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It seems a bit unfair that people are not allowed to buy them anymore. It's fair that there might be something about them that needs to be fixed although I am astonished that they can be so resource demanding, but could someone official at least say something new about the situation?
Doesn't people who didn't have a chance to buy a boat while they were available deserve to have one ever unless they want to pay a thousand dollars for one by going around the in-game (and I assume preferred by the staff) way of trading?
There are too much money floating around in the game right now and one way to pull some out could be to sell ships again. Perhaps just galleons so not too many are bought or perhaps with a price change reflecting the general increase in wealth among the citizens of Elanthia.
So do fix what you think is broken and let people have ships again, please. Or at least comment on our wishes and give a reasonable explanation why you are not working on it.
ANDERSENL1
GRIM45
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/19/2012 01:13 PM CDT
>>could someone official at least say something new about the situation?
They have. Several times.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
They have. Several times.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/19/2012 02:22 PM CDT
>>So do fix what you think is broken and let people have ships again, please.
My understanding of it is that the broken part is something that is deeply set into the way the game system's back end functions as a whole, and how it can't necessarily support all the dynamic moving parts that go into play when it comes to ships moving around. There's just too much "stuff" that gets stored, and making more and more boats available would make Very Bad Things (tm) happen. The way ship "instances" get called/referenced/etc are a lot more complex than the way houses get called, otherwise having as many ships as we have homes wouldn't be that big of a problem.
If I had to guess, the options are either to find a better way to cache all the information that is going on when ships are currently running, in order to make the strain less... strainy, or rewrite the way ships function as a whole to circumvent all those issues that arise due to the way ships move in the game, and both of those things are rather big orders.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
My understanding of it is that the broken part is something that is deeply set into the way the game system's back end functions as a whole, and how it can't necessarily support all the dynamic moving parts that go into play when it comes to ships moving around. There's just too much "stuff" that gets stored, and making more and more boats available would make Very Bad Things (tm) happen. The way ship "instances" get called/referenced/etc are a lot more complex than the way houses get called, otherwise having as many ships as we have homes wouldn't be that big of a problem.
If I had to guess, the options are either to find a better way to cache all the information that is going on when ships are currently running, in order to make the strain less... strainy, or rewrite the way ships function as a whole to circumvent all those issues that arise due to the way ships move in the game, and both of those things are rather big orders.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
NINEVAH1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/19/2012 05:26 PM CDT
>>give a reasonable explanation why you are not working on it.
Magic, Combat, and Skills 3.0 would probably be a good reason why.
Magic, Combat, and Skills 3.0 would probably be a good reason why.
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/19/2012 06:04 PM CDT
>>give a reasonable explanation why you are not working on it.
Because the inability to purchase private ships affects a small percentage of the population. That makes it a low priority. Combined with the fact it will be a massive undertaking, it's not really worth it. Why do all that work to only benefit a small percentage of the population?
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
Because the inability to purchase private ships affects a small percentage of the population. That makes it a low priority. Combined with the fact it will be a massive undertaking, it's not really worth it. Why do all that work to only benefit a small percentage of the population?
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 02:11 PM CDT
<<They have. Several times.>>
I am not saying that GMs have never commented on this matter - I would like an updated comment. Have you seen one lately?
<<Magic, Combat, and Skills 3.0 would probably be a good reason why.>>
You can always find other things to prioritize. My argument to this is that you have to dedicate some time for repairs just as you work on new features or everything will break down eventually.
<<Because the inability to purchase private ships affects a small percentage of the population.>>
If your character was bugged in a way that prevented you from moving would you accept that the GMs ignored you because only you were affected? And if you only make features for the masses why would you ever introduce ships in the first place? Fact is that at the moment these ships are traded for RL money outside the game while more and more people can afford to buy one for plats but is not allowed to while others have ships. If you can buy ships anyone - not just a few - can dream of getting one if nothing else.
I am not saying that GMs have never commented on this matter - I would like an updated comment. Have you seen one lately?
<<Magic, Combat, and Skills 3.0 would probably be a good reason why.>>
You can always find other things to prioritize. My argument to this is that you have to dedicate some time for repairs just as you work on new features or everything will break down eventually.
<<Because the inability to purchase private ships affects a small percentage of the population.>>
If your character was bugged in a way that prevented you from moving would you accept that the GMs ignored you because only you were affected? And if you only make features for the masses why would you ever introduce ships in the first place? Fact is that at the moment these ships are traded for RL money outside the game while more and more people can afford to buy one for plats but is not allowed to while others have ships. If you can buy ships anyone - not just a few - can dream of getting one if nothing else.
GRIM45
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 02:30 PM CDT
>>I am not saying that GMs have never commented on this matter - I would like an updated comment. Have you seen one lately?
No, but I'm also reasonable, and understand that if they were ready to announce something about ships, they would, and demanding an answer is the exact opposite way of actually getting info about it.
>>If your character was bugged in a way that prevented you from moving would you accept that the GMs ignored you because only you were affected?
One of these things is not like the other...
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
No, but I'm also reasonable, and understand that if they were ready to announce something about ships, they would, and demanding an answer is the exact opposite way of actually getting info about it.
>>If your character was bugged in a way that prevented you from moving would you accept that the GMs ignored you because only you were affected?
One of these things is not like the other...
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors."
-Raesh
NINEVAH1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 02:50 PM CDT
>>I would like an updated comment. Have you seen one lately?
Why? There is nothing to update. The situation is the same as it was the last time they said something.
>My argument to this is that you have to dedicate some time for repairs just as you work on new features or everything will break down eventually.
I don't think you understand what 3.0 is about. It is the foundation, and balancing work to help them start developing and fixing a bunch of old systems. The last decade has seen piecemeal systems put in place that usually break, or don't work well with other systems. They need a balanced foundation to start with so they can make the game as a whole work well together.
>If your character was bugged in a way that prevented you from moving would you accept that the GMs ignored you because only you were affected?
This is not even in the same realm as private ships. They are not bugged, they are just a resource heavy system that was never intended to be used on the scale that they are, so they had to discontinue the making of them. To make it even harder on them the GM who coded boats died, so they no longer have that mind to help redo the system. It now has to re-conceptualized from the ground up to work on a more broad scale, and be less resource intensive.
This goes back to my statement of 3.0. Why would they divert their very limited coding resources to completely rewrite a system that will effect a small percentage (yes more people can afford them now, but not as many as you think) when those resources are needed on a huge project like E3.0 that effects everyone in the game.
As much as I would like to see boats rewritten, and made purchasable in game, I would much rather see 3.0 released.
Why? There is nothing to update. The situation is the same as it was the last time they said something.
>My argument to this is that you have to dedicate some time for repairs just as you work on new features or everything will break down eventually.
I don't think you understand what 3.0 is about. It is the foundation, and balancing work to help them start developing and fixing a bunch of old systems. The last decade has seen piecemeal systems put in place that usually break, or don't work well with other systems. They need a balanced foundation to start with so they can make the game as a whole work well together.
>If your character was bugged in a way that prevented you from moving would you accept that the GMs ignored you because only you were affected?
This is not even in the same realm as private ships. They are not bugged, they are just a resource heavy system that was never intended to be used on the scale that they are, so they had to discontinue the making of them. To make it even harder on them the GM who coded boats died, so they no longer have that mind to help redo the system. It now has to re-conceptualized from the ground up to work on a more broad scale, and be less resource intensive.
This goes back to my statement of 3.0. Why would they divert their very limited coding resources to completely rewrite a system that will effect a small percentage (yes more people can afford them now, but not as many as you think) when those resources are needed on a huge project like E3.0 that effects everyone in the game.
As much as I would like to see boats rewritten, and made purchasable in game, I would much rather see 3.0 released.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 02:50 PM CDT
<<demanding an answer is the exact opposite way of actually getting info about it>>
I am not so sure. I agree that you may get tired of hearing complaints over and over again but on the other hand your have to ask from time to time unless you want to be forgotten.
<<One of these things is not like the other>>
Point is that sometimes you fix something because it is broken and should be fixed and not only look at things from a cynical perspective.
I am not so sure. I agree that you may get tired of hearing complaints over and over again but on the other hand your have to ask from time to time unless you want to be forgotten.
<<One of these things is not like the other>>
Point is that sometimes you fix something because it is broken and should be fixed and not only look at things from a cynical perspective.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 03:12 PM CDT
<<Why? There is nothing to update.>>
With that logic why would you ever ask about anything? You don't know what the GMs are thinking and you can't just assume that things will be take care of automatically if you are just patient enough.
<<I don't think you understand what 3.0 is about>>
Honestly I think it's about GMs having too ambitious plans that they will eventually break their necks on and leave the game in a worse state than before but that is for another thread I believe so let's stick to ships here.
<<It now has to re-conceptualized from the ground up to work on a more broad scale, and be less resource intensive.>>
I am not saying it's nescessary a small task but you need to put it into your plans and inform people now and then. If it's taking time it's understandable but right now it seems more like no one is even considering it. I might be wrong but then guessing is all I can do when there is no official information.
<<(yes more people can afford them now, but not as many as you think)>>
How many will be famous crafters that everyone wants weapoms and armors from? Everyone can go on a ship and everyone can get one eventually.
With that logic why would you ever ask about anything? You don't know what the GMs are thinking and you can't just assume that things will be take care of automatically if you are just patient enough.
<<I don't think you understand what 3.0 is about>>
Honestly I think it's about GMs having too ambitious plans that they will eventually break their necks on and leave the game in a worse state than before but that is for another thread I believe so let's stick to ships here.
<<It now has to re-conceptualized from the ground up to work on a more broad scale, and be less resource intensive.>>
I am not saying it's nescessary a small task but you need to put it into your plans and inform people now and then. If it's taking time it's understandable but right now it seems more like no one is even considering it. I might be wrong but then guessing is all I can do when there is no official information.
<<(yes more people can afford them now, but not as many as you think)>>
How many will be famous crafters that everyone wants weapoms and armors from? Everyone can go on a ship and everyone can get one eventually.
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 03:36 PM CDT
>With that logic why would you ever ask about anything? You don't know what the GMs are thinking and you can't just assume that things will be take care of automatically if you are just patient enough.
It's a safe bet that you can, in fact, guess this information as pertains to ships.
They are not planned to be purchasable any time soon. Because they are not pleasent to DR systems and are a nightmarish code heap.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
It's a safe bet that you can, in fact, guess this information as pertains to ships.
They are not planned to be purchasable any time soon. Because they are not pleasent to DR systems and are a nightmarish code heap.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
NINEVAH1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 04:09 PM CDT
>>You don't know what the GMs are thinking and you can't just assume that things will be take care of automatically if you are just patient enough.
I use logic, and my ability to read. Most suggestions or request for systems outside of 3.0 have been met with us being told that a huge amount of effort is going into this change and it will have to wait till after it is released. That doesn't mean anything outside of 3.0 isn't being worked on, but it's projects that have already been started before hand for the most part.
>>Honestly I think it's about GMs having too ambitious plans that they will eventually break their necks on and leave the game in a worse state than before
So you ask for a rewrite for one system, but have zero faith in them to make good on the rewrites they are working on. Taking your stance then, why even ask for a rewrite of such a convoluted system when you don't even think they can make good on the rewrites they are doing now? If they would rather rewrite the magic, combat, and skill systems all at once than rewrite the boat system, what does that tell you? It tells me that the boat system is even more work, for less progress in the game.
>>How many will be famous crafters that everyone wants weapoms and armors from? Everyone can go on a ship and everyone can get one eventually.
I craft so I don't have to go buy someone else's wears. Everyone can craft right now, and eventually everyone can craft everything if they work at it.
As Krooner said, they have no plans to make boats for sale again in the near future. Demanding answers that have already been given will get you no where.
I use logic, and my ability to read. Most suggestions or request for systems outside of 3.0 have been met with us being told that a huge amount of effort is going into this change and it will have to wait till after it is released. That doesn't mean anything outside of 3.0 isn't being worked on, but it's projects that have already been started before hand for the most part.
>>Honestly I think it's about GMs having too ambitious plans that they will eventually break their necks on and leave the game in a worse state than before
So you ask for a rewrite for one system, but have zero faith in them to make good on the rewrites they are working on. Taking your stance then, why even ask for a rewrite of such a convoluted system when you don't even think they can make good on the rewrites they are doing now? If they would rather rewrite the magic, combat, and skill systems all at once than rewrite the boat system, what does that tell you? It tells me that the boat system is even more work, for less progress in the game.
>>How many will be famous crafters that everyone wants weapoms and armors from? Everyone can go on a ship and everyone can get one eventually.
I craft so I don't have to go buy someone else's wears. Everyone can craft right now, and eventually everyone can craft everything if they work at it.
As Krooner said, they have no plans to make boats for sale again in the near future. Demanding answers that have already been given will get you no where.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 04:34 PM CDT
<<I use logic, and my ability to read.>>
Well, I am not asking what people in this forum think - I am asking for an official statement. Of course if you have references to relevant posts that shed light on the matter I'd like to see it.
<<So you ask for a rewrite for one system, but have zero faith in them to make good on the rewrites they are working on.>>
You just bragged about your ability to read and then you totally misinterpret what I write? ;-) No, seriously I am not questioning their abilities but I do believe the current changes are too ambitious and I don't se how it changes the game for the better even if they manage to complete what they have started. Again, it's a discussion for another thread.
<<I craft so I don't have to go buy someone else's wears. Everyone can craft right now, and eventually everyone can craft everything if they work at it.>>
No one is hindering you from wearing second-rate equipment but if you want top quality there is no other way than to buy from one of the best crafters in a certain discipline. And no one will come to you and pay you good money for your home-made items unless they are close to the best, so after the first curiosity is over there will be no more forgers than normally - in fact they will probably for a good part be the same as before as few (if any) will ever catch up (those with very high mech right now have the chance). What does that mean? That the crafting system is for a select few. Ok, so there are new disciplines and new items but don't get your hopes too high that anything else than armors, weapons and a few other things will ever be very sought after so most other areas will just be a parenthesis. You don't need to be a top captain to own a ship and that is the big difference that.
Well, I am not asking what people in this forum think - I am asking for an official statement. Of course if you have references to relevant posts that shed light on the matter I'd like to see it.
<<So you ask for a rewrite for one system, but have zero faith in them to make good on the rewrites they are working on.>>
You just bragged about your ability to read and then you totally misinterpret what I write? ;-) No, seriously I am not questioning their abilities but I do believe the current changes are too ambitious and I don't se how it changes the game for the better even if they manage to complete what they have started. Again, it's a discussion for another thread.
<<I craft so I don't have to go buy someone else's wears. Everyone can craft right now, and eventually everyone can craft everything if they work at it.>>
No one is hindering you from wearing second-rate equipment but if you want top quality there is no other way than to buy from one of the best crafters in a certain discipline. And no one will come to you and pay you good money for your home-made items unless they are close to the best, so after the first curiosity is over there will be no more forgers than normally - in fact they will probably for a good part be the same as before as few (if any) will ever catch up (those with very high mech right now have the chance). What does that mean? That the crafting system is for a select few. Ok, so there are new disciplines and new items but don't get your hopes too high that anything else than armors, weapons and a few other things will ever be very sought after so most other areas will just be a parenthesis. You don't need to be a top captain to own a ship and that is the big difference that.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 04:36 PM CDT
>>I am not saying it's nescessary a small task but you need to put it into your plans and inform people now and then. If it's taking time it's understandable but right now it seems more like no one is even considering it. I might be wrong but then guessing is all I can do when there is no official information.
I think the issue is that you don't believe the official information.
If I had to guess, ships are most likely not even on the radar right now because it seems that GMs are reconsidering the way travel works in the game as a whole. There's no reason to tackle the ship system before having a solid plan on what players should expect when it comes to cross-province transportation on a grander scale.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
I think the issue is that you don't believe the official information.
If I had to guess, ships are most likely not even on the radar right now because it seems that GMs are reconsidering the way travel works in the game as a whole. There's no reason to tackle the ship system before having a solid plan on what players should expect when it comes to cross-province transportation on a grander scale.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 04:38 PM CDT
>>No one is hindering you from wearing second-rate equipment but if you want top quality there is no other way than to buy from one of the best crafters in a certain discipline. And no one will come to you and pay you good money for your home-made items unless they are close to the best, so after the first curiosity is over there will be no more forgers than normally
While this seems like a huge tangent, it's important to recognize that the accessibility to being "the best" is a lot easier now than it ever was.
There's also a lot more reason to craft than just for the sake of selling to other players, as well.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
While this seems like a huge tangent, it's important to recognize that the accessibility to being "the best" is a lot easier now than it ever was.
There's also a lot more reason to craft than just for the sake of selling to other players, as well.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 04:51 PM CDT
<<I think the issue is that you don't believe the official information.>>
That's quite a statement considering that there apparently IS no official information as of late. You are very welcome to refer to the lastest you know of.
<<While this seems like a huge tangent, it's important to recognize that the accessibility to being "the best" is a lot easier now than it ever was.>>
The fact that mechlore is used for everything currently gives people with a lot of this a unique chance to be good in a discipline they had no chance to master previously. Still if you are not a "mech-monster" you will have no chance to participate in that race.
<<There's also a lot more reason to craft than just for the sake of selling to other players, as well.>>
If you have bought the best sword any smith can produce you will not likely try to make your own. You could also say that if you didn't create before why would you now? The systems are being rewritten but basically the possibilities are the same except for the fact that you are not hindered by what guild you have chosen so many years ago.
That's quite a statement considering that there apparently IS no official information as of late. You are very welcome to refer to the lastest you know of.
<<While this seems like a huge tangent, it's important to recognize that the accessibility to being "the best" is a lot easier now than it ever was.>>
The fact that mechlore is used for everything currently gives people with a lot of this a unique chance to be good in a discipline they had no chance to master previously. Still if you are not a "mech-monster" you will have no chance to participate in that race.
<<There's also a lot more reason to craft than just for the sake of selling to other players, as well.>>
If you have bought the best sword any smith can produce you will not likely try to make your own. You could also say that if you didn't create before why would you now? The systems are being rewritten but basically the possibilities are the same except for the fact that you are not hindered by what guild you have chosen so many years ago.
NINEVAH1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 04:55 PM CDT
>>Of course if you have references to relevant posts that shed light on the matter I'd like to see it.
Why should I do all the work of finding info already posted? If you have to know so bad then you should take the time to research your question before demanding answers.
>>And no one will come to you and pay you good money for your home-made items unless they are close to the best
LOL. This shows how little you actually know about the system. I have around 400 in mech, which is no where even close to the best in the game, and I was the sole crafter to stock weapons in a Trader's shop in Shard. The shop actually did quite well too until he decided to close his shop and left the game. I've made my own rare metal weapons and armor too, and I can bet you they are not second rate. I have no desire to be a master crafter who is sought after so I don't put my name out there, but just because I'm not well known doesn't mean I can't make good wares. All it takes is some work. I've doubled my mech since crafting has opened up. All I need someone else for is to make the very top end items in a discipline, but for the most part I can make my own gear that is second to none.
Why should I do all the work of finding info already posted? If you have to know so bad then you should take the time to research your question before demanding answers.
>>And no one will come to you and pay you good money for your home-made items unless they are close to the best
LOL. This shows how little you actually know about the system. I have around 400 in mech, which is no where even close to the best in the game, and I was the sole crafter to stock weapons in a Trader's shop in Shard. The shop actually did quite well too until he decided to close his shop and left the game. I've made my own rare metal weapons and armor too, and I can bet you they are not second rate. I have no desire to be a master crafter who is sought after so I don't put my name out there, but just because I'm not well known doesn't mean I can't make good wares. All it takes is some work. I've doubled my mech since crafting has opened up. All I need someone else for is to make the very top end items in a discipline, but for the most part I can make my own gear that is second to none.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 05:15 PM CDT
<<Why should I do all the work of finding info already posted? If you have to know so bad then you should take the time to research your question before demanding answers.>>
Did I ask for anyone to find official answers to my question for me now? I have not found any official statements regarding this as of late and that is why I ask for one. I didn't ask for you to come around and guess or do detective work. If you have information (again, not guesses) you would like to share feel free to do so and I shall thank you for it.
<<LOL. This shows how little you actually know about the system.>>
It's not the first time you get personal and I am afraid it's typical of people who spends too much time in the forums giving non-answers to posts they have no interesting input for. I am glad for you that you are happy with the new system but it really has nothing to do with ships...
Did I ask for anyone to find official answers to my question for me now? I have not found any official statements regarding this as of late and that is why I ask for one. I didn't ask for you to come around and guess or do detective work. If you have information (again, not guesses) you would like to share feel free to do so and I shall thank you for it.
<<LOL. This shows how little you actually know about the system.>>
It's not the first time you get personal and I am afraid it's typical of people who spends too much time in the forums giving non-answers to posts they have no interesting input for. I am glad for you that you are happy with the new system but it really has nothing to do with ships...
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 05:39 PM CDT
>It's not the first time you get personal and I am afraid it's typical of people who spends too much time in the forums giving non-answers to posts they have no interesting input for. I am glad for you that you are happy with the new system but it really has nothing to do with ships...
Sometimes, when you get the same information from multiple sources, you should let it die.
Because it's usually true.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
Sometimes, when you get the same information from multiple sources, you should let it die.
Because it's usually true.
Let's save us all some time: I'm a troll who rarely has anything helpful. There.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 05:44 PM CDT
<<Sometimes, when you get the same information from multiple sources, you should let it die.>>
I appreciate your enthusiasm but I am not willing to "let it die" just yet as I still have a vague hope that some official with come up with an update.
I appreciate your enthusiasm but I am not willing to "let it die" just yet as I still have a vague hope that some official with come up with an update.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 07:07 PM CDT
>>That's quite a statement considering that there apparently IS no official information as of late. You are very welcome to refer to the lastest you know of.
we're telling you the latest official information.
>>The fact that mechlore is used for everything currently gives people with a lot of this a unique chance to be good in a discipline they had no chance to master previously. Still if you are not a "mech-monster" you will have no chance to participate in that race.
You can participate just fine with 100 ranks of mech.
>>If you have bought the best sword any smith can produce you will not likely try to make your own. You could also say that if you didn't create before why would you now?
Because now the game pays you to do it.
>>I appreciate your enthusiasm but I am not willing to "let it die" just yet as I still have a vague hope that some official with come up with an update.
The update is going to be that ships need to be rewritten before they start being released en-masse again.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
we're telling you the latest official information.
>>The fact that mechlore is used for everything currently gives people with a lot of this a unique chance to be good in a discipline they had no chance to master previously. Still if you are not a "mech-monster" you will have no chance to participate in that race.
You can participate just fine with 100 ranks of mech.
>>If you have bought the best sword any smith can produce you will not likely try to make your own. You could also say that if you didn't create before why would you now?
Because now the game pays you to do it.
>>I appreciate your enthusiasm but I am not willing to "let it die" just yet as I still have a vague hope that some official with come up with an update.
The update is going to be that ships need to be rewritten before they start being released en-masse again.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
FALLENHOPE
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 07:08 PM CDT
New ships are no longer available.
Yay for you if you were one of the lucky ones that had the resources required to buy one when they were available.
I'm not one of those lucky players. At that time I didn't have plats required. Then I left for a number of years. Now I'm back, and out of luck.
>It seems a bit unfair that people are not allowed to buy them anymore. It's fair that there might be something about them that needs to be fixed although I am astonished that they can be so resource demanding, but could someone official at least say something new about the situation?
I, for one, don't believe in the concept of fair. But it still sucks.
You are Crystal Soul Farluk Zoulvaun of the Monks, an Elven Moon Mage.
Yay for you if you were one of the lucky ones that had the resources required to buy one when they were available.
I'm not one of those lucky players. At that time I didn't have plats required. Then I left for a number of years. Now I'm back, and out of luck.
>It seems a bit unfair that people are not allowed to buy them anymore. It's fair that there might be something about them that needs to be fixed although I am astonished that they can be so resource demanding, but could someone official at least say something new about the situation?
I, for one, don't believe in the concept of fair. But it still sucks.
You are Crystal Soul Farluk Zoulvaun of the Monks, an Elven Moon Mage.
BLCKGRD4
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/20/2012 07:59 PM CDT
>It seems a bit unfair that people are not allowed to buy them anymore. It's fair that there might be something about them that needs to be fixed although I am astonished that they can be so resource demanding, but could someone official at least say something new about the situation?
In regards to your astonishment, please read this post by GM-Obseden - post 879 in this folder. I'd put a link to it, but for some reason it doesn't want to show up.
Also read the following posts.
Discussions w/ DR staff and players > General discussions > posts 2645,2646 & 4871
I pretty sure there are more posts by GM's to be found, but that's what I found with just a quick search of a few folders. Pretty much what everyone has been saying is accurate in that there is nothing new to report since the last time they answered questions about player owned boats. I have a feeling though that you won't be satisfied until a GM responds to tell you what everyone has been telling you all along in this thread.
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
In regards to your astonishment, please read this post by GM-Obseden - post 879 in this folder. I'd put a link to it, but for some reason it doesn't want to show up.
Also read the following posts.
Discussions w/ DR staff and players > General discussions > posts 2645,2646 & 4871
I pretty sure there are more posts by GM's to be found, but that's what I found with just a quick search of a few folders. Pretty much what everyone has been saying is accurate in that there is nothing new to report since the last time they answered questions about player owned boats. I have a feeling though that you won't be satisfied until a GM responds to tell you what everyone has been telling you all along in this thread.
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 06:46 AM CDT
@TEVESHSZAT
<<we're telling you the latest official information.>>
But what I am looking for is an official comment or a reference to one, like a thread id or something. I appreciate your and other peoples comments too but they won't answer my request.
<<You can participate just fine with 100 ranks of mech.>>
Yes, in the sense that you might be able to make simple things for yourself but you will never be a sought after smith unless you are among the best and it is very hard to catch up if the competition has a 1000 rank advantage or something like that.
<<Because now the game pays you to do it.>>
That is an incentive of course. I am a little worried that the GM's might not have enough focus on the flow of money in the realms. While trade between people just makes money flow that kind of change will open up for an increased amount of money in the game and that will only lead to inflation. One way to avoid this are mechanisms like fests/other special events and very expensive things like ships where money is removed again in exchange for items or services.
<<The update is going to be that ships need to be rewritten before they start being released en-masse again.>>
I assume you are right. Still I need to know about if and when they plan to look into it. It's not always about doing thing fast but more to give people information about your intentions.
@FALLENHOPE
<<I, for one, don't believe in the concept of fair. But it still sucks.>>
Sure does.
@BLCKGRD4
<<I have a feeling though that you won't be satisfied until a GM responds to tell you what everyone has been telling you all along in this thread.>>
Thank you very much for the references. And you are right in that I will not find it satisfying what some GM said once upon a time. I don't think asking for an update once in a while is demanding too much. Actually I am surprised that they don't release an overview of their plans in a forum like this once in a while (like every month or so). It would answer many questions.
<<we're telling you the latest official information.>>
But what I am looking for is an official comment or a reference to one, like a thread id or something. I appreciate your and other peoples comments too but they won't answer my request.
<<You can participate just fine with 100 ranks of mech.>>
Yes, in the sense that you might be able to make simple things for yourself but you will never be a sought after smith unless you are among the best and it is very hard to catch up if the competition has a 1000 rank advantage or something like that.
<<Because now the game pays you to do it.>>
That is an incentive of course. I am a little worried that the GM's might not have enough focus on the flow of money in the realms. While trade between people just makes money flow that kind of change will open up for an increased amount of money in the game and that will only lead to inflation. One way to avoid this are mechanisms like fests/other special events and very expensive things like ships where money is removed again in exchange for items or services.
<<The update is going to be that ships need to be rewritten before they start being released en-masse again.>>
I assume you are right. Still I need to know about if and when they plan to look into it. It's not always about doing thing fast but more to give people information about your intentions.
@FALLENHOPE
<<I, for one, don't believe in the concept of fair. But it still sucks.>>
Sure does.
@BLCKGRD4
<<I have a feeling though that you won't be satisfied until a GM responds to tell you what everyone has been telling you all along in this thread.>>
Thank you very much for the references. And you are right in that I will not find it satisfying what some GM said once upon a time. I don't think asking for an update once in a while is demanding too much. Actually I am surprised that they don't release an overview of their plans in a forum like this once in a while (like every month or so). It would answer many questions.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 08:59 AM CDT
>>Yes, in the sense that you might be able to make simple things for yourself but you will never be a sought after smith unless you are among the best and it is very hard to catch up if the competition has a 1000 rank advantage or something like that.
This is patently wrong. There is no "1000 rank advantage" when it comes to making things. As long as you can make item X using metal Y, you can make item X using metal Y. Having 1,000 more ranks beyond that point does nothing for your ability to make that particular item.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
This is patently wrong. There is no "1000 rank advantage" when it comes to making things. As long as you can make item X using metal Y, you can make item X using metal Y. Having 1,000 more ranks beyond that point does nothing for your ability to make that particular item.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
KASRKYN
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 10:04 AM CDT
Some balance can be made by properly pricing items. Coarse Shalswar Leathers are looking to be the top of the line, pricing them at 20 plat means no one will use anything else unless they want different stats. If the 2k price remains stable, that means there will be a market for other skins/patterns since not everyone will be able to drop two-thousand plat on a set of armor and those patterns will be easier and needed to be supplied by someone.
Tachid smugly exclaims, "Die midget!"
Tachid smugly exclaims, "Die midget!"
SHADOW7988
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 12:39 PM CDT
To put it another way with craft-able things, there are plenty of things that can be made perfectly at lower ranks (I have not tried to tackle the weapon smithing system but) smaller edged weapons, even with the most rare of materials are readily able to be crafted far below 1000 ranks, further it is even lower with techniques.
When I say prefect, that's it its capped, you can't make it better by adding 10 ranks, 100 ranks, or even 1000, or if somehow the system were to allow, 10,000 ranks.
You might be able to blend the material better to make a better weapon, but that's more player knowledge, and doesn't have anything to do with your character's ranks. You'll learn that from either practicing in the system, and determining better blends, or by reading the boards, and/or gleaning information from other players, or their characters in game.
_____________________________________
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
When I say prefect, that's it its capped, you can't make it better by adding 10 ranks, 100 ranks, or even 1000, or if somehow the system were to allow, 10,000 ranks.
You might be able to blend the material better to make a better weapon, but that's more player knowledge, and doesn't have anything to do with your character's ranks. You'll learn that from either practicing in the system, and determining better blends, or by reading the boards, and/or gleaning information from other players, or their characters in game.
_____________________________________
Victory Over Lyras, on the 397th year and 156 days since the Victory of Lanival the Redeemer.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 04:19 PM CDT
<<As long as you can make item X using metal Y, you can make item X using metal Y.>>
Fair enough. My point is still that there will not be many more crafters than there are today in the long run - at least I hope not. This is a roleplaying game - people are supposed to go on adventure with each other and not stand in a forge all day long.
Fair enough. My point is still that there will not be many more crafters than there are today in the long run - at least I hope not. This is a roleplaying game - people are supposed to go on adventure with each other and not stand in a forge all day long.
BLCKGRD4
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 04:26 PM CDT
>This is a roleplaying game - people are supposed to go on adventure with each other and not stand in a forge all day long
Are they? I suppose that depends on the person really. Roleplay is roleplay, whether ardent adventurer/hunter or forge/craft master.
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
Are they? I suppose that depends on the person really. Roleplay is roleplay, whether ardent adventurer/hunter or forge/craft master.
Blackguard Danoryiel
"Sogan udazama umbunor fau arrazoi inishatu seiremisai. (Only the fallen have nothing to despair)"
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 04:30 PM CDT
@KASRKYN
<<If the 2k price remains stable, that means there will be a market for other skins/patterns since not everyone will be able to drop two-thousand plat on a set of armor and those patterns will be easier and needed to be supplied by someone.>>
You mean that there are other people than that trader i Crossings whose name we will not mention that pathetically tries to rip off people for leathers? :-)
That is just a case of using your position on the market and it will only work until some reasonable person starts making the same item. With metals it's a bit different as the prices depend on rare metals.
<<If the 2k price remains stable, that means there will be a market for other skins/patterns since not everyone will be able to drop two-thousand plat on a set of armor and those patterns will be easier and needed to be supplied by someone.>>
You mean that there are other people than that trader i Crossings whose name we will not mention that pathetically tries to rip off people for leathers? :-)
That is just a case of using your position on the market and it will only work until some reasonable person starts making the same item. With metals it's a bit different as the prices depend on rare metals.
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 04:45 PM CDT
BLCKGRD4
<<Are they? I suppose that depends on the person really. Roleplay is roleplay, whether ardent adventurer/hunter or forge/craft master.>>
Are you roleplaying with yourself in the forge? :-)
In the modern world people sit on offices all day long and dream of something more exciting, so they go home and start up DR and enters their virtual "office" to forge all day there.
I agree that people should do what they want but I question that this is the future of the game. After a while most will drop crafting and go out on adventure again or perhaps even drop the game because they lost interest after spending all their time on chores for a long while and find that it didn't give them what playing DR used to...
That is my true opinion. You may not agree with me but think about it for a bit.
<<Are they? I suppose that depends on the person really. Roleplay is roleplay, whether ardent adventurer/hunter or forge/craft master.>>
Are you roleplaying with yourself in the forge? :-)
In the modern world people sit on offices all day long and dream of something more exciting, so they go home and start up DR and enters their virtual "office" to forge all day there.
I agree that people should do what they want but I question that this is the future of the game. After a while most will drop crafting and go out on adventure again or perhaps even drop the game because they lost interest after spending all their time on chores for a long while and find that it didn't give them what playing DR used to...
That is my true opinion. You may not agree with me but think about it for a bit.
KASRKYN
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 05:08 PM CDT
<<You mean that there are other people than that trader i Crossings whose name we will not mention that pathetically tries to rip off people for leathers? :-)>>
I'd have given a different price, but that's the only person I know of who's actually selling coarse shalswar leathers. Despite claims that everyone can make capped items and the sky is falling, there's a surprising lack of people willing to actually supply to master-crafted top tier goods.
<<That is just a case of using your position on the market and it will only work until some reasonable person starts making the same item>>
While I suspect the price will fall, if the leather crafters/Traders are smart they won't under-cut each other down to the same prices old leathers were. I'm not overly interested in crafting, and even less so in attempting to sell anything I do make, so if people want to shoot themselves in the foot by constantly undercutting, that's their business.
Tachid smugly exclaims, "Die midget!"
I'd have given a different price, but that's the only person I know of who's actually selling coarse shalswar leathers. Despite claims that everyone can make capped items and the sky is falling, there's a surprising lack of people willing to actually supply to master-crafted top tier goods.
<<That is just a case of using your position on the market and it will only work until some reasonable person starts making the same item>>
While I suspect the price will fall, if the leather crafters/Traders are smart they won't under-cut each other down to the same prices old leathers were. I'm not overly interested in crafting, and even less so in attempting to sell anything I do make, so if people want to shoot themselves in the foot by constantly undercutting, that's their business.
Tachid smugly exclaims, "Die midget!"
RAIST
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 05:08 PM CDT
>people are supposed to go on adventure with each other and not stand in a forge all day long.
Speak for yourself. I enjoy the forge immensely, and it's pretty much central to my roleplay.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
Speak for yourself. I enjoy the forge immensely, and it's pretty much central to my roleplay.
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/21/2012 05:49 PM CDT
>>Fair enough. My point is still that there will not be many more crafters than there are today in the long run - at least I hope not. This is a roleplaying game - people are supposed to go on adventure with each other and not stand in a forge all day long.
Being a forger is roleplay.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
Being a forger is roleplay.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 12:50 PM CDT
@KASRKYN
<<I'd have given a different price, but that's the only person I know of who's actually selling coarse shalswar leathers. Despite claims that everyone can make capped items and the sky is falling, there's a surprising lack of people willing to actually supply to master-crafted top tier goods.>>
He can sell to the pricess he wants to of course. Just wanted to make a point on the difference between using your position and selling items that are costly because they are created using costly materials. I don't believe that a forger earns 2kp when materials are paid. Metals are really expensive too but that is more or less dictated by the market - everyone wants damite, lumin and such for their amor and thus prices rise for a while until there is a lot of it available. I believe the leather amor maker can just go out and get more skins whenever he likes, right? You don't get Damite that way I can promise you.
@RAIST
<<Speak for yourself. I enjoy the forge immensely, and it's pretty much central to my roleplay.>>
I hope it's understood that I only speak for myself. However, you are not making office articles are you? You are probably making weapons for slashing evil foes. We agree that it's a medieval fantasy tolkien-kinda style of game and they idea is to go on adventure with your friends, right? I don't argue against a crefting system, but I think in this case it's beginning to have a bigger role than it should have.
@TEVESHSZAT
<<Being a forger is roleplay.>>
Being a forger is a role. Roleplay is the interaction between people who takes on roles. Talking to yourself in the forge is just sad... (ok, the latter was just to provoke, but you catch my drift)
<<I'd have given a different price, but that's the only person I know of who's actually selling coarse shalswar leathers. Despite claims that everyone can make capped items and the sky is falling, there's a surprising lack of people willing to actually supply to master-crafted top tier goods.>>
He can sell to the pricess he wants to of course. Just wanted to make a point on the difference between using your position and selling items that are costly because they are created using costly materials. I don't believe that a forger earns 2kp when materials are paid. Metals are really expensive too but that is more or less dictated by the market - everyone wants damite, lumin and such for their amor and thus prices rise for a while until there is a lot of it available. I believe the leather amor maker can just go out and get more skins whenever he likes, right? You don't get Damite that way I can promise you.
@RAIST
<<Speak for yourself. I enjoy the forge immensely, and it's pretty much central to my roleplay.>>
I hope it's understood that I only speak for myself. However, you are not making office articles are you? You are probably making weapons for slashing evil foes. We agree that it's a medieval fantasy tolkien-kinda style of game and they idea is to go on adventure with your friends, right? I don't argue against a crefting system, but I think in this case it's beginning to have a bigger role than it should have.
@TEVESHSZAT
<<Being a forger is roleplay.>>
Being a forger is a role. Roleplay is the interaction between people who takes on roles. Talking to yourself in the forge is just sad... (ok, the latter was just to provoke, but you catch my drift)
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 01:06 PM CDT
>>I believe the leather amor maker can just go out and get more skins whenever he likes, right? You don't get Damite that way I can promise you.
You're comparing apples and oranges.
There are no "rare" leathers (or cloths) out right now. The majority of materials that can be used in leather and cloth armor right now are similar to the three steels and/or bronze. Cloths fall in the 75-85 range, and with the exception of the incredibly flimsy sharkskin (which is 88), all leathers fall at or under 85 physical. Store bought mid-steel is 85 physical, and even with high-steels terrible durability it's notably better than sharkskin (and two points higher in the physical stat).
>>However, you are not making office articles are you? You are probably making weapons for slashing evil foes. We agree that it's a medieval fantasy tolkien-kinda style of game and they idea is to go on adventure with your friends, right? I don't argue against a crefting system, but I think in this case it's beginning to have a bigger role than it should have.
You're making some rather broad assumptions here.
>>Being a forger is a role. Roleplay is the interaction between people who takes on roles. Talking to yourself in the forge is just sad... (ok, the latter was just to provoke, but you catch my drift)
I catch your drift. It's just that you're grossly incorrect. If you don't believe someone can roleplay as a craftsman in the game, that's really just a limitation on your part.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
You're comparing apples and oranges.
There are no "rare" leathers (or cloths) out right now. The majority of materials that can be used in leather and cloth armor right now are similar to the three steels and/or bronze. Cloths fall in the 75-85 range, and with the exception of the incredibly flimsy sharkskin (which is 88), all leathers fall at or under 85 physical. Store bought mid-steel is 85 physical, and even with high-steels terrible durability it's notably better than sharkskin (and two points higher in the physical stat).
>>However, you are not making office articles are you? You are probably making weapons for slashing evil foes. We agree that it's a medieval fantasy tolkien-kinda style of game and they idea is to go on adventure with your friends, right? I don't argue against a crefting system, but I think in this case it's beginning to have a bigger role than it should have.
You're making some rather broad assumptions here.
>>Being a forger is a role. Roleplay is the interaction between people who takes on roles. Talking to yourself in the forge is just sad... (ok, the latter was just to provoke, but you catch my drift)
I catch your drift. It's just that you're grossly incorrect. If you don't believe someone can roleplay as a craftsman in the game, that's really just a limitation on your part.
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 01:44 PM CDT
@TEVESHSZAT
<<You're comparing apples and oranges.>>
I am not sure I understand your point there. I am saying is that there are no rare skins and you just said the same. :-)
<<You're making some rather broad assumptions here.>>
On which part are you disagreeing with me?
<<I catch your drift. It's just that you're grossly incorrect. If you don't believe someone can roleplay as a craftsman in the game, that's really just a limitation on your part.>>
I never said that. What I am saying is that the GM's are changing DR from a medieval fantasy game with focus on roleplay to a crafting game where everyone is making goods and exchange with each other. While this is as valid a focus as the other, crafting was not such a big part of the game before and I honestly think that the GMs went off on a tangent here. Most of us (those who started just about a year ago or further back in time) here fell in love with another game than they are making it and while some will welcome the changes some will not and I think it might lead to players loosing interest. Now, you may ask yourself if the crafting system is attracting as many new players into the game as is leaving the game because other areas that frankly need more focus are neglected for years.
<<You're comparing apples and oranges.>>
I am not sure I understand your point there. I am saying is that there are no rare skins and you just said the same. :-)
<<You're making some rather broad assumptions here.>>
On which part are you disagreeing with me?
<<I catch your drift. It's just that you're grossly incorrect. If you don't believe someone can roleplay as a craftsman in the game, that's really just a limitation on your part.>>
I never said that. What I am saying is that the GM's are changing DR from a medieval fantasy game with focus on roleplay to a crafting game where everyone is making goods and exchange with each other. While this is as valid a focus as the other, crafting was not such a big part of the game before and I honestly think that the GMs went off on a tangent here. Most of us (those who started just about a year ago or further back in time) here fell in love with another game than they are making it and while some will welcome the changes some will not and I think it might lead to players loosing interest. Now, you may ask yourself if the crafting system is attracting as many new players into the game as is leaving the game because other areas that frankly need more focus are neglected for years.
DANFORDS2
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 02:02 PM CDT
>GM's are changing DR from a medieval fantasy game with focus on roleplay to a crafting game
Considering the GMs went out of their way to make sure the new Guild Reqs made sure no guild was required to touch any Craft to circle, I disagree. Even Lore primes aren't required to craft, ever.
>other areas that frankly need more focus are neglected for years.
Ships are not one of these. All the major systems are getting an overhaul right now, in addition to the crafting changes. Crafting looks to be a fun thing you can do other than sit in combat all day. If you don't want to do it, you will never be required to.
As a Computer Scientist, let me give you a quick lesson on the current conventional wisdom for deciding what you work on. There are three elements. Number of users affected, severity of the impact on their use, and danger/cost of the code changes.
For ships, the number of users affected is small. The intersection of people who can afford them and people who are willing to buy them isn't very large. The severity of impact on their use? Minimal. They can't travel as quickly to certain locations, but can still get there by other means. Danger of the code changes? We can only guess, but considering how they talk about the code we can guess it would require rebuilding the whole system, so the cost of doing it is extremely high. It's basically in the region of "unless the rest of the game is perfect, ignore this feature".
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
Considering the GMs went out of their way to make sure the new Guild Reqs made sure no guild was required to touch any Craft to circle, I disagree. Even Lore primes aren't required to craft, ever.
>other areas that frankly need more focus are neglected for years.
Ships are not one of these. All the major systems are getting an overhaul right now, in addition to the crafting changes. Crafting looks to be a fun thing you can do other than sit in combat all day. If you don't want to do it, you will never be required to.
As a Computer Scientist, let me give you a quick lesson on the current conventional wisdom for deciding what you work on. There are three elements. Number of users affected, severity of the impact on their use, and danger/cost of the code changes.
For ships, the number of users affected is small. The intersection of people who can afford them and people who are willing to buy them isn't very large. The severity of impact on their use? Minimal. They can't travel as quickly to certain locations, but can still get there by other means. Danger of the code changes? We can only guess, but considering how they talk about the code we can guess it would require rebuilding the whole system, so the cost of doing it is extremely high. It's basically in the region of "unless the rest of the game is perfect, ignore this feature".
Elemental Lord Opieus, Master Warrior Mage of Elanthia
"For a bunch of radical empiricists, the Philosophers' system relies on a whole lot of faith." ~Armifer
TEVESHSZAT
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 02:51 PM CDT
>>I am not sure I understand your point there. I am saying is that there are no rare skins and you just said the same. :-)
You said that "anyone can go out and get more skins anytime they like" and followed it with how "you don't get Damite that way I can promise you". They're two notably separate things. There will be rare skins. No skins, as of right now, have stats that are even remotely comparable to rare metal stats.
>>On which part are you disagreeing with me?
All of them. They're having a disagreement party. I completely and 100% disagree that you need to do massively adventurous things involving killing big monsters and saving the world to have a fulfilling roleplay experience in the game.
>>What I am saying is that the GM's are changing DR from a medieval fantasy game with focus on roleplay to a crafting game where everyone is making goods and exchange with each other.
They're not. You're focusing on the fact that they're revamping crafting and ignoring the fact that they're also revamping magic and combat.
>>Most of us (those who started just about a year ago or further back in time) here fell in love with another game than they are making it and while some will welcome the changes some will not and I think it might lead to players loosing interest.
How does making it more possible for people to get involved in crafting drive anyone away?
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
You said that "anyone can go out and get more skins anytime they like" and followed it with how "you don't get Damite that way I can promise you". They're two notably separate things. There will be rare skins. No skins, as of right now, have stats that are even remotely comparable to rare metal stats.
>>On which part are you disagreeing with me?
All of them. They're having a disagreement party. I completely and 100% disagree that you need to do massively adventurous things involving killing big monsters and saving the world to have a fulfilling roleplay experience in the game.
>>What I am saying is that the GM's are changing DR from a medieval fantasy game with focus on roleplay to a crafting game where everyone is making goods and exchange with each other.
They're not. You're focusing on the fact that they're revamping crafting and ignoring the fact that they're also revamping magic and combat.
>>Most of us (those who started just about a year ago or further back in time) here fell in love with another game than they are making it and while some will welcome the changes some will not and I think it might lead to players loosing interest.
How does making it more possible for people to get involved in crafting drive anyone away?
"You always have to be a know-it-all. And you don't. Know. It. All." - GERSTEINJ2
ANDERSENL1
Re: My turn to ask for ships?
04/23/2012 03:07 PM CDT
@DANFORDS2
<<Considering the GMs went out of their way to make sure the new Guild Reqs made sure no guild was required to touch any Craft to circle, I disagree. Even Lore primes aren't required to craft, ever.>>
Not sure I understand how that is good or bad in this context?
<<Ships are not one of these.>>
Sure it is. They closed the shipyard several years ago.
<<Crafting looks to be a fun thing you can do other than sit in combat all day.>>
I don't mind that they work on crafting - just that they seem to use all their ressources on it while areas that need repairs are ignored for years. They could also have spent the time making quests or other improvements of the game instead. You need to remember that they are working on a replacement - not something new. You might think it's all different but in the end you will be making swords and armors, etc. still...
<<As a Computer Scientist, let me give you a quick lesson on the current conventional wisdom for deciding what you work on. There are three elements. Number of users affected, severity of the impact on their use, and danger/cost of the code changes.>>
Thank you for the lesson mister scientist. For your information I am too but in my company development time is of essence and we are not allowed to ignore bugs for years either. What a great place you must be working at...
<<For ships, the number of users affected is small.>>
Everyone can have a ship in time and everyone can get a ride on one or perhaps even get on the crew. I think you underestimate the interest in private ships. I am in the crafting scene too and I don't see so many faces there on a regular basis...
<<Danger of the code changes? We can only guess, but considering how they talk about the code we can guess it would require rebuilding the whole system, so the cost of doing it is extremely high.>>
The current changes definitely touches more sensible parts of the code and are thus more "dangerous" if you like. Regarding the size of the ship system perhaps the old system was huge and processor consuming but that should be possible to improve a lot. I am sure most people have been surprised by the numbers mentioned by the GMs regarding this.
<<Considering the GMs went out of their way to make sure the new Guild Reqs made sure no guild was required to touch any Craft to circle, I disagree. Even Lore primes aren't required to craft, ever.>>
Not sure I understand how that is good or bad in this context?
<<Ships are not one of these.>>
Sure it is. They closed the shipyard several years ago.
<<Crafting looks to be a fun thing you can do other than sit in combat all day.>>
I don't mind that they work on crafting - just that they seem to use all their ressources on it while areas that need repairs are ignored for years. They could also have spent the time making quests or other improvements of the game instead. You need to remember that they are working on a replacement - not something new. You might think it's all different but in the end you will be making swords and armors, etc. still...
<<As a Computer Scientist, let me give you a quick lesson on the current conventional wisdom for deciding what you work on. There are three elements. Number of users affected, severity of the impact on their use, and danger/cost of the code changes.>>
Thank you for the lesson mister scientist. For your information I am too but in my company development time is of essence and we are not allowed to ignore bugs for years either. What a great place you must be working at...
<<For ships, the number of users affected is small.>>
Everyone can have a ship in time and everyone can get a ride on one or perhaps even get on the crew. I think you underestimate the interest in private ships. I am in the crafting scene too and I don't see so many faces there on a regular basis...
<<Danger of the code changes? We can only guess, but considering how they talk about the code we can guess it would require rebuilding the whole system, so the cost of doing it is extremely high.>>
The current changes definitely touches more sensible parts of the code and are thus more "dangerous" if you like. Regarding the size of the ship system perhaps the old system was huge and processor consuming but that should be possible to improve a lot. I am sure most people have been surprised by the numbers mentioned by the GMs regarding this.
