Just want to say again, this release was verrrrry cool.
I love the method and the messaging. While it's not a spell I would use persistently due to RP reasons, it's still a VERY NEAT spell and I love how it works and was put together. Also, I really love that the restrictions it does impose make complete sense for it.

Just read the wiki page.

Any chance people could put the research and other messaging on there somewhere? I like what's already there.

Also, is the spell a randomized alignment combination/setup, or do you specify it?

If you don't want to answer for 'spoilers' that's cool

>>The only questions I still have are about it's duration

Standard alignments are permanent. Others last as long as your godling is alive. Dun dun dun.

>> and I'm fairly sure if there is an easter egg bonus in it I don't think I found it yet.

The spell itself shouldn't have many surprise bits (other than how the Alaudian alignments behave). There was a nasty World Dragon alignment in there during much of the development, but I opted to save it for a future metaspell. The corruption, on the other hand, is probably more complex than the spell.

>>Also, is the spell a randomized alignment combination/setup, or do you specify it?

Latter.

>>Additionally, I don't know if everyone gets a random name for their new "friend" or not, but I'm curious if there's a translation for the name I received

In retrospect, it would have been fitting to name the godling in the sorcerer's own language. But no, it's mostly gibberish.

>>Skuyaseor

Heh, I'm sorry.

GM Grejuva

>Heh, I'm sorry

Heeey don't be hating on poor sweet Skuyaseor.

There's a very good reason for the penalty. It really shouldn't be 100% convenient to contravene cosmic laws just because you want to tweak your alignment and still have your lava.

>>And is it possible to use DI book spells while aligning to those dieties?

Sure, the alignment isn't what interferes with Divine Intervention. As I mentioned, antinomic corruption is rather complex, with at least one benefit even, and can be worked around in some ways if you understand it. Hint: it's all about the godling.

GM Grejuva

I had completed the research, was just about ready to finish to get this spell, and then I cancelled - I guess I'm questioning the benefits.

So...to my fellow Clerics who opted to choose the spell. Is it worth the two spell slots?

And if it is worth the slots it costs....does it benefit a lower circled Cleric vs a higher circled one? Or does circle make any kind of a difference?

~Gab

Sorry for the double post -

>They're all transcendent necromancers!

Tee hee!

Two things come to mind.

1) Unless my memory is betraying me, the original Kaldar/Gnome migration to the provinces was spurred by fleeing religious persecution in their desire to worship the 13. They and their descendants then don't really have a call to cultural ownership of the Alaudian gods but instead a unique flavor of Immortals worship -- which is exactly what's been written and discussed at length in previous years.

2) Not every divine being is built equally. The Alaudian gods are, for reasons implied but not explicated, not in the favor business. This certainly can lead to a crisis of faith in a people who've become used to proactive interference and gratification in their deities. But that's not bad, that's not a fault; that's an element of the story being told.

-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Italo Calvino

>>> Favors just isn't a thing that's associated with the Alaudian gods. There's a reason for this, but right now we're implying it in the context and messaging rather than flat out spoiling it.

Since my cleric can't (presumably yet) align with Alaudian gods, would someone be willing to share the messaging to satisfy my curiosity?

>I thought everyone already came to terms with the fact that "god" in Elanthia means "really big deal king" more than "RL concept of god".

There are 100% individuals who both RP characters who don't believe this, and themselves as players don't believe this.

>Immortals are just extra-planar beings, like demons, with a really good PR agent. Could a Necro get to the same level as those Immortals/demons/etc? Probably. Empaths may have done it a few times in the past before other things made it so they couldn't anymore.

I don't now how much of this is public knowledge yet, so I'm hesitant to start asking some lore questions, but I think there's a lot of very interesting discussions to be had between Clerics, Moonies, and Necromancers regarding this matter, and I really hope these discussions can start moving out of being solely had by either Necromeetings or Inquisitors.

>>There are 100% individuals who both RP characters who don't believe this, and themselves as players don't believe this.

Agreed, but if a poster is saying "I hope this isn't true", I'm assuming that's the player hoping something isn't true, not their character, and I think the OOC explainers we've had throughout the years are clearly indicating that we're looking more at the "and they can get killed because they're just really strong" versions of the classical Greek gods than, like, something that is all-powerful like a Judeo-Christian interpretation.

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Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>1) Unless my memory is betraying me, the original Kaldar/Gnome migration to the provinces was spurred by fleeing religious persecution in their desire to worship the 13. They and their descendants then don't really have a call to cultural ownership of the Alaudian gods but instead a unique flavor of Immortals worship -- which is exactly what's been written and discussed at length in previous years.

You're largely correct on this, and my main (Malkien) does worship the 13. Though you are approaching the decision from that as someone who creates in-game lore yourself, I'm approaching it as someone who has explored the dynamics of playing various Kaldar players.

Logically, most Kaldar at this point would be second/third generation, and the dynamic between struggling with integration and returning to "your roots" (i.e. in this case, the Gorbesh) is IMO the most interesting dynamic available to a Kaldar PC. Just look at the player-created Kaldar titles as an example; I don't want to put words into the mouths of active players who can speak for themselves, but clearly there is player interest in the Alaudian pantheon.

I know I personally have requested them at various times, but the blunt fact is that without mechanical support for favors, that roleplay avenue is closed. Malkien worships the 13 because I as a player had no choice, and it's far too late to change that decision now.

>Out of curiosity, why? I think the notion that mortals in Elanthia have been doing weird stuff for a long time, and that 'Transcending as a Necromancer' can take a lot of different flavors is a pretty cool notion. That religion in Elanthia is itself a mixed bag better described as 'Applied Theology' than 'Philosophical Musings on the Divine' is a nice icing on that.

I thought I had spelled it out already, but I'll attempt to do so more explicitly.

Various Kaldar players, myself included, have been asking for a method of obtaining favors from the Albarian pantheon for years. It's been shot down repeatedly, with lore being the basis of it, and now this latest lore development seems to be taking it off the table entirely.

I understand from a lore perspective that asking "why not Eu favors?" and "why not Tieheq favors?" are necessarily different, since the Prydaen migration had no subtext of wishing to escape their "old" culture.

Still, I've been OOCly asking for Alaudian favors for years, as have various Kaldar PCs, and being the only race that can't worship deities associated with their traditional background burns in my craw. Friggin Asketi is interested in granting mortals favors, but Meiron (protective/nurturing Alaudian god) isn't? Necromancers have mechanical support for openly defying the Gods, but a Tieheq favor is a step too far? I just don't get it.

I don't care if Tieheq is "mean," make the favor orbs drain vitality, or something.

I don't take it personally, but I am despairing a little that I can't really direct your line of thinking without being obvious about where we're going with the Alaudian gods. I suppose the safest thing for me to suggest is that it... isn't a random or unfathomable feature of the Alaudian gods that was decided on whim, but a natural consequence of other decisions regarding how divinity works in the game.

It's certainly unfair to the Alaudian gods, but so is gravity to the falling man. I guess to me the greater question is "Is it unfair to the players?" and I... don't honestly think so? From my perspective the Alaudian gods (and Alaudian everything, broadly speaking) exists to help tell the stories we're trying to tell. I do see them as in a support role rather than as full fledged actors in the story. Future GMs may want to use them more actively, and may even retcon what we're doing now. And that'll be their right. I can only do what I perceive as best for the story, and let the rest shake out as the years go on.

-Armifer
"Perinthia's astronomers are faced with a difficult choice. Either they must admit that all their calculations were wrong ... or else they must reveal that the order of the gods is reflected exactly in the city of monsters." - Italo Calvino

This was my character's view a decade+ ago, and I'm sure things are more fleshed out by now in terms of the lore, but going back to the "immortals = really big kings" thing I just assumed there weren't Tieheq favors because they rule over there and Immortals rule over here, and if Humans migrated to Gorbesh-town they'd be lamenting why Chadatru can't just grant favors for people living in another ruler's kingdom. In other words, it's like asking why Vorclaf can't pardon someone who committed crimes and is jailed in Qi: it ain't under his rule.

Alternatively, the Alaudian pantheon might just have a different idea of what souls need to do, and it doesn't serve their needs to keep people alive. If you're constantly sending your best heroes back to the land of the living, you're not going to give Orisas much of an army to use during the end-days.

Immortals keep the hero class/select people alive for their reasons. Extra-planar demonic forces do the same. If the Alaudian pantheon is on the same power-level/capability as the Kermorian pantheon, they might just not see a good reason to do so, or feel that it's counter-productive to their own goals.

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Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

>>Perhaps the Alaudian pantheon originates from a plane other than the Spiritual Plane. If that is the case, one might need to consider how are they different from demons.

That would be amusing as hell, but isn't the plane demons come from still a big question mark? They might come from the spiritual plane, as well.

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Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.

Will it be possible by some means to get a post title "of <alternate god/Alaudian god>"