rings like a ritual warding spell.
If I were a paladin in a magical world who strived to be the ultimate fighter-protector, who was constantly getting his chest and head blown off, I'd try to figure out a way to harden my body from within to stay alive long enough to fight and protect.
There are a number of abilities and spells in the game that deal significant damage even at 100% vitality, which is one of the reasons hit and run works so well in PvP. The only way the vitality barrier, for lack of a better word, would be more useful IMO is if we had an ability or spell to increase its effectiveness. I would rather have, though, something to prevent critical body part destruction given how often I find myself getting 100-0, 80-0, 50-0 killed. I'm not thinking stoneskin, like AA. I'm thinking protection of vital organs, which rings like a ritual warding spell.
If I were a paladin in a magical world who strived to be the ultimate fighter-protector, who was constantly getting his chest and head blown off, I'd try to figure out a way to harden my body from within to stay alive long enough to fight and protect.
ABSOLON
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 02:18 PM CDT
Then you're probably wanting something like Iron Constitution which caps the damage you take at a given level.
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2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 02:26 PM CDT
Actually, yeah, something like IC might do the trick. Really anything to stop a 100 to 0 vitality death would be amazing even if it only worked on death blows.
ASHAMAN1
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 03:52 PM CDT
>>Actually, yeah, something like IC might do the trick. Really anything to stop a 100 to 0 vitality death would be amazing even if it only worked on death blows.
The question I have, would an ability like this REALLY be something we'd want, once the outlying oddball huge damage moves are sanity checked? The reason I say this, is a recent example - a Paladin hit a cool milestone and let a buncha folks take a shot at murdering his face (hifive buddy for the milestone if you read this). Rolling in at someone stanced 0/0/0 with 1200 LE and a RUE'd haralun robe sword, it still took a buncha hits to take the chap down. Not everyone had to work so hard. Normal combat is already well skewed away from the 'omgdead' hits, so I'm not sure I'd want to see a ton of Dev-Time sunk into another damage limiter.
Samsaren
The question I have, would an ability like this REALLY be something we'd want, once the outlying oddball huge damage moves are sanity checked? The reason I say this, is a recent example - a Paladin hit a cool milestone and let a buncha folks take a shot at murdering his face (hifive buddy for the milestone if you read this). Rolling in at someone stanced 0/0/0 with 1200 LE and a RUE'd haralun robe sword, it still took a buncha hits to take the chap down. Not everyone had to work so hard. Normal combat is already well skewed away from the 'omgdead' hits, so I'm not sure I'd want to see a ton of Dev-Time sunk into another damage limiter.
Samsaren
2DUMBARSE
Re: Glyph of the Unicorn
03/31/2015 04:30 PM CDT
That's one of the reasons I was trying to look solely at critical body part destruction rather than yet another damage barrier. I'm not terribly interested in reducing overall damage any further. I look forward to damage going up after the barrier rewrite. I just really hate going from close to 100 vitality to 0.
Surprised overkill mechanics didn't do in someone stanced 0, though. Even in REALLY good plate, it's always a quick loss for me when I stance 0 against anyone.
Surprised overkill mechanics didn't do in someone stanced 0, though. Even in REALLY good plate, it's always a quick loss for me when I stance 0 against anyone.
