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"I suspect most PvP problems come down to armor/barriers and the amount of hit points players have resulting in it taking many many hits to down a person."
Sweet jesus! I've been living this nightmare for an entire year, im glad to hear its being thrown in the grinder. This could very well save pvp as we know it.
This problem is emphasized heavily for small edged weapons, any chance you could re-evaluate how small edged weapons interact with armor/barriers as well? (specifically talking, the impact and force of impact behind most small edged weapons cripple their practical use)
EMBODIEDCHAOS
PINEAL
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 07:17 PM CST
Hey Kodius, hope you're feeling better soon.
Hadn't done any serious testing in about a week, but logged in today to find that PvE combat is definitely feeling more comfortable for me overall. I appreciate the tweaks you guys have made to critter range and experience. From where I'm sitting (90th circle Bard versus young gryphs, dobek moruryns, and mountain giants today), combat is still more of a challenge than in 3.0, but the learning rates feel a bit more forgiving than they were when test first went live.
Thanks again to all of you for the hard work, looking forward to the end product.
Hadn't done any serious testing in about a week, but logged in today to find that PvE combat is definitely feeling more comfortable for me overall. I appreciate the tweaks you guys have made to critter range and experience. From where I'm sitting (90th circle Bard versus young gryphs, dobek moruryns, and mountain giants today), combat is still more of a challenge than in 3.0, but the learning rates feel a bit more forgiving than they were when test first went live.
Thanks again to all of you for the hard work, looking forward to the end product.
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 07:34 PM CST
Speaking of Mountain Giants. I find it quite amusing which is the case with a few critters in DR...That these creatures combat prowess pales in comparison to say some moths or armadillos. I've always thought a critter revamp should take place to put some of these creatures in their rightful skill ranges. 40 Ft tall monstrosities should be just that.
PINEAL
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 08:01 PM CST
All I know is I want to keep suplexing them with my Gnome forever.
POWERHAUS
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 08:59 PM CST
Maneuver Perforate with a puncture weapon?
like you jump at them and stab them multiple times leaving them prone and you kneeling?
I'd also go for some Rolling/multiple suplexes and a flying elbow or leg drop(on prone opponent) that someone else could land immediately after...
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
like you jump at them and stab them multiple times leaving them prone and you kneeling?
I'd also go for some Rolling/multiple suplexes and a flying elbow or leg drop(on prone opponent) that someone else could land immediately after...
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
DR-KODIUS
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 09:43 PM CST
>>Sweet jesus! I've been living this nightmare for an entire year, im glad to hear its being thrown in the grinder.
Really? ::points you to the massive State of PvP thread:: We've hashed this out several times on the forums. I am aware that problems exist, but they have proven difficult to properly balance out. It is soooo easy to break everything we've achieved with a careless adjustment.
In some cases I just need to watch folks fight a bit more and try to hone in on what is causing it to be a glance-fest. The new maneuvers, tweaks to thrown and reduction in barrier potency are all aimed at helping with this.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
Really? ::points you to the massive State of PvP thread:: We've hashed this out several times on the forums. I am aware that problems exist, but they have proven difficult to properly balance out. It is soooo easy to break everything we've achieved with a careless adjustment.
In some cases I just need to watch folks fight a bit more and try to hone in on what is causing it to be a glance-fest. The new maneuvers, tweaks to thrown and reduction in barrier potency are all aimed at helping with this.
"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
EMBODIEDCHAOS
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 10:22 PM CST
"Really? ::points you to the massive State of PvP thread:: We've hashed this out several times on the forums. I am aware that problems exist, but they have proven difficult to properly balance out. It is soooo easy to break everything we've achieved with a careless adjustment. "
Ahh.. well i usually avoid the forums like my life depended on it. There are pureblade/gonif posts around every corner, its like a Freddy Krueger movie.
Ahh.. well i usually avoid the forums like my life depended on it. There are pureblade/gonif posts around every corner, its like a Freddy Krueger movie.
DR-ANNWYL
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience ::NUDGE::
12/16/2013 10:35 PM CST
Before this one turns into a player bashing thread, get it back on topic.
Thanks!
Annwyl
Message Board Supervisor
If you've questions or comments, take it to e-mail by writing me at DR-Annwyl@play.net.
SHADOWCHIEF3
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/16/2013 10:36 PM CST
< Ahh.. well i usually avoid the forums like my life depended on it.
Just FYI, put a < or an > before what you want to quote, and it will be put in italics
Just FYI, put a < or an > before what you want to quote, and it will be put in italics
JULIAN
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/17/2013 11:44 AM CST
Hey, Kodius.
I did some hunting in Test after your last round of tweaks.
Defensively things feel much better. Still take some damage in Drakes but it's managable.
Offensively it's rough. I can hit for damage, occasionally, while debuffing/weaving and stunning, with weapons around 600 and my weapon skill and agility booster running. With Brawling over 800 (doesn't get the benefit of Mantle of Flame now, apparently) I get occasional hits for damage and slightly more if I'm doing the above. Overall it's much more of a struggle to do damage than in the live instance and I'm not sure why. Relevant numbers:
96 Agility + 14 points from Mantle of Flame.
Around 830 brawling using haralun brawling gear and MAF's brawling damage bonus.
Around 800 Large Edged + 20% from MAF using a kertig sterak axe with Ignite cast on it. This is the only scenario where I can consistently hit for damage.
Other weapons around 600 with the same conditions.
I'm not sure where I am relative to the intended audience for Drakes in that regard, but in the live instance they seem to be much easier to damage.
Mantle of Flame was apparently an OF boost and is not a skill boost - could that account for the difference?
Mazrian
I did some hunting in Test after your last round of tweaks.
Defensively things feel much better. Still take some damage in Drakes but it's managable.
Offensively it's rough. I can hit for damage, occasionally, while debuffing/weaving and stunning, with weapons around 600 and my weapon skill and agility booster running. With Brawling over 800 (doesn't get the benefit of Mantle of Flame now, apparently) I get occasional hits for damage and slightly more if I'm doing the above. Overall it's much more of a struggle to do damage than in the live instance and I'm not sure why. Relevant numbers:
96 Agility + 14 points from Mantle of Flame.
Around 830 brawling using haralun brawling gear and MAF's brawling damage bonus.
Around 800 Large Edged + 20% from MAF using a kertig sterak axe with Ignite cast on it. This is the only scenario where I can consistently hit for damage.
Other weapons around 600 with the same conditions.
I'm not sure where I am relative to the intended audience for Drakes in that regard, but in the live instance they seem to be much easier to damage.
Mantle of Flame was apparently an OF boost and is not a skill boost - could that account for the difference?
Mazrian
POWERHAUS
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/17/2013 12:40 PM CST
I think MOF does fire+ damage to brawling attacks, and adds a bonus to melee accuracy(on top of the agility boost) which I guess doesn't include brawling attacks. That should account for improved accuracy with HE over brawling.
Ignite damage also adds quite a bit if you were only landing harmless strikes.
Using MOA too?
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
Ignite damage also adds quite a bit if you were only landing harmless strikes.
Using MOA too?
_________________________________
An agonizing pain fills you as you feel your tongue turn to powder in your mouth! Through a haze of uncertainty and loss, you realize that something you just said was very wrong.
2DUMBARSE
Re: Optimizing Your Combat Experience
12/17/2013 01:28 PM CST
>I suspect most PvP problems come down to armor/barriers and the amount of hit points players have resulting in it taking many many hits to down a person.
I haven't tested MAF extensively yet, but from what I've seen so far in the test instance, it still stacks with other physical barriers like aspirant aegis and minor physical protection to annoying effect. I like barriers, but I'm fully willing to admit that MAF + other physical damage barriers is too much.
It would be nice to get some more people in test sparring so we can test changes in real life situations. It's hard to gauge how things would feel in a real world situation with people hitting stationary targets to see what stuff does.
>Offensively it's rough. I can hit for damage, occasionally, while debuffing/weaving and stunning, with weapons around 600 and my weapon skill and agility booster running. With Brawling over 800 (doesn't get the benefit of Mantle of Flame now, apparently) I get occasional hits for damage and slightly more if I'm doing the above. Overall it's much more of a struggle to do damage than in the live instance and I'm not sure why.
Maz, I had this same problem with offense in drakes. I don't know if their dirt attack hinders offense (as opposed to PC thrown dirt) or what, but moving weapons in there in test is a real pain. Have you given elders a try since the tweaks? It seems like they're training to more generous ranks now.
I haven't tested MAF extensively yet, but from what I've seen so far in the test instance, it still stacks with other physical barriers like aspirant aegis and minor physical protection to annoying effect. I like barriers, but I'm fully willing to admit that MAF + other physical damage barriers is too much.
It would be nice to get some more people in test sparring so we can test changes in real life situations. It's hard to gauge how things would feel in a real world situation with people hitting stationary targets to see what stuff does.
>Offensively it's rough. I can hit for damage, occasionally, while debuffing/weaving and stunning, with weapons around 600 and my weapon skill and agility booster running. With Brawling over 800 (doesn't get the benefit of Mantle of Flame now, apparently) I get occasional hits for damage and slightly more if I'm doing the above. Overall it's much more of a struggle to do damage than in the live instance and I'm not sure why.
Maz, I had this same problem with offense in drakes. I don't know if their dirt attack hinders offense (as opposed to PC thrown dirt) or what, but moving weapons in there in test is a real pain. Have you given elders a try since the tweaks? It seems like they're training to more generous ranks now.
