1. Minds seem to reach near sentience in a little over two days.
2. Two nearly sentient minds sometimes but not always suffice to cap a guide stat. The latest theory is that happier minds are more effective at stat raising.
3. The guide I created and tested entirely after the recent changes supports the 'Charges = MD / 50' proposition. Further testing by MMs of varying skills will be taking place over the next few weeks.
-Artificer Nilassa
You notice Kssarh trying to remain hidden while speaking.
You hear the voice of Kssarh say, "Slackers."
HYPERBOLIC
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/14/2012 08:06 PM CDT
>1. Minds seem to reach near sentience in a little over two days.
squeal
squeal
JHALIASCLERIC
STANLEYJ
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/15/2012 02:42 PM CDT
I've never made of of these and to be honest I really don't know what they are used for. Is there a reason I should be making these? Or what are they used for really? I feel like such a newb in regards to these. Thanks for any information!
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/15/2012 02:57 PM CDT
They allow non MM's to walk the ways to pre-programmed destinations. Typically you'd just want to program 2 destinations. but if you added more, it becomes a bus-stop loop pattern (from A to B, B to C, C to A)
Generally you won't need to make a guide for yourself. I mean, theoretically you can create a guide that can walk the ways more safely and faster than your own astral walking abilities, but why burn a 30 day cooldown for that?
The minds (components used for "programming") used to take 30 days to incubate which made it a tremendous hassle and if you log on too late they go insane. With them getting nearly sentient and never getting insane for waiting too long, though, I may just make my alts several Xing to Ratha or Xing to Mer'kresh guides.
Generally you won't need to make a guide for yourself. I mean, theoretically you can create a guide that can walk the ways more safely and faster than your own astral walking abilities, but why burn a 30 day cooldown for that?
The minds (components used for "programming") used to take 30 days to incubate which made it a tremendous hassle and if you log on too late they go insane. With them getting nearly sentient and never getting insane for waiting too long, though, I may just make my alts several Xing to Ratha or Xing to Mer'kresh guides.
STANLEYJ
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/15/2012 03:43 PM CDT
Gotcha. So really the only reason I would want to make one would be to sell / give it to someone to use for travelling back and forth easier from places like say the islands. Do they use them from the shards like non - 100th circle moon mages do for travelling the ways?
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/15/2012 03:48 PM CDT
Yes; I believe they raise the guide while standing before the shard.
it still sucks their concentration so they'd likely need decent mentals, but I've never experimented because usually my Moon Mage is active to perform all my gating needs.
it still sucks their concentration so they'd likely need decent mentals, but I've never experimented because usually my Moon Mage is active to perform all my gating needs.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/15/2012 04:05 PM CDT
There are three stats a guide can have, and AFAIK, one of them relates to the users mentals/Arcana. You can add to this stat if you want to make it easier for an NMU. Another stat affects speed, so this too can help NMUs get through ok. That said, I sold a guide to a thief with ~100 ranks in Arcana that wasn't terribly good in the mentals/Arcana stat, and was the lowest speed possible, and he was able to use the guide with no problems.
STANLEYJ
ALEPH-ONE
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/16/2012 03:24 AM CDT
>>How much are they usually selling for?
When we were on the 30 day timer I sold them for 700 plat kronars. Now it's uncertain what the market will be like. I've been thinking about 250.
-- Player of Eyuve
When we were on the 30 day timer I sold them for 700 plat kronars. Now it's uncertain what the market will be like. I've been thinking about 250.
-- Player of Eyuve
NIKPACK
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/16/2012 12:54 PM CDT
<<When we were on the 30 day timer I sold them for 700 plat kronars. Now it's uncertain what the market will be like. I've been thinking about 250.
Nae, keep it at 700. Earn some more coin. It is a convenience for the user after all.
Nikpack
Nae, keep it at 700. Earn some more coin. It is a convenience for the user after all.
Nikpack
SHERWOODS5
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/16/2012 02:33 PM CDT
You really will have to wait to see how much to charge. If the production of guides goes up, you will have to deal with a flooded market and charge less. If no one takes advantage of the new mechanics to make guides to sell, you can keep to charging 700. Supply and demand!
Dierik
I'm SO tired of hearing "it's not fair" in regards to everything in this game people aren't good at or can't figure out how to combat. You'd think this was the 90's and we were all still 12 years old.
Uhhhh, that would have been 1970 for me.
Dierik
I'm SO tired of hearing "it's not fair" in regards to everything in this game people aren't good at or can't figure out how to combat. You'd think this was the 90's and we were all still 12 years old.
Uhhhh, that would have been 1970 for me.
URUTU
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 12:02 AM CDT
Price fixing > supply and demand.
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
STANLEYJ
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 12:12 AM CDT
We just all need tO agree that guides are 700 plat.
ILLIENA
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 12:27 AM CDT
> We just all need tO agree that guides are 700 plat.
And have a private conversation with the kneecaps of anyone who won't play ball.
And have a private conversation with the kneecaps of anyone who won't play ball.
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 12:28 AM CDT
>We just all need tO agree that guides are 700 plat.
I love game theory.
I love game theory.
URUTU
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 12:29 AM CDT
<<We just all need tO agree that guides are 700 plat. >>
There you go. Run it like the Locksmith Union used to with lockpicks. Someone gets out of line, you lean on 'em. If they argue, you drill 'em. That's a good business for you.
I kind of like the idea of a Moonie Death Squad.
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
There you go. Run it like the Locksmith Union used to with lockpicks. Someone gets out of line, you lean on 'em. If they argue, you drill 'em. That's a good business for you.
I kind of like the idea of a Moonie Death Squad.
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
SHERWOODS5
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 09:30 AM CDT
I hope we can get that as a title. I kind of like Moonie Death Squad.
Dierik
I'm SO tired of hearing "it's not fair" in regards to everything in this game people aren't good at or can't figure out how to combat. You'd think this was the 90's and we were all still 12 years old.
Uhhhh, that would have been 1970 for me.
Dierik
I'm SO tired of hearing "it's not fair" in regards to everything in this game people aren't good at or can't figure out how to combat. You'd think this was the 90's and we were all still 12 years old.
Uhhhh, that would have been 1970 for me.
HEASTRENFHERO
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 02:01 PM CDT
With the time limit being cut in third, I for one am going to be charging less due to the flood in the market. I've decided on 200 plat per.
URUTU
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/17/2012 02:44 PM CDT
<<When we were on the 30 day timer I sold them for 700 plat kronars. Now it's uncertain what the market will be like. I've been thinking about 250.>>
I don't know much about guides. Just out of curiosity, what is the most popular or best selling route? I'm guessing something from the mainland to mer'kresh? Are they one-way or round trip routes?
Do they sometimes have different destination shards?
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
I don't know much about guides. Just out of curiosity, what is the most popular or best selling route? I'm guessing something from the mainland to mer'kresh? Are they one-way or round trip routes?
Do they sometimes have different destination shards?
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
ALEPH-ONE
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/18/2012 04:53 AM CDT
>>Just out of curiosity, what is the most popular or best selling route?
I didn't keep track of all the guides I sold, and of course my sample is tiny due to the 30 day limit, but my list went something like:
Mer'Kresh -- Raven's Point
Mer'Kresh -- Raven's Point
Mer'Kresh -- Shard
Hibarnhvidar -- Aesry
Shard -- Muspar'i
Crossing -- Ratha
The first two are indications of people wanting to travel between Kresh and intercessors. The others were mostly for people training in one location but feeling that their "home" was in the other one.
-- Player of Eyuve
I didn't keep track of all the guides I sold, and of course my sample is tiny due to the 30 day limit, but my list went something like:
Mer'Kresh -- Raven's Point
Mer'Kresh -- Raven's Point
Mer'Kresh -- Shard
Hibarnhvidar -- Aesry
Shard -- Muspar'i
Crossing -- Ratha
The first two are indications of people wanting to travel between Kresh and intercessors. The others were mostly for people training in one location but feeling that their "home" was in the other one.
-- Player of Eyuve
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/18/2012 11:02 AM CDT
Hib to Aesry kind of surprises me. It makes sense if the person considers one their home, but otherwise... basically I have to go to an out of the way place in order to get to another out of the way place..
URUTU
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/18/2012 02:16 PM CDT
<<the guides I sold>>
I expected the The Mer'kresh routes, although having them go to Raven's Point I didn't see coming. But your explanation makes sense. It definitely looks like someone needs to pre-order what they want. Except for the first two that list is all over the place.
From your examples it looks like guides just operate between two points and don't have multipe routes like some kind of Rand McNally. And my uninformed assumption is they can operate in both directions.
Thanks for that info.
<<Any idea on what skills will be used to make an astral guide in 3.0 and how many ranks you will need? I'm guessing enchanting but no clue on the rank reqs. Will the formula that determines charges be based on enchanting?>>
Lore folders might be a better place to ask.
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
I expected the The Mer'kresh routes, although having them go to Raven's Point I didn't see coming. But your explanation makes sense. It definitely looks like someone needs to pre-order what they want. Except for the first two that list is all over the place.
From your examples it looks like guides just operate between two points and don't have multipe routes like some kind of Rand McNally. And my uninformed assumption is they can operate in both directions.
Thanks for that info.
<<Any idea on what skills will be used to make an astral guide in 3.0 and how many ranks you will need? I'm guessing enchanting but no clue on the rank reqs. Will the formula that determines charges be based on enchanting?>>
Lore folders might be a better place to ask.
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
BEYONDDISBELIEF
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/18/2012 02:54 PM CDT
>From your examples it looks like guides just operate between two points and don't have multipe routes like some kind of Rand McNally.
They're typically made with 2 destinations but you can add more.
The disadvantage with adding more destinations is regardless of number of destinations you can't CHOOSE where to go. The guide functions like a one-way bus stop route system so if you had 4 destinations, it goes from A shard to B shard, B to C, C to D, and D to A.
So you can imagine the hassle it might be if you programmed a Rolagi (Crossing), Besogi (Kresh), Marendin (Shard) guide, if you were at Kresh and want to go straight back to xing, well you can't, and have to go to Shard first before burning a second charge to get to Xing.
SOME people might be able to live with such a quirk and "save money" buying such a customized guide, but for most people it'd end up being more inconvenient.
> And my uninformed assumption is they can operate in both directions.
Yes, the guide will operate on any shard in which a destination shard is programmed into it.
They're typically made with 2 destinations but you can add more.
The disadvantage with adding more destinations is regardless of number of destinations you can't CHOOSE where to go. The guide functions like a one-way bus stop route system so if you had 4 destinations, it goes from A shard to B shard, B to C, C to D, and D to A.
So you can imagine the hassle it might be if you programmed a Rolagi (Crossing), Besogi (Kresh), Marendin (Shard) guide, if you were at Kresh and want to go straight back to xing, well you can't, and have to go to Shard first before burning a second charge to get to Xing.
SOME people might be able to live with such a quirk and "save money" buying such a customized guide, but for most people it'd end up being more inconvenient.
> And my uninformed assumption is they can operate in both directions.
Yes, the guide will operate on any shard in which a destination shard is programmed into it.
ALEPH-ONE
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/18/2012 11:35 PM CDT
>>Hib to Aesry kind of surprises me.
Yes, that was one of the "training vs. home" people. I believe he did his training in Hib but felt that Aesry was his home.
Oh yes, another that I forgot was Shard to Throne City (home of Shard, Throne City for museum stealing).
>>And my uninformed assumption is they can operate in both directions.
They can. As has already been explained, 2 destinations per guide is usually the best bet.
-- Player of Eyuve
Yes, that was one of the "training vs. home" people. I believe he did his training in Hib but felt that Aesry was his home.
Oh yes, another that I forgot was Shard to Throne City (home of Shard, Throne City for museum stealing).
>>And my uninformed assumption is they can operate in both directions.
They can. As has already been explained, 2 destinations per guide is usually the best bet.
-- Player of Eyuve
GRIM45
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/19/2012 12:01 AM CDT
Whats the general speed on these things? Cool down?
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
ALEPH-ONE
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/19/2012 01:03 AM CDT
>>Whats the general speed on these things? Cool down?
I'm going to do my testing on this next week when my timer is up. Believe it or not, I've never tested one before (because blowing a 30-day-to-make enchantment just wasn't worth it).
Maybe Nilassa can answer more precisely, but my impression is that they are roughly the same as a typical MM using the ways -- i.e. 3-5 min between destinations, in part depending on the "speed" stat of the guide.
Don't know what the cooldown is but I'd be surprised if there were one.
-- Player of Eyuve
I'm going to do my testing on this next week when my timer is up. Believe it or not, I've never tested one before (because blowing a 30-day-to-make enchantment just wasn't worth it).
Maybe Nilassa can answer more precisely, but my impression is that they are roughly the same as a typical MM using the ways -- i.e. 3-5 min between destinations, in part depending on the "speed" stat of the guide.
Don't know what the cooldown is but I'd be surprised if there were one.
-- Player of Eyuve
HYPERBOLIC
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/19/2012 09:34 AM CDT
I didn't record the speed but I'm sure it didn't take more than 2 minutes per trip when I was testing and there was no cooldown.
But it's possible guides with lesser stats could be different.
-Artificer Nilassa
You notice Kssarh trying to remain hidden while speaking.
You hear the voice of Kssarh say, "Slackers."
But it's possible guides with lesser stats could be different.
-Artificer Nilassa
You notice Kssarh trying to remain hidden while speaking.
You hear the voice of Kssarh say, "Slackers."
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/19/2012 11:17 AM CDT
This is what I understand, and could be totes wrong;
There are three stats to guides; sanity, force, and speed. Sanity is a measure of how long the guide will last (how many uses), force is a measure of how much Arcana the user needs (inverse proportion, more force requires less Arcana), and speed being how much time the user will spend in the AP.
I handed a thief with ~100 ranks of Arcana a middle level force guide with the lowest level of speed (glacial, I believe?), and he could use it fine (so sufficient Arcana), and each trip took ~3m. This was Taisgath to Taniender I believe.
I just made a friend a Besoge to Taniender guide, and something must have changed because I was able to max out (or nearly?) every single stat.
There are three stats to guides; sanity, force, and speed. Sanity is a measure of how long the guide will last (how many uses), force is a measure of how much Arcana the user needs (inverse proportion, more force requires less Arcana), and speed being how much time the user will spend in the AP.
I handed a thief with ~100 ranks of Arcana a middle level force guide with the lowest level of speed (glacial, I believe?), and he could use it fine (so sufficient Arcana), and each trip took ~3m. This was Taisgath to Taniender I believe.
I just made a friend a Besoge to Taniender guide, and something must have changed because I was able to max out (or nearly?) every single stat.
JHALIASCLERIC
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/19/2012 11:28 AM CDT
Also, out of curiosity, does 'You cannot add an untrained Crystal Mind!' or such mean that the guide is at minds?
URUTU
Re: Astral Guide observations
08/19/2012 01:03 PM CDT
For additional info:
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Moon%20Mages/Enchantment%20System%20and%20Other%20Magical%20Items/view/171
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Moon%20Mages/Enchantment%20System%20and%20Other%20Magical%20Items/view/173
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Moon%20Mages/Enchantment%20System%20and%20Other%20Magical%20Items/view/171
http://forums.play.net/forums/DragonRealms/The%20Moon%20Mages/Enchantment%20System%20and%20Other%20Magical%20Items/view/173
Kaxis
>You hear a soft, seductive voice whisper, "Kaxis...you shall meet Death here...." The voice quickly fades away.
