Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 10:57 AM CDT
Is it just me or does berserk avalanche basically completely negate the need for any fatigue maintenance?

I was DRAWing a 120 stone maul at 3 second RT, continuously and never dropped below about 75% stamina.

I'm trying to decide if that's cause I have very high strength and stamina or because avalanche is overpowered.

Thoughts?


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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 11:37 AM CDT
Avalanche is available to me as a 29th circle barb, but I haven't chosen an ability yet. I don't have ANY berserks at all, and I'm not sure I want to start.

form list
You have not been trained in any Forms from the path of the Horde.
From the path of the Flame you know the Forms: Buffalo, Monkey and Swan.
From the path of the Predator you know the Forms: Piranha, Eagle and Wolverine.

meditation list
You have not been trained in any Meditations from the path of the Horde.
From the path of the Flame you know the Meditations: Flame, Power and Contemplation.
From the path of the Predator you know the Meditations: Seek.

roar list
You have not been trained in any Roars from the path of the Horde.
You have not been trained in any Roars from the path of the Flame.
From the path of the Predator you know the Roars: Everild's Rage.

berserk list
You have not been trained in any Berserks from the path of the Horde.
You have not been trained in any Berserks from the path of the Flame.
You have not been trained in any Berserks from the path of the Predator.

Currently 29th circle, hunting kra'hei hatchlings without any difficulty. I use Contemplation, Monkey, Swan (Warding training purposes only), Piranha, and Eagle.

Any more senior barbs have any thoughts or recommendations?






________________________________________________________________


"I only automatically kill players when they're asking for it or it's funny. Or both." ~GM Raesh
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 12:09 PM CDT
<<I'm trying to decide if that's cause I have very high strength and stamina or because avalanche is overpowered.>>

Its because you have very high strength/stamina, I dont really feel its overpowered, I've used it for my very small barbarian a little, but will eventually drop it.




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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 12:13 PM CDT
I like Flashflood a lot in that it trains warding so you can ditch swan, very usefull in training and PvP. Tornado is a must zerc imo. Wildfire is a nice booster, but full disclosure non of my barbs have it anymore due to wanting to grab masteries etc...

I also have Cyclone, but mainly just as a tree filler for flame (to get to bear)





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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 02:23 PM CDT
Interesting. I'll have to take a look at upcoming skills. I just remember the old days of barbarianism and berserking out of a stun and then dying. That's the main reason I don't have any berserks now, even though that's ridiculous because the game has changed so much.

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"I only automatically kill players when they're asking for it or it's funny. Or both." ~GM Raesh
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 04:49 PM CDT
Yes zercs are totally different now.




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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 08:24 PM CDT

I didn't use any berserks in 3.0. 3.1 if very different. Very little cost in IF to use and exccellent for training. The boosts are useful as well. I currently use avalance, tornado, and wildfire.
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 10:02 PM CDT
i also kinda love the idea of a zercing barb... def more than some ballet form/dancing one




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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/10/2014 11:56 PM CDT
<<Berserk avalanche...I dont really feel its overpowered, I've used it for my very small barbarian a little, but will eventually drop it.>>

You have got to be kidding! I love berserk avalanche and use it all the time and probably will use until I reach the state where my fatigue doesn't crash when I reach Caraamon's age. I would be so toast without it. But then I train all blunts and so get tired a lot (also I hunt usually burdened by boxes and bundles and that affects fatigue). But not every barb trains the same weapons and if you don't use blunts that often I can see where you won't want avalanche.

Caraamon--shhhh! Keep yer mouth shut about overpower stuff! ::ducks and runs fast::

Shinarah
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/11/2014 09:13 AM CDT
Eh, fatigue in general has been a broken stat since the 2.0 days. I've often pondered what could be done with it to make it more useful.

Balancing it across 100s of ranks of Stamina and Discipline - where weapons themselves don't change, is damn hard. I'm also worried that "fixing" the calculations more so people of all circles have to pay more attention to it will only result in anger from the players.

One idea was to make fatigue work more like mana. For example:

* Fatigue only gives a 10% defensive penalty when below 25%
* Fatigue gives up to a 10% offensive penalty when below 25%
* Fatigue regenerates much quicker when below 25%
* Fatigue only gives a 10% modifier to disengaging from combat when below 25%

* Fatigue regeneration slows while engaged
* Weapon attacks would be a constant drain on Fatigue - 60 seconds to empty for 20 stam/disc. 200 seconds to empty with 100 stam/disc
* Bob/Circle/Weave/Feint/Parry/Dodge/Block all regenerate some fatigue
* Fatigue is expended to power maneuvers
* New maneuvers that require fatigue to be above a certain % would be added (flying side kick into the Roman Army :::cough:::) Allows battle to start off with a big hit, and then you must ratio or plan your subsequent hits

I dunno. It is really difficult to balance. But IMO there is a good argument from removing fatigue entirely in the game today. It is a useless stat once you get past about circle 75.




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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/11/2014 09:27 AM CDT

<<I dunno. It is really difficult to balance. But IMO there is a good argument from removing fatigue entirely in the game today. It is a useless stat once you get past about circle 75.>>

I'd personally be in this camp. I'm not sure fatigue really adds anything but frustration. Its easy enough to "script" around, but at the end of the day I can't really see the point.

As a side note your probably right;

I would probably rage if I had to deal with fatigue again with my higher level characters.




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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/11/2014 09:32 AM CDT
<<I dunno. It is really difficult to balance. But IMO there is a good argument from removing fatigue entirely in the game today. It is a useless stat once you get past about circle 75.

I still deal with fatigue pretty often. It just boils down to what you're doing.

That said, when I had access to Lilt fatigue didn't mean a damn thing.



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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/12/2014 08:36 AM CDT
I would be sad if fatigue was removed, if only because it would devalue my two favorite stats, Strength and Stamina.



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Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/12/2014 12:14 PM CDT
>>I would be sad if fatigue was removed, if only because it would devalue my two favorite stats, Strength and Stamina.


Not overly, ignoring fatigue completely those are still rather valuable stats in modern combat. Or in your case, for carrying that metric ton of forging supplies.

Samsaren
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/12/2014 12:23 PM CDT
I dont think fatigue should change in any way, but if you WERE gonna change it I'd rather it just get removed.




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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/12/2014 05:01 PM CDT
Nooo... Fatigue is my favorite stat to damage! I can't hit nerves anymore, get away from the rest of my combat toolkit!



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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/12/2014 05:06 PM CDT
Yeah I don't see this really happening. If you cut fatigue out you trivialize spells and abilities in multiple guilds and devalue stats contributing to total fatigue.



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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/13/2014 11:49 AM CDT
If it allows us to provide a more balance and fair combat system... anything is on the table.

My problem with fatigue is:

1). Fatigue damage is crippling and violates global caps (0 fatigue is > 2 capped defense/offense debuffs)

2). Fatigue damage is impossible to regenerate effectively during a fight once lost




"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/13/2014 12:31 PM CDT
>>2). Fatigue damage is impossible to regenerate effectively during a fight once lost

Any chance there can be a new command like "ready" that essentially has a character "reposition" itself, which draws balance and positioning toward neutral/default (even if it's higher) and restores a nice chunk of fatigue after a tactics check?

So you're not going to be able to relax and reposition against something that grossly outclasses you, but against something on-level you can restore some fatigue/balance/etc. Might even help encourage people to do balance/fatigue harming moves. A whirlwind or two followed up by a RT-involved pause, only do go into your next flurry of hits.



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Re: Berserk Avalanche 06/13/2014 04:15 PM CDT
Zephyr heals my fatigue just fine... is this what it feels like to be a cleric?

If anything fatigue is a wonky system because it effectively didn't exist for years and devolpers selectively ignored it (oh hello, spirit health!). It's the game dev equivalent of everyone training the most overpowered skill. DR Combat has tended to get increasingly one dimentional in that respect, especially compared to the big pvp muds



>Forgive my snark, but welcome to the life of a warrior mage.
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