Possible FORM bug? 02/28/2014 10:42 AM CST
My Barbarian can only put up three forms in test. He most certainly could put up four prior.

Also, not sure if this is as intended, but in test, all forms give their duration in roisen, instead of 'much longer'.
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 02/28/2014 03:22 PM CST
Could you please verify, that you don't know any masteries that would be changing it into minute durations?

Some form difficulty changed in 3.1, and several got a bit harder. Could you please post your skills and what forms you were trying?





"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 02/28/2014 04:25 PM CST
Firstly, I think guildleaders should be updated to include a ASK [leader] ABOUT MASTERY. I'm a bit confused how one picks up a Mastery; I believe if you've 7 lessons in a given path, you can pick up the mastery? Or is that wrong?

>mastery list
You have not been trained in any Masteries from the path of the Horde.
You have not been trained in any Masteries from the path of the Flame.
You have not been trained in any Masteries from the path of the Predator.

>meditate power
You are currently practicing the Turtle Form and will hold focus of it for 52 roisaen.
You are currently practicing the Monkey Form and will hold focus of it for 71 roisaen.
You are currently practicing the Swan Form and will hold focus of it for 67 roisaen.

So that seems weird.

But with regards to the four forms; I seem to now be able to put up four forms if I do Owl, Monkey, Eagle, and Dragon. So, that's curious; I wasn't aware that there was a skill check on being able to put up multiple forms? I think I must have been putting my passive IF regen below zero with the forms I was selecting, so, mea culpa. I was doing Turtle, Monkey, and Swan, and wager Turtle was pushing me over.

As far as XP gain is concerned, it's a bit annoying to have to put up some forms, wait a minute, drop them, put up some forms again, but it's not remotely difficult to do, especially if you pepper in MEDITATE RESEARCH. My skills in test are:
Inner Fire: 303 76% intrigued (16/34) Augmentation: 294 38% considering (6/34)
Warding: 250 60% attentive (10/34)

Expertise xp is pretty good too; I think if you rotate in maneuvers you'll have a fine time moving it. Still extremely excited for DOUBLESTRIKE.
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 02/28/2014 09:46 PM CST
FORMS lower your passive regen cap when in effect. Harder Forms lower the cap by a larger amount. IF skill reduces this cap reduction. The cap cannot go below 0, so this becomes your # of Forms limit.

Using easier forms can allow up to 5 at a given skill, where you can only do 3 hard forms at once.

Duration is determined by Augmentation or Warding. So Swan is a moderately difficult Warding ability, and Turtle is hard. This is why Turtle's duration is less. Monkey form is the same difficulty as Swan, but uses Augmentation - and you have more Aug skill than Warding. That is why you have 3 unique durations.

For Forms, I'll probably add in a second large pulse at the 5 minute mark. That would reduce the cycling to every 5 minutes for optimal training which isn't too bad. You could also try using some Berserks. They cost more IF to start, but should drain much less than in 3.0.




"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 02/28/2014 11:46 PM CST
I'm not really having any problems moving Aug or Warding XP truthfully.

What about not having a mastery but still seeing times for forms?
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 10:17 AM CST
>>This game just got to complicated.

No, players are just more focused on the details since the current crop of GMs has become more transparent.

That is the downside of giving players more information. Players STRESS over numbers until they rage quit.



I'll investigate the Mastery problems tonight.



"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 10:26 AM CST
<<No, players are just more focused on the details since the current crop of GMs has become more transparent.
That is the downside of giving players more information. Players STRESS over numbers until they rage quit.
I'll investigate the Mastery problems tonight.>>

Im gonna spend a couple hours in test today, you need form experience checked? Anything else? Where do I get the masteries in test again?

- Buuwl
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 10:37 AM CST
any chance you can allow Drath to let us forget other abilities?

- Buuwl
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 10:43 AM CST

Do any of our zercs train warding? If not can that be made possible?

- Buuwl
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 10:51 AM CST
Hmm, I'm not sure but can check when I get home from work.



"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 11:10 AM CST
Med research question

So if I med research serenity, then immediately med research swan, should I be getting ticks in warding each time? (because I'm not.)

Is the research timer exp award for anything I decide to research. Also are all "researches" created equal in terms of exp awarded?

- Buuwl
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 11:12 AM CST
pre mane cleave

Expertise: 1105 01% thinking (5/34)

I mane cleaved, and after wards was

Expertise: 1105 01% thinking (5/34)



- Buuwl
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 11:25 AM CST
>>So if I med research serenity, then immediately med research swan, should I be getting ticks in warding each time? (because I'm not.)

No. MEDITATE RESEARCH has a cooldown.



"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 11:25 AM CST
What were you fighting? The enemy has to provide you a challenge to teach.



"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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40 minutes or so 03/01/2014 11:30 AM CST
magic exp seems ok on my end.

Inner Fire: 871 02% mind lock (34/34)
Augmentation: 770 09% nearly locked (33/34)
Debilitation: 685 61% enthralled (32/34)
Warding: 636 15% rapt (30/34)

Wish there was a zerc to train warding with, would fill in the gaps nicely. Maybe make flashflood a ward?

Maneuvers don't seem to teach expertise enough anymore in my opinion. Everything else seems fine. For some reason I'm learning parry in prime faster, at least it appears that way. Could just be me thinking this.

Parry Ability: 1251 64.80% thinking - that is in drakes.

- Buuwl
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Re: Possible FORM bug? 03/01/2014 12:04 PM CST
<<What were you fighting? The enemy has to provide you a challenge to teach.>>

Drakes.

- Buuwl
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Maneuver Exp cooldown 03/01/2014 12:12 PM CST
Rather than dig through the test folder, especially after I somewhat recently reread it...

Whats the cool-down timer on maneuver exp for expertise? Just asking so I can test with other characters of different levels. If this is PAFO just let me know and I'll try to figure it out on my own I guess.

- Buuwl
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Re: 40 minutes or so 03/01/2014 02:02 PM CST
>Wish there was a zerc to train warding with, would fill in the gaps nicely. Maybe make flashflood a ward?

Given the new paradigm for skill gain, this would be, mechanically, a good idea I think. Wasn't a problem before that the only warding trainers were forms, because forms were the best for anything. Now that we should be using a lot more abilities, slipping something into a berserk etc. would rock.
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re: warding zerk 03/01/2014 03:59 PM CST
I wouldn't mind seeing roars expanded to include aug and warding abilities either. Roars are our only abilities that didn't break the constant exp rule and as such are working as originally intended, AFAIK.

New roars could be set against a static SvS contest for each tier of difficulty then duration and effect determined just like any other roar. There seems to be room in the voice pool to work debil, warding AND aug or at least allow the broader use of the voice pool to supplement the normal exp from forms and zerks. Just please, if this is ever implemented, don't add the group requirement like the war cries of old.
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re: warding zerk 03/01/2014 04:08 PM CST
>>Roars are our only abilities that didn't break the constant exp rule

Berserks and Meditations never awarded constant EXP either. It was only Forms that were a problem.




"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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re: warding zerk 03/01/2014 04:36 PM CST
A warding zerc would be cool. After spending time in test forms are kinda meh for training purposes.

- Buuwl
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re: warding zerk 03/02/2014 12:56 AM CST
Looks like I had plans to make Famine a Warding Berserk. Flashflood should be one, so maybe that is a bug. Volcano as ell. And Hurricane will be another once I finish it (basically a pulsing dispel).



"I have no data yet. It is a capital mistake to theorize before one has data. Insensibly one begins to twist facts to suit theories instead of theories to suit facts."
- Sir Arthur Conan Doyle, Sherlock Holmes
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re: warding zerk 03/02/2014 08:19 AM CST
Hey Buuwl berserk earthquake trains warding and is my ability of choice for training it. I didnt check it in test but I assume it trains the same. I just wish it cost a bit less as it's pretty expesive.


Codiax.
Vote: http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-DragonRealms.html
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a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 10:35 AM CST
Zerc Flashflood is teaching warding. Thanks for the help. I think the magic exp is in line. Its a little more difficult to lock up than before, but I think that is a good thing for overall game design.

Any chance we can get a bump in the maneuvers teaching expertise? I think that is way to low, unless I shouldn't be able to learn it on drakes with 1100.
Other than maneuvers everything on my end for experience gain in test seems fine for barbarians.

As another aside I'm going to have some really tough choices in terms of character setup, I do wonder if mages have to make similar tough decisions. I feel like a MM or WM gets pretty much every spell at 150. If I want masteries I'm going to leave a ton of skills on the table. I don't know enough on the topic to really put in my two cents though. Not trying to start gvg either, but maybe we could get a few more points to spend?

- Buuwl
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 11:19 AM CST
<<I do wonder if mages have to make similar tough decisions. I feel like a MM or WM gets pretty much every spell at 150.>>

Speaking as MM, it's not even close to getting everything I want at 180th circle. I'm leaving at least four guild spells unpicked, at least three helpful AP spells unpicked, and seven feats I'd really love to have unpicked.

That's a big result of MMs having an excellent and robust spellbook. I can't speak to other magic guilds. I know, for example, necromancers can pick all of their spells pretty easily, but I don't think that will last as their spell development grows.
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 11:55 AM CST
>>Speaking as MM, it's not even close to getting everything I want at 180th circle.

These numbers might not be 100% accurate (a mix of old numbers on epedia and/or general laziness when counting), but just as a jumping point....

Guild Slots by 50 Slots by 100 Slots by 150 Total Guild Spell Slots
Cleric 50 75 92 82
Moon Mage 50 75 92 74
War Mage 50 75 92 79
Necromancer 35 60 78 54
Bard 35 60 78 56
Empath 35 60 78 48
Ranger 26 51 69 40
Paladin 26 51 69 46


Keep in mind there are 32 current feats and 5-7 new research ones coming out (1 slot each). Also keep in mind something like 12-14 slots for all analogous spells.



Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 11:59 AM CST
Does that include teleologic sorcery spells for MMs?

And that's an awesome graph, I really hope that gets saved and updated as things go on Elanthipedia (if not there already).
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 12:04 PM CST
>>Does that include teleologic sorcery spells for MMs?

Yes, but keep in mind that I added up the slot lists for each guild's magic page and those lists are probably outdated (I might have added wrong at some point or another, too).



Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 12:07 PM CST
Yeah, definitely seems off then, as of the last couple slot updates, but it's a good starting point! I'll try and add to the MM stuff as I figure it out.
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/02/2014 10:37 PM CST


In magic 3.1 this changes


Guild Slots by 50 Slots by 100 Slots by 150 Total Guild Spell Slots
Cleric 50 75 92 82
Moon Mage 50 75 92 74
War Mage 50 75 92 79
Necromancer 35 60 78 54
Bard 35 60 78 56
Empath 35 60 78 48
Ranger 26 51 69 40
Paladin 26 51 69 46


rangers total guild spell slots is 50 in magic 3.1. For empaths total spell slots are 53 in magic 3.1 Magic 3.1 has changed just about every guilds total spell slots for all their spells in the upward direction.

Ranger Pfanston and his soggy pup.
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mane experience 03/03/2014 08:00 AM CST
I'm getting some experience now when I cleave drakes, not sure what was up before.

- Buuwl
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/03/2014 04:45 PM CST
>>feel like a MM or WM gets pretty much every spell at 150.

Definately NOT happening for War Mages. The way our stuff is set up post 3.0 is that you HAVE to pick a path. You can be one or once bigger two element master not all 4 to be sure.
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Re: a few thoughts on test/zerc warding (flashflood) is OK 03/06/2014 08:19 AM CST
I added up the slot lists for each guild's magic page and those lists are probably outdated

yup, necro one is out of date per the recent change of more spell slots req'd for some spells.

<<If I can't cast thunderclap, you can't summon the dark lord of the abyss to devour the flesh of the innocent>>
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