This should be consent right when a bard is hunting but affecting you with his enchante so you can't retreat from mobs. It also carries on with you after you leave the room for a short time
>ret
Your ethereal shield crackles with energy!
You struggle to escape Grimsel's presence, but can't seem to pull yourself away!
Roundtime: 3 sec.
EYGURLWASUP2
BEVERAGEK
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 12:57 PM CDT
>>This should be consent right when a bard is hunting but affecting you with his enchante so you can't retreat from mobs. It also carries on with you after you leave the room for a short time
That song helps the spawn of the room the Bard is in, and also the spawn of the immediate surrounding area.
In order to achieve this effect the Bard must perform the song loudly so yes it will affect everyone in the room, even passer-bys. If the song is performed softly(so that it will not hit passer-bys) the spawn is actually reduced to 0 and further creature entry is prohibited in the Bard's room, which is actually the opposite effect you'd want for hunting.
This is probably a case similar to Moon Mage Telekinetic Storm, in that Moon Mages can't control the fact that the spell hits everyone in the room.
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
That song helps the spawn of the room the Bard is in, and also the spawn of the immediate surrounding area.
In order to achieve this effect the Bard must perform the song loudly so yes it will affect everyone in the room, even passer-bys. If the song is performed softly(so that it will not hit passer-bys) the spawn is actually reduced to 0 and further creature entry is prohibited in the Bard's room, which is actually the opposite effect you'd want for hunting.
This is probably a case similar to Moon Mage Telekinetic Storm, in that Moon Mages can't control the fact that the spell hits everyone in the room.
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
DRISCOLLS
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 01:16 PM CDT
I think it should be consent, but I don't think it technically is right now. There's an eaaaaasy fix for this one: Join his group. On the next pulse, it will release you from the effect. As long as you don't stand in that room long enough to get both pulsed by the enchante and engaged, you should be fine. I think you can also FLEE to get away, not 100% sure though.
The duration of it after you leave the room should be pretty short.
-=Issus=-
The duration of it after you leave the room should be pretty short.
-=Issus=-
DUNTS2
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 01:23 PM CDT
>This is probably a case similar to Moon Mage Telekinetic Storm, in that Moon Mages can't control the fact that the spell hits everyone in the room.
Without official declaration otherwise, it'd seem to me to fall under this sort of description as well.
-Broichan Leshyahen
> hum tuneless
You hum a tuneless tune.
Without official declaration otherwise, it'd seem to me to fall under this sort of description as well.
-Broichan Leshyahen
> hum tuneless
You hum a tuneless tune.
RAIST
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 01:48 PM CDT
Having been going over the news articles recently for unrelated reasons, I'm pretty sure the following would cover this situation:
NEWS 5 24
"4) Area Effect -- There are a variety of processes in place that will affect everyone in a room when utilized -- not only spells, but Barbarian roars and Bardic enchantes. If you happen to walk into an area effect, you do NOT have consent against the person who is the source. If one is used for the EXPRESS INTENT of harming you and/or everyone in the room, then that CAN give consent against the caster/singer/roarer."
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
NEWS 5 24
"4) Area Effect -- There are a variety of processes in place that will affect everyone in a room when utilized -- not only spells, but Barbarian roars and Bardic enchantes. If you happen to walk into an area effect, you do NOT have consent against the person who is the source. If one is used for the EXPRESS INTENT of harming you and/or everyone in the room, then that CAN give consent against the caster/singer/roarer."
Weapons for Sale:
http://www.elanthipedia.org/wiki/User:Caraamon#Wares
Hunta Talna Kortok, built by Gor'Togs, for Gor'Togs
http://www.angelfire.com/rpg2/caraamon/home.html
Combat Balance List:
http://tinyurl.com/DRBalance
DRISCOLLS
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 01:54 PM CDT
Yeah, that's the one that protects people who use TKS no matter how many dozens of times they kill people. Be glad you just couldn't retreat for a second instead of getting one hit killed, IMO.
-=Issus=-
-=Issus=-
BEVERAGEK
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 02:04 PM CDT
>>Be glad you just couldn't retreat for a second instead of getting one hit killed, IMO.
QFT
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
QFT
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
APATHETICSMILE
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 02:27 PM CDT
>>NEWS 5 24
>>"4) Area Effect -- There are a variety of processes in place that will affect everyone in a room when utilized -- not only spells, but Barbarian roars and Bardic enchantes. If you happen to walk into an area effect, you do NOT have consent against the person who is the source. If one is used for the EXPRESS INTENT of harming you and/or everyone in the room, then that CAN give consent against the caster/singer/roarer."
And here I've been, shaping my fire rain clouds and not CASTing AREA chain lightnings like a sucker...
>>"4) Area Effect -- There are a variety of processes in place that will affect everyone in a room when utilized -- not only spells, but Barbarian roars and Bardic enchantes. If you happen to walk into an area effect, you do NOT have consent against the person who is the source. If one is used for the EXPRESS INTENT of harming you and/or everyone in the room, then that CAN give consent against the caster/singer/roarer."
And here I've been, shaping my fire rain clouds and not CASTing AREA chain lightnings like a sucker...
BLAYD
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 02:44 PM CDT
This tends to happen with SIRE and I try to help anyone walking through my room that is suddenly affected by it...and always apologize if they are hit by it. There isn't much we can do though since as mentioned singing it quietly completely ruins the spawn rate increase. People are usually pretty understanding especially when I apologize for it.
BEVERAGEK
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 03:04 PM CDT
>>And here I've been, shaping my fire rain clouds and not CASTing AREA chain lightnings like a sucker...
If you have the OPTION to cast in a way as to not hurt everything in the room then that rule is forfeit IIRC.
i.e. there is no CAST ENGAGE option for telekinetic storm and call of the siren can only be performed on SONG LOUD in order to achieve the enhanced creature spawn.
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
If you have the OPTION to cast in a way as to not hurt everything in the room then that rule is forfeit IIRC.
i.e. there is no CAST ENGAGE option for telekinetic storm and call of the siren can only be performed on SONG LOUD in order to achieve the enhanced creature spawn.
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
APATHETICSMILE
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 03:20 PM CDT
>>If you have the OPTION to cast in a way as to not hurt everything in the room then that rule is forfeit IIRC.
>>i.e. there is no CAST ENGAGE option for telekinetic storm and call of the siren can only be performed on SONG LOUD in order to achieve the enhanced creature spawn.
Sure and those options were great until just a few minutes ago when I found out that not everyone has to risk consent to attack the entire room. Now I'm feeling a little limited by my supposed options.
>>i.e. there is no CAST ENGAGE option for telekinetic storm and call of the siren can only be performed on SONG LOUD in order to achieve the enhanced creature spawn.
Sure and those options were great until just a few minutes ago when I found out that not everyone has to risk consent to attack the entire room. Now I'm feeling a little limited by my supposed options.
GARBAGE23OMF
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 03:28 PM CDT
News 5 25 pretty much makes it clear this exception only works for spells/effects that CANNOT be targeted more finely. IE Chain Lightning and Fire Storm will both grant consent if used as untargetted AoEs. Meanwhile, TKS and SIRE(since quiet has the opposite effect) cannot be targeted, so they do NOT grant consent.
The obvious solution is to change policy, or change these spells. Sadly, obvious solutions are not always quickly/easily implemented.
The obvious solution is to change policy, or change these spells. Sadly, obvious solutions are not always quickly/easily implemented.
EYGURLWASUP2
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 04:14 PM CDT
<<Be glad you just couldn't retreat for a second instead of getting one hit killed>>
For a second
no
more like its what a 2-3 RT and its not just once i can stand there spamming retreat and might be able to get out like 5% of the time....maybe
<<As long as you don't stand in that room long enough to get both pulsed by the enchante and engaged, you should be fine>>
and assassins start in hiding at pole ranged so it happens all pretty fast
GMs policies are pretty dumb and always "grey" when it comes to stuff like that.. Oh hey sure let me cast some spell thats gonna randomly hit anyone in the room, but its ok because no ones in my room right now and if someone walks into my room its their fault...ppsssshh...too inconsistant with their policies and grey like always i guess it'll just depend on what type of GM i get consulted with if i ever kill for it
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 05:21 PM CDT
TKS really should be consent if you're using it without discretion in a crowded hunting area.
BEVERAGEK
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 05:31 PM CDT
FYI just join the Bard and you're immune to the song. After it pulses again you'll be able to retreat and leave.
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
__
You hear the voice of Jaedren exclaim, "Look! I'm Leilond!"
You notice Jaedren come out of hiding.
Jaedren shimmers out of sight.
GERSTEINJ2
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 05:31 PM CDT
this brings up another question since you mentioned the whole WM thing.
Since shaping the cloud for fire rain involves a skill check, what about if a WM fails the skill check in order to shape the cloud <to hit only critters> and accidently kills someone? A GM-log would reveal that his intention was to shape the cloud and not indulge in PVP, wouldn't it?
/---
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
Since shaping the cloud for fire rain involves a skill check, what about if a WM fails the skill check in order to shape the cloud <to hit only critters> and accidently kills someone? A GM-log would reveal that his intention was to shape the cloud and not indulge in PVP, wouldn't it?
/---
Oh and last one, DR at any given time has a population of weenies that will criticize at the drop of a hat, don't take things personally it happens to everyone.
Leucius
EYGURLWASUP2
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 05:39 PM CDT
this is after walking through the bards room fast and now in a completely different room
You walk northwest.
[The Black Spire, Initiation Chamber]
Light leaks through the hatch above, casting gloomy shadows across the unnaturally warm stones that form the curved wall and scarred floor. You also see a Dragon Priest assassin, a Dragon Priest assassin and a black iron ladder that leads to a hatch in the ceiling.
Obvious exits: southeast, southwest.
>
There are several blazing flashes of lurid green lightning from the southeast.
>
The Dragon Priest assassin begins to advance on you!
The Dragon Priest assassin advances from nearby and is closing steadily.
>
The Dragon Priest assassin begins to advance on you!
The Dragon Priest assassin advances from nearby and is closing steadily.
>se
You can't do that while engaged!
>
The Dragon Priest assassin closes to melee range on you!
>
The Dragon Priest assassin closes to melee range on you!
>ret
ret
You think about backing away, but Grimsel seems so alluring that you decide to stick around a bit longer.
Roundtime: 3 sec.
It's dumb and I also agree TKS should be 100% consent.. you know what you're casting
DRISCOLLS
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 06:23 PM CDT
I don't know what to tell you. On the list of "Bad things", temporarily being unable to retreat is pretty low. The fact is, you probably benefit to a certain degree from him increasing spawn so I'd probably just ignore it. If it's really that big a deal to you, ask him to stop. If not, I'm sure you could figure out a way to escalate it into him granting you consent if that's really what you want, but I don't see how that'd benefit anyone.
-=Issus=-
-=Issus=-
EYGURLWASUP2
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 06:28 PM CDT
I'm in a different area so I'm sure its not the same spawn
And most the time I don't really care, but sometimes its just really annoying
Or there are even times where im dying and trying to get outta there to get a heal and I get stuck in his room for 20 seconds
DRISCOLLS
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 06:36 PM CDT
What might be worth a shot would be creating a trigger that automatically joins him when his name pops up? Hopefully that'd hit before the enchante pulse and negate most of the negative runthroughs. Worth a shot, at least.
-=Issus=-
-=Issus=-
DIMINISHEDANGEL
Re: Bard Enchante
06/14/2012 08:41 PM CDT
>>What might be worth a shot would be creating a trigger that automatically joins him when his name pops up? Hopefully that'd hit before the enchante pulse and negate most of the negative runthroughs. Worth a shot, at least.
As a stop-gag measure this suggestion works well enough, but I still perceive this to be a problem of policy and spell design clashing.
With the abilities being discussed, the player's actions have repercussions with other players (or in the case of TKS, possibly harming them). Presence or lack of malicious intention is a large part of PvP policy, which I understand, but you're still affecting someone else with an offense-oriented enchante. If they are not designed to grant consent, they should have area toggles just like CL.
As a stop-gag measure this suggestion works well enough, but I still perceive this to be a problem of policy and spell design clashing.
With the abilities being discussed, the player's actions have repercussions with other players (or in the case of TKS, possibly harming them). Presence or lack of malicious intention is a large part of PvP policy, which I understand, but you're still affecting someone else with an offense-oriented enchante. If they are not designed to grant consent, they should have area toggles just like CL.
MITHYLDR
Re: Bard Enchante
06/15/2012 04:42 PM CDT
This is probably a good time to make sure Armifer is aware of this issue since he's rewriting every spell for Magic 3.0 currently.
GAMMERGIRL151
Re: Bard Enchante
07/22/2012 05:14 PM CDT
A little late to this party, but I've been away. I've re-read these posts a few times but... can anyone tell me what stats mental wise one would want to train to improve this contest? Or rather what does it contest?
You've reached the uninformative help match I haven't written yet.
You've reached the uninformative help match I haven't written yet.
