now, before anyone else states it, let me state for the record that I'm aware that not all dragon priests are necromancers. but enough of them were, that I highly recommend reading the new book entitled Isth'hhtaw'hhs Shh'o'yvh-ur <The ways of the Priests of the Dragon> its a new book in the muspar'i library. - yeah, you have to go into town to read it, but if you run in with eotb on, you should be relatively safe, or even without, there's still not a very large population there>
It mostly describes the rituals of sh'kial, but there are also descriptions of the rites used by D'zree and her followers. Of note to us is their use of knives in their rituals, similar to our rituals.
We are also told that the "hunger" that empowers Lyras was originally "created" by Dzree's Priests. So anything we can study about any possible connections can be useful.
Unfortunately, only Sh'kial's DP prayer was written down, we don't have the one utilized by D'zree's followers <the 'author' refused to devulge it>. Maybe someone can ask Xerasyth, as a former Spirit Dancer <who were created by the DPs along with the other Adan'f> if he knows it.
the world is broken
GERSTEINJ2
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 10:21 AM CST
Does anyone recall the posts where it was said that the Philosophers, the Bone Elves and the Dragon Priests are all completely separate cults and if you become a Philosopher it's a given that you're pretty much severing ties completely any other cult you may have associated with?
I see a lot of people running around claiming to be one of Sidhlot's Bone Elves or Dragon Priests and I'm wondering if they realize this or just don't care.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
I see a lot of people running around claiming to be one of Sidhlot's Bone Elves or Dragon Priests and I'm wondering if they realize this or just don't care.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
KARKWUSS
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 10:43 AM CST
If you see a lot of people working a RP angle... maybe you should consider it viable... majority of actual "real players of" should trump what someone said once...
I have found no conflict of intrest in a follower of the philosophy also believing in appeasing the world dragon to halt the distruction of the world... or even in pleading to the Gods for the Dragon's continued slumber, though they might not be willing to hear your prayer...
Maybe you can enlighten me into why a Dragon Priest shouldn't be a Follower of the Knife?
I have found no conflict of intrest in a follower of the philosophy also believing in appeasing the world dragon to halt the distruction of the world... or even in pleading to the Gods for the Dragon's continued slumber, though they might not be willing to hear your prayer...
Maybe you can enlighten me into why a Dragon Priest shouldn't be a Follower of the Knife?
GRIM45
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 10:45 AM CST
>>majority of actual "real players of" should trump what someone said once...
A majority of "real players" said I could fly, and join the thieves guild while still wielding magic...
Just saying.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
Also: Moo.
A majority of "real players" said I could fly, and join the thieves guild while still wielding magic...
Just saying.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
Also: Moo.
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:02 AM CST
>> majority of actual "real players of" should trump what someone said once...
If "someone" is a GM? No. That isn't how roleplaying games work.
>> Maybe you can enlighten me into why a Dragon Priest shouldn't be a Follower of the Knife?
The cults all want to murder each other and if a Dragon Priest/Sidhlot/insert-other-happy-fun-cult-here found out you were studying under Book you would be considered a traitor and murdered or worse.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
If "someone" is a GM? No. That isn't how roleplaying games work.
>> Maybe you can enlighten me into why a Dragon Priest shouldn't be a Follower of the Knife?
The cults all want to murder each other and if a Dragon Priest/Sidhlot/insert-other-happy-fun-cult-here found out you were studying under Book you would be considered a traitor and murdered or worse.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
GERSTEINJ2
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:29 AM CST
under your view the possibilities are too limited.
i'll give you just a hint of an example. Someone can be part of two organizations that are diametrically opposed but share a common goal.
I'll cite the example of my plat thief, Shayddow. a number of years ago she was quite involved and a member of the platinum S'Kra only organization known in common as "the Ru'at." In that organization, they supported Sirolarn. Who was later revealed to be a necromancer. Whereas, the thieves guild there supported <and ultimately prevailed> in putting Vorclaf in power. So as both a S'kra Ru'at member and a Thief, <which at that time was a force to be reckoned with in Plat> she had to swear allegiance to both at once, while keeping both in the dark as to what her ultimate loyalties laid. That's part of RP - being able to handle the capablity of having multiple layers to your character, and not based on a single theme, or facet, to your personality.
So, in the case in point, one can come from a heavily- DragonPriest influenced S'Kra heritage - and remember some of the prayers, rituals, and cultural traditions -- and still be a Philosopher of the Knife.
'That just proves you are still a S'kra Mur" - mister book
the world is broken
i'll give you just a hint of an example. Someone can be part of two organizations that are diametrically opposed but share a common goal.
I'll cite the example of my plat thief, Shayddow. a number of years ago she was quite involved and a member of the platinum S'Kra only organization known in common as "the Ru'at." In that organization, they supported Sirolarn. Who was later revealed to be a necromancer. Whereas, the thieves guild there supported <and ultimately prevailed> in putting Vorclaf in power. So as both a S'kra Ru'at member and a Thief, <which at that time was a force to be reckoned with in Plat> she had to swear allegiance to both at once, while keeping both in the dark as to what her ultimate loyalties laid. That's part of RP - being able to handle the capablity of having multiple layers to your character, and not based on a single theme, or facet, to your personality.
So, in the case in point, one can come from a heavily- DragonPriest influenced S'Kra heritage - and remember some of the prayers, rituals, and cultural traditions -- and still be a Philosopher of the Knife.
'That just proves you are still a S'kra Mur" - mister book
the world is broken
GARAED
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:32 AM CST
I kind of agree with everyone in the latest posts here. While it's true that the Philosiphers of the Knife are supposed to have severed their ties with all former allegiances, if someone can come up with a plausible reason and work that angle then I can see that.
Characters had lives before they became necromancers. One of the most enjoyable aspects of playing Xuren (he was Celestial) has been the sheer terror he's experienced as he watched his old life slowly slip away no matter how fastly he tried to cling to it.
Unless part of the altering of the nervous system was complete wiping of all memory up to that point, then that old life isn't goign to go away no matter how much the necromancer or those they left behind may wish it did. It's up to the player to make that story plausible. So if someone acknowledges their life is forfeit if their past catches up with them but persists on hanging onto the crumbling vestiges of their old life, that kind of makes sense to me.
People claim to be part of one organization or the other all the time. Whether that organization would claim them, however, is a different story.
Anyway...it's really up to every player to determine what the story is for their character. If such is that it offends thine eyes, then look ye not...and stuff.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
Characters had lives before they became necromancers. One of the most enjoyable aspects of playing Xuren (he was Celestial) has been the sheer terror he's experienced as he watched his old life slowly slip away no matter how fastly he tried to cling to it.
Unless part of the altering of the nervous system was complete wiping of all memory up to that point, then that old life isn't goign to go away no matter how much the necromancer or those they left behind may wish it did. It's up to the player to make that story plausible. So if someone acknowledges their life is forfeit if their past catches up with them but persists on hanging onto the crumbling vestiges of their old life, that kind of makes sense to me.
People claim to be part of one organization or the other all the time. Whether that organization would claim them, however, is a different story.
Anyway...it's really up to every player to determine what the story is for their character. If such is that it offends thine eyes, then look ye not...and stuff.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:36 AM CST
That's a red herring or whatever fallacy argument.
You can be part of different organizations, absolutely, but provided the two organizations are not so fundamentally opposing each other or present fundamentally conflicting interests.
Ex. You cannot be the president of the UberEmpire while being the head of the CIA of L33topia at the same time. You cannot be the chairman of the board of Awesome Co. and the Chief Justice at the same time.
You can be part of different organizations, absolutely, but provided the two organizations are not so fundamentally opposing each other or present fundamentally conflicting interests.
Ex. You cannot be the president of the UberEmpire while being the head of the CIA of L33topia at the same time. You cannot be the chairman of the board of Awesome Co. and the Chief Justice at the same time.
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:40 AM CST
I brought it up for two reasons.
One, not everyone is a lore-fu master and may not actually know that the necro-cults of yore are very, very much at each others' throats; remember that before the Inquisition and Book becoming the Triumphant that the cults were actually doing a pretty damn good job exterminating themselves, by and large. Legitimate, me-and-Sidhlot-are-bffs cross-membership is not really possible.
Two, it seemed like something worth discussing. It may be legitimate to say you've defected from another cult, but then you run into the problem of that being contrary to Book's current recruiting criteria. I'm wondering how people are handling this in their own fiction.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
One, not everyone is a lore-fu master and may not actually know that the necro-cults of yore are very, very much at each others' throats; remember that before the Inquisition and Book becoming the Triumphant that the cults were actually doing a pretty damn good job exterminating themselves, by and large. Legitimate, me-and-Sidhlot-are-bffs cross-membership is not really possible.
Two, it seemed like something worth discussing. It may be legitimate to say you've defected from another cult, but then you run into the problem of that being contrary to Book's current recruiting criteria. I'm wondering how people are handling this in their own fiction.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
ALGOTHI
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:46 AM CST
I see the situation like this... There is currently no possible mechanical way to be a Dragon Priest/Bone Elf/Other cult Necromancer. Players are currently using the guild as it is now to represent those cults, since it is the closest thing currently available. I don't really have too much of a problem with this, if there was a mechanical way to be part of those cults I am sure they would have done that instead. I am happy to do a hand wave at the mechanical limitations if someone is doing a good job role playing the substitution.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
GARAED
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:49 AM CST
>Two, it seemed like something worth discussing. It may be legitimate to say you've defected from another cult, but then you run into the problem of that being contrary to Book's current recruiting criteria. I'm wondering how people are handling this in their own fiction.
Having reread your post I see where you're coming from and mistook your tone on my initial reading. I came off a little ranty there at the end, and certainly didn't intend that when I started writing. With all the QQing and insanity lately I guess I'm a little jumpy. Thanks for the clarification.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
Having reread your post I see where you're coming from and mistook your tone on my initial reading. I came off a little ranty there at the end, and certainly didn't intend that when I started writing. With all the QQing and insanity lately I guess I'm a little jumpy. Thanks for the clarification.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 11:52 AM CST
>> I see the situation like this... There is currently no possible mechanical way to be a Dragon Priest/Bone Elf/Other cult Necromancer. Players are currently using the guild as it is now to represent those cults, since it is the closest thing currently available.
I dislike this.
I think handwaving that much of what your character does is bad form. Your character is a Philosopher studying under Zamidren Book. Your character is not a Dragon Priest studying under Zavaes or a Bone Elf studying under Sidhlot or a Xala'shar studying under Veyne.
They are a Philosopher, and part of their background is, like it or not, decided for them. This is not just a mechanical thing, it is a lore and setting thing. Just because something exists in game does not mean it is or should be a supported path for PCs, and it does not mean you get to handwave away huge chunks of the setting because your favorite flavor of Necromancer is not supported by design.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
I dislike this.
I think handwaving that much of what your character does is bad form. Your character is a Philosopher studying under Zamidren Book. Your character is not a Dragon Priest studying under Zavaes or a Bone Elf studying under Sidhlot or a Xala'shar studying under Veyne.
They are a Philosopher, and part of their background is, like it or not, decided for them. This is not just a mechanical thing, it is a lore and setting thing. Just because something exists in game does not mean it is or should be a supported path for PCs, and it does not mean you get to handwave away huge chunks of the setting because your favorite flavor of Necromancer is not supported by design.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
ALGOTHI
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:13 PM CST
>They are a Philosopher, and part of their background is, like it or not, decided for them.
Again, for me it really depends on how well they play it. If they never make reference to Book/Philosophers/etc as someone from their chosen cult should, I wont personally have a problem with it. This is probably no different then the many people who join Book and then immediately throw themselves into Perversity, which is completely against the Philosophers lore.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Again, for me it really depends on how well they play it. If they never make reference to Book/Philosophers/etc as someone from their chosen cult should, I wont personally have a problem with it. This is probably no different then the many people who join Book and then immediately throw themselves into Perversity, which is completely against the Philosophers lore.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
DR-ARMIFER
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:38 PM CST
No PC is a part of the Dragon Priests, or a Bone Elf, or the Xela'shar. Zamidren is running a distinct organization which is not the Necromancer Clearinghouse.
PCs are certainly free to lie to each other, though. Just don't come crying to me in a auto-RP based delusion that the card-carrying Dragon Priests will do anything other than tear your entrails out like the next guy.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
PCs are certainly free to lie to each other, though. Just don't come crying to me in a auto-RP based delusion that the card-carrying Dragon Priests will do anything other than tear your entrails out like the next guy.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
GARAED
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:41 PM CST
>Again, for me it really depends on how well they play it.
There are limits to this. I disagree that someone can jaunt up to crossing, join the necromancer guild, then write that whole guild out of their character and expect to be taken seriously.
The Philosiphers practice a specific brand of necromancy. The things the teach, likely including spell patterns, are completely different from the other brands. I'm all for poetic license when it comes to a character's past (i.e. I came from Sidhlot's clan or I come from the Priesthood of the Dragon).
IMO, and it's only opinion mind you, it's bad form to run around with a character that could not exist because you dreamed up something you thought was "neat" and expect to be taken seriously by people who respect lore.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
There are limits to this. I disagree that someone can jaunt up to crossing, join the necromancer guild, then write that whole guild out of their character and expect to be taken seriously.
The Philosiphers practice a specific brand of necromancy. The things the teach, likely including spell patterns, are completely different from the other brands. I'm all for poetic license when it comes to a character's past (i.e. I came from Sidhlot's clan or I come from the Priesthood of the Dragon).
IMO, and it's only opinion mind you, it's bad form to run around with a character that could not exist because you dreamed up something you thought was "neat" and expect to be taken seriously by people who respect lore.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
KEISERS
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:48 PM CST
>>IMO, and it's only opinion mind you, it's bad form to run around with a character that could not exist because you dreamed up something you thought was "neat" and expect to be taken seriously by people who respect lore.>>
Wait until the next group of GMs and lore will change.
Wait until the next group of GMs and lore will change.
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:49 PM CST
>> IMO, and it's only opinion mind you, it's bad form to run around with a character that could not exist because you dreamed up something you thought was "neat" and expect to be taken seriously by people who respect lore.
I like you. Let's be friends.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
I like you. Let's be friends.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
DR-ARMIFER
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:52 PM CST
http://www.play.net/forums/messages.asp?forum=20&category=13&topic=14&message=4817
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 12:54 PM CST
>> Wait until the next group of GMs and lore will change.
The ironic part of this statement is that nothing discussed in this thread so far was anything that was retconned or altered.
Necromancers have always hated each other, they've never played nice and while the original vision of the guild may well have been an outlandish, Saturday morning cartoonish "League of Evil" that combined all the disparate cults, it's unfair to say the lore changed when that was never actually the lore to begin with, just an idea.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
The ironic part of this statement is that nothing discussed in this thread so far was anything that was retconned or altered.
Necromancers have always hated each other, they've never played nice and while the original vision of the guild may well have been an outlandish, Saturday morning cartoonish "League of Evil" that combined all the disparate cults, it's unfair to say the lore changed when that was never actually the lore to begin with, just an idea.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
ALGOTHI
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 01:02 PM CST
>>> IMO, and it's only opinion mind you, it's bad form to run around with a character that could not exist because you dreamed up something you thought was "neat" and expect to be taken seriously by people who respect lore.
Just to be clear, I think both of you have excellent (and entertaining!) points. While I enjoy and follow the lore of DR, I am not too personally invested in it to be upset when someone is enjoying not following it. People enjoy their text in different flavors, after all.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Just to be clear, I think both of you have excellent (and entertaining!) points. While I enjoy and follow the lore of DR, I am not too personally invested in it to be upset when someone is enjoying not following it. People enjoy their text in different flavors, after all.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
FBC
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 01:07 PM CST
>>Just to be clear, I think both of you have excellent (and entertaining!) points. While I enjoy and follow the lore of DR, I am not too personally invested in it to be upset when someone is enjoying not following it. People enjoy their text in different flavors, after all.
Even that guy that was playing a Dark Elf? The problem is it can be very jarring to other peoples role play.
Even that guy that was playing a Dark Elf? The problem is it can be very jarring to other peoples role play.
LORDMARSHAL
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 01:10 PM CST
One of my biggest pet peeves is people who completely ignore lore so they can play their special snowflake winged half human half dark elf vampire bone elf.
So yeah, if your in the necromancers guild...your a philosopher of the knife.
___________
V, Player of
So yeah, if your in the necromancers guild...your a philosopher of the knife.
___________
V, Player of
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 01:21 PM CST
>While I enjoy and follow the lore of DR, I am not too personally invested in it to be upset when someone is enjoying not following it. People enjoy their text in different flavors, after all.
You can only take that up to a certain level, though.
This isn't WOW, you have a very strong and enforced RP environment. Your peers around you are actively RPing at some degree.
It isn't so much the GMs' dictatorship as it is the DMV presenting a set of traffic laws so people can agree on who has the right of way and everyone can speak a common language in the environment, play by the same set of rules, and have their interactions coherent and consistent.
I agree absolutely that you should not be required to be a 39th degree black belt in Lore-fu like Ysselt and Caelumia are to enjoy a game which you are paying for, but there needs to be a minimal level of mutual respect by adhering to the various ground rules so we can all play together.
You can only take that up to a certain level, though.
This isn't WOW, you have a very strong and enforced RP environment. Your peers around you are actively RPing at some degree.
It isn't so much the GMs' dictatorship as it is the DMV presenting a set of traffic laws so people can agree on who has the right of way and everyone can speak a common language in the environment, play by the same set of rules, and have their interactions coherent and consistent.
I agree absolutely that you should not be required to be a 39th degree black belt in Lore-fu like Ysselt and Caelumia are to enjoy a game which you are paying for, but there needs to be a minimal level of mutual respect by adhering to the various ground rules so we can all play together.
FERDONC
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 01:48 PM CST
>No PC is a part of the Dragon Priests, or a Bone Elf, or the Xela'shar.
BUT WHAT ABOUT ALL MY LEET ALTERATIONS/?!???!?
-Strk
BUT WHAT ABOUT ALL MY LEET ALTERATIONS/?!???!?
-Strk
ALGOTHI
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:10 PM CST
>You can only take that up to a certain level, though.
I absolutely agree. If a character concept is so extremely out there, I will happily make a mental note that my character thinks they are crazy, ignore them and go on with my business.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
I absolutely agree. If a character concept is so extremely out there, I will happily make a mental note that my character thinks they are crazy, ignore them and go on with my business.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
KOUGEN
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:12 PM CST
>but there needs to be a minimal level of mutual respect by adhering to the various ground rules so we can all play together.
No. Moar Bone Elf Vampires and Dark Paladins, plz.
~ Kougen
A shadowling arches through the air, trying desperately to get its wings working before it sails out the window.
No. Moar Bone Elf Vampires and Dark Paladins, plz.
~ Kougen
A shadowling arches through the air, trying desperately to get its wings working before it sails out the window.
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:13 PM CST
Hey, Dark Paladins are kosher. Just not the kind of Dark Paladin a lot of people want to play.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
DR-ARMIFER
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:15 PM CST
The knee-jerk posts from some players lamenting that we are allowing "Dark Paladins" amused me when, in fact, the post took Fallen Paladins quietly behind the barn and shot them.
People pay no attention to the setting, film at 11.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
People pay no attention to the setting, film at 11.
-Armifer
"In our days truth is taken to result from the effacing of the living man behind the mathematical structures that think themselves out in him, rather than he be thinking them." - Emmanuel Levinas
GERSTEINJ2
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:36 PM CST
ones background and ones "race" is in no way refuted by the philosopshers lore. To say that ones ancestors were dragonpriests, and to know some of the prayers, rituals, and to have studied the lore as a young unguilded scholar while growing up in muspar'i etc and whatnot is in no way claiming to be the next aspirant to the empress's throne, or claiming allegiance of the Dragonpriests <creatures> Even if you DO like to wear DP-type gear.
One still follow the teachings of the smoothskin Mister Book. After all, within the guild....
Markat says..." Mr Book is the first among equals and, at least for now, the Philosophers of the Knife follow his lead with pragmatic deference. Love him or hate him, and between you and me, there's a lot more of one than the other - he has the resources and a vision for our survival."
and interestingly enough, just as a side note, before the guild came out <in prime> my <s'kra> thief had an interesting conversation with an GM-NPC Dragonpriest who stopped casting long enough to have a conversation with her -- <prior to Tallis's "holy war" on the priesthood> and there have been S'kra Paladins <notably Taghz>, as well as WMs <tropicalo> that claimed Dragonpriest status. So if a paladin can be a DP...
the world is broken
One still follow the teachings of the smoothskin Mister Book. After all, within the guild....
Markat says..." Mr Book is the first among equals and, at least for now, the Philosophers of the Knife follow his lead with pragmatic deference. Love him or hate him, and between you and me, there's a lot more of one than the other - he has the resources and a vision for our survival."
and interestingly enough, just as a side note, before the guild came out <in prime> my <s'kra> thief had an interesting conversation with an GM-NPC Dragonpriest who stopped casting long enough to have a conversation with her -- <prior to Tallis's "holy war" on the priesthood> and there have been S'kra Paladins <notably Taghz>, as well as WMs <tropicalo> that claimed Dragonpriest status. So if a paladin can be a DP...
the world is broken
ALGOTHI
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:40 PM CST
>So if a paladin can be a DP...
Its just been stated that they cant really be DPs, but again that has never really stopped anyone from claiming/playing it.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
Its just been stated that they cant really be DPs, but again that has never really stopped anyone from claiming/playing it.
Elusive
mundus vult decipi, ergo decipiatur
GERSTEINJ2
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:47 PM CST
<<No. Moar Bone Elf Vampires and Dark Paladins, plz.~ Kougen>>
in my elf's <a trader by the way, not necro, shes a sand elf, not a bone elf> home:
The home contains:
Floor: a dusty oak floor.
Attached: a tasseled cotton rug.
Armor Stand: a skeletal armor rack.
Door: a door.
Fire: a small firepit.
Misc Furniture #1 (usually table slot): a sturdy oak table.
Misc Furniture #2 (usually bed slot): a simple stick cot.
Wall: a rough-hewn oak wall.
Attached: a portrait of a black-clad Elf with fangs visible beneath his grin.
<this was from the recent hallows eve festival> traders DO collect the oddest things...
:-)
>
the world is broken
in my elf's <a trader by the way, not necro, shes a sand elf, not a bone elf> home:
The home contains:
Floor: a dusty oak floor.
Attached: a tasseled cotton rug.
Armor Stand: a skeletal armor rack.
Door: a door.
Fire: a small firepit.
Misc Furniture #1 (usually table slot): a sturdy oak table.
Misc Furniture #2 (usually bed slot): a simple stick cot.
Wall: a rough-hewn oak wall.
Attached: a portrait of a black-clad Elf with fangs visible beneath his grin.
<this was from the recent hallows eve festival> traders DO collect the oddest things...
:-)
>
the world is broken
KOUGEN
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 02:48 PM CST
Sorry, I said Emo Paladin when I meant Fail Paladin.
But let's not miss the real point here - You can be a half-angel super saiyan who crashed on Elanthia in your space pod and don't let anybody tell you differently.
~ Kougen
A shadowling arches through the air, trying desperately to get its wings working before it sails out the window.
But let's not miss the real point here - You can be a half-angel super saiyan who crashed on Elanthia in your space pod and don't let anybody tell you differently.
~ Kougen
A shadowling arches through the air, trying desperately to get its wings working before it sails out the window.
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 03:00 PM CST
Going back to this for a moment because I apparently missed it when skimming the intro post:
>> We are also told that the "hunger" that empowers Lyras was originally "created" by Dzree's Priests. So anything we can study about any possible connections can be useful.
Uh, what?
Who is "we" and who told you this because it's wrong.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
>> We are also told that the "hunger" that empowers Lyras was originally "created" by Dzree's Priests. So anything we can study about any possible connections can be useful.
Uh, what?
Who is "we" and who told you this because it's wrong.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 03:04 PM CST
>You can be a half-angel super saiyan who crashed on Elanthia in your space pod and don't let anybody tell you differently.
Hey, nothing wrong with a blond coated Rakash on a full katamba crawling out of a caravan crushed by a rogue moongate and say "I come from the planet Merewalda. Take me to your leader."
Hey, nothing wrong with a blond coated Rakash on a full katamba crawling out of a caravan crushed by a rogue moongate and say "I come from the planet Merewalda. Take me to your leader."
FERDONC
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 03:23 PM CST
As far as the DP thing goes, and I'm not sure how if at all this applies to the other situations:
Think of it like an organized religion IRL. Anyone can sign up, but that doesn't mean you can just up and join the clergy.
-Strk
Think of it like an organized religion IRL. Anyone can sign up, but that doesn't mean you can just up and join the clergy.
-Strk
GERSTEINJ2
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 03:27 PM CST
part of it is this:
Re: Thing Behind Lyras ยท on 7/5/2009 9:49:06 PM 2041
>>The rules of necromancy have changed over the years, Sorrow used a form of necromancy that ate the souls of others to keep him immortal, or something like that memory might be rusty anyways.
The rules did not change, merely the scope.
The Necromancer's Guild does not compose the entirety (or even the majority) of Necromancers on Elanthia. The Dragon Priests, the Xala'shar, the Bone Elves, etc. are all out there doing exactly what they've always done and will go on being foils of Stupid Evil potential.
The Necromancers trained by the organization that will be the Necromancer's Guild do not deal with the soul, for what should be a very clear reason in the post-Lyras era: you do not want to screw with demons.
-Armifer
and part of it is we are told that the hunger behind Lyras is the third incarnation of the entity --the second incarnation was "edwards enthrophy" <SP> <also posted by armifer - you can look it up on elathepedia>, he also posted that they weren't going to say what it actually was, but the current theory goes from certain people i've spoken with is that somehow it was something that the DPs somehow stumbled upon. <which would have been its "first" incarnation if the timeline is extant.
the world is broken
Re: Thing Behind Lyras ยท on 7/5/2009 9:49:06 PM 2041
>>The rules of necromancy have changed over the years, Sorrow used a form of necromancy that ate the souls of others to keep him immortal, or something like that memory might be rusty anyways.
The rules did not change, merely the scope.
The Necromancer's Guild does not compose the entirety (or even the majority) of Necromancers on Elanthia. The Dragon Priests, the Xala'shar, the Bone Elves, etc. are all out there doing exactly what they've always done and will go on being foils of Stupid Evil potential.
The Necromancers trained by the organization that will be the Necromancer's Guild do not deal with the soul, for what should be a very clear reason in the post-Lyras era: you do not want to screw with demons.
-Armifer
and part of it is we are told that the hunger behind Lyras is the third incarnation of the entity --the second incarnation was "edwards enthrophy" <SP> <also posted by armifer - you can look it up on elathepedia>, he also posted that they weren't going to say what it actually was, but the current theory goes from certain people i've spoken with is that somehow it was something that the DPs somehow stumbled upon. <which would have been its "first" incarnation if the timeline is extant.
the world is broken
IDONS-BUDDY
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 03:37 PM CST
>> the second incarnation was "edwards enthrophy"
Entropy's Glory.
And your theories are well and good, but it would be nice if you would avoid sounding overly authoritative about something like that, because there's nothing to actually suggest or support what you asserted.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
Entropy's Glory.
And your theories are well and good, but it would be nice if you would avoid sounding overly authoritative about something like that, because there's nothing to actually suggest or support what you asserted.
Rev. Reene
"Oh, I'm not omniscient -- but I know a lot."
- Mephistopheles, Faust
GARAED
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 04:40 PM CST
>I like you. Let's be friends.
Are we not friends?
>Wait until the next group of GMs and lore will change.
Perhaps it will. I can't think of a single author I have ever read that hasn't changed some part of their own story to make things fit. GMs are dealing with a setting that's been evolving for about a decade and a half. There are bound to be changes.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
Are we not friends?
>Wait until the next group of GMs and lore will change.
Perhaps it will. I can't think of a single author I have ever read that hasn't changed some part of their own story to make things fit. GMs are dealing with a setting that's been evolving for about a decade and a half. There are bound to be changes.
How blessed are some people, whose lives have no fears, no dreads, to whom sleep is a blessing that comes nightly, and brings nothing but sweet dreams. -Bram Stoker's Dracula
ODIN331
Re: interesting new book - of interest to s'kra necromancers
03/08/2010 07:56 PM CST
Sometimes I feel like if Armifer quit I might hang up my pants forever and reactivate Kadru.
