Vinjince, I read in one of your posts in another folder that you used Whirlwind while hunting in celps, I believe. I've never used it as part of my hunting, but just tried it out and I like the training results. What I did not like was the balance penalty.

Is there a particular combination that helps regain balance after using Whirlwind? Something like Whirlwind, feint, draw, sweep, slice, chop, parry, Whirlwind, etc?

I think the exp gain from using it would be very nice, but I don't want to use it at the expense of tanking my balance if there's a way to minimize it.

Light Edged: 472 97% analyzing (18/34) Medium Edged: 510 14% analyzing (18/34)
Heavy Edged: 607 41% cogitating (24/34) Twohanded Edged: 599 19% scrutinizing (17/34)

I'm not sure how effective whirlwind will be with LE, but the exp gain will probably allow me to cycle through my weapons faster. Your thoughts? Or anyone else's? Simon?

Thanks for the help.


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Stop being wrong and people will stop telling you that you are wrong.

- Simon

It isn't the balance hit thats so bad though, its the defensive penalty, right?


- George, Player of Foresee

<<Is there a particular combination that helps regain balance after using Whirlwind?>>

The cost of using Whirlwind is that the last maneuver penalty will be fairly hefty (although it is managable IMO depending on your defenses against what creature you are going up against) and that the next manuever you use will lower your balance. It's just a given for the cost.

<<I'm not sure how effective whirlwind will be with LE, but the exp gain will probably allow me to cycle through my weapons faster.>>

That's the intent and you see this somewhat more if you are using two LEs at the same time.

<<Something like Whirlwind, feint, draw, sweep, slice, chop, parry, Whirlwind, etc?>>

That will keep you with decent balance with enough time to easily regain it using the current combat system. I also use wolverine dance with melee training so it counteracts bad balance at times with just using feint/draw/slice/chop using edged weapons. At the chop/feint section, it'll decrease my position and balance, but my wolverine dance is raising up the balance when it pulses, however I'm attacking more per time without using dodge/parry so I'll get more weapon experience at minimal defensive cost.

I tested it out in Test server and I never went below around 74% fatigue. It is incredibly managable for only 26% loss of fatigue in that Test mode. I believe Dartenian is removing a lot of the penalties associated with defenses to make it more on par with offenses. However, I think he is going overboard on the defenses - but that's just my opinion from Test mode and I know it isn't anywhere near finalized. On the bright side, the affects of open rolls seems to be minimalized there compared to what we see in Prime.

- Simon

I don't use sweep in my combos because of the last manuever penalty with it, although it can be deemed managable right now for my defensive setup with my skills and stats - it's just a habit thing that I got accustomed to not using it when killing via PvP melee or hunting by hand. The only thing that kills people at the higher end is open rolls to a critical body part. That's part of the whole new combat rewrite objectives.

<<Whirlwind when incredibly balanced only?>>

If you want - everyone's milage will vary. It's really depends on your defensive skills and defensive stats primarily, IMO. I just make it out of habit to roar anger (the earth);roar trothfang (butchery) to reduce the enemy's balance, strength, agility and reflexes before using whirlwind so that even though I'm at a worse balance position, it isn't a critical factor to lead to either:

A) my character getting hit

B) my character's death

There was a time a few years ago where it was absolutely vital to have incredibly balanced/overwhelming position on your opponent. Now, if you are some what badly balanced or very badly balanced, it will impact you but no where near as much. Again, it's something that you can survive. You need to test it out for your situation. If you are barely surviving against the mobs you are facing, you probably want to hold back on using whirlwind until you can hold your own defensively against those mobs. So for TF, a few days. :)

- Simon

I wonder what fient whirlwind do.


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Kertig Heart Magdar Bluefletch, Legendary Barbarian of M'Riss

I do use sweep with my ME, 2HE, and HE slicers. But I don't with LE, and I do follow sweep up with something to raise my balance.

Player of...


Sometimes the key to happiness is not assuming it is locked in the first place- Ziggy

A journey of a thousand SMILES begins with a single step- Ziggy

>Thanks Rmel. I might just take sweep out of my edged weapon combos.

Leave it in HE and 2HE, and just change it to a feint sweep if you're worried about the last maneuver penalty. It's counter productive to have it in LE, and there's no point adding it to the ME combo.