Awesome, thanks. The telga orek update is a nice improvement!
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
LAMBL
SAUVA
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 06:10 AM CDT
>In what will hopefully be a series of updates and releases...
What amazing news to wake up to on a Friday! Thank you to all that are working on this critical system review.
Will critter special attacks (especially those that bypass skill checks) be part of this this review?
Was the data collected from the critter survey useful? Would it be possible to share that with the greater community?
~Hunter Hanryu
>Everything Rangers have is just a lame version of something cool.~Morkim
What amazing news to wake up to on a Friday! Thank you to all that are working on this critical system review.
Will critter special attacks (especially those that bypass skill checks) be part of this this review?
Was the data collected from the critter survey useful? Would it be possible to share that with the greater community?
~Hunter Hanryu
>Everything Rangers have is just a lame version of something cool.~Morkim
DR-ZADRAES
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 07:10 AM CDT
>Will critter special attacks (especially those that bypass skill checks) be part of this this review?
Not making any promises, but if a critter is otherwise on my radar, I'll be considering special attacks. Xala'shar, for example, are currently approved for a review. No ETA, it'll take some time.
>Was the data collected from the critter survey useful? Would it be possible to share that with the greater community?
It was / is, yes. I'm not comfortable sharing it since some folks submitted names and may not want them publicly shared. I've also made a utility in game to help me identify areas that are overcrowded, or too large, and a few other points of interest -- I run it periodically to capture snapshots at different times on different days. The original survey + my tool is what led to this first batch of projects.
Speaking of, here's a preview of the other projects that were approved for this first batch. No ETA -- I'm working on them as I'm able, and the ones involving code updates will take longer because they also need QCs. They'll be released when ready, with their own announcements. #s at the end are their creature level as evaluated by GM tools.
In no particular order:
1) Adan'f blademasters + sorcerors are in the works -- existing Adan'f area will be halved, top half for existing low-level, bottom half for these new guys. 188-192.
2) Swamp ghouls in a new Ker'Leor area. 178-182.
3) Re-map of the trollkin/badger/pothanit area to make room for scavenger giants (similar to sky giants). 182-188.
4) Jeol Moradu are coming back, beefier than before and with more spells. 172-178.
5) Xala'shar are all having their special attacks reviewed and put on a standard system.
6) Deadfall (I think) area of vipers/leucros is being shrunk/partitioned to make room for a bearded seordmaor. 189-195.
Zadraes
Not making any promises, but if a critter is otherwise on my radar, I'll be considering special attacks. Xala'shar, for example, are currently approved for a review. No ETA, it'll take some time.
>Was the data collected from the critter survey useful? Would it be possible to share that with the greater community?
It was / is, yes. I'm not comfortable sharing it since some folks submitted names and may not want them publicly shared. I've also made a utility in game to help me identify areas that are overcrowded, or too large, and a few other points of interest -- I run it periodically to capture snapshots at different times on different days. The original survey + my tool is what led to this first batch of projects.
Speaking of, here's a preview of the other projects that were approved for this first batch. No ETA -- I'm working on them as I'm able, and the ones involving code updates will take longer because they also need QCs. They'll be released when ready, with their own announcements. #s at the end are their creature level as evaluated by GM tools.
In no particular order:
1) Adan'f blademasters + sorcerors are in the works -- existing Adan'f area will be halved, top half for existing low-level, bottom half for these new guys. 188-192.
2) Swamp ghouls in a new Ker'Leor area. 178-182.
3) Re-map of the trollkin/badger/pothanit area to make room for scavenger giants (similar to sky giants). 182-188.
4) Jeol Moradu are coming back, beefier than before and with more spells. 172-178.
5) Xala'shar are all having their special attacks reviewed and put on a standard system.
6) Deadfall (I think) area of vipers/leucros is being shrunk/partitioned to make room for a bearded seordmaor. 189-195.
Zadraes
SAUVA
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 08:51 AM CDT
Oh man, that is so awesome. Looking forward to all this!
Would you be able to share the full list of critters and their calculated creature level as evaluated by GM tools?
~Hunter Hanryu
>Everything Rangers have is just a lame version of something cool.~Morkim
Would you be able to share the full list of critters and their calculated creature level as evaluated by GM tools?
~Hunter Hanryu
>Everything Rangers have is just a lame version of something cool.~Morkim
PURHEART
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 10:53 AM CDT
Zad,
Any chance to look at expand endrus serpents down on the str (north of leth)? Nine rooms is a bit small for the range that it covers, lots of folks (especially f2p it seems) hit there as its in zoluren area.
Sorry, wasnt sure if this was mentioned before so thought I'd ask. :)
Any chance to look at expand endrus serpents down on the str (north of leth)? Nine rooms is a bit small for the range that it covers, lots of folks (especially f2p it seems) hit there as its in zoluren area.
Sorry, wasnt sure if this was mentioned before so thought I'd ask. :)
LAMBL
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 11:16 AM CDT
That's all very exciting, thanks for sharing. Especially this bit:
<<2) Swamp ghouls in a new Ker'Leor area. 178-182.>>
!!!
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
<<2) Swamp ghouls in a new Ker'Leor area. 178-182.>>
!!!
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
BINU
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 05:45 PM CDT
Thank you for the fix to bone wyverns.
The new hunting areas sound exciting. I can't wait.
Are you guys still monitoring the survey? I filled one out a few days ago.
Thanks for all the work, past and future!
The new hunting areas sound exciting. I can't wait.
Are you guys still monitoring the survey? I filled one out a few days ago.
Thanks for all the work, past and future!
DR-ZADRAES
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/12/2019 06:34 PM CDT
>Would you be able to share the full list of critters and their calculated creature level as evaluated by GM tools?
Not easily, no. There are hundreds of creatures in the game, and we don't (at this time) have a master list of how things spawn. Long story short-ish, creature skills/stats have not always had a standard model to follow. In the old days, they were hand-set for what the creator wanted, and they don't always make sense. Things like dark sprites in the Riverhaven abandoned castle Premium area -- there are supposed to be 3-4 tiers of them, getting harder beyond the entry level. Their creature level is set to 50, but our standardized check today shows them with skills/stats of a level 58. This matters, because when the spawners handle tiered creatures like this, they do so based on the set level then routing through the standardize skill/stat utility. So the ones that are meant to be spawning at level 55 end up with skills/stats LOWER than the intro tier. All that said -- we have lists of creatures and what their level is set to, but those lists are not updated with how creatures are actually evaluating/spawning.
Spoiler: the abandoned castle is a future target to get new creatures for Premi folks when I identify ones that make sense in a dungeon setting.
>Any chance to look at expand endrus serpents down on the str
It is not on a list right now. When I've checked, the most crowded it's ever been in the snapshots is 3 players in the 9 rooms. That's not crowded, definitely not overcrowded, and it's a low-level creature with alternatives in that range. Rock trolls, bone wolves, arbelogs, snowbeasts, fire maidens, Premium bobcats in Fang Cove, silver bears are in a similar range, just to name a few -- most (not all) of those can be found between the Riverhaven ferry and the north side of the gondola.
>Are you guys still monitoring the survey?
I'm still looking at it from time to time, yes, but mostly focused on this first batch of updates. When this clears, I'll use it to pinpoint a few more creatures that may need special attacks/gimmicks reviewed.
Zadraes
Not easily, no. There are hundreds of creatures in the game, and we don't (at this time) have a master list of how things spawn. Long story short-ish, creature skills/stats have not always had a standard model to follow. In the old days, they were hand-set for what the creator wanted, and they don't always make sense. Things like dark sprites in the Riverhaven abandoned castle Premium area -- there are supposed to be 3-4 tiers of them, getting harder beyond the entry level. Their creature level is set to 50, but our standardized check today shows them with skills/stats of a level 58. This matters, because when the spawners handle tiered creatures like this, they do so based on the set level then routing through the standardize skill/stat utility. So the ones that are meant to be spawning at level 55 end up with skills/stats LOWER than the intro tier. All that said -- we have lists of creatures and what their level is set to, but those lists are not updated with how creatures are actually evaluating/spawning.
Spoiler: the abandoned castle is a future target to get new creatures for Premi folks when I identify ones that make sense in a dungeon setting.
>Any chance to look at expand endrus serpents down on the str
It is not on a list right now. When I've checked, the most crowded it's ever been in the snapshots is 3 players in the 9 rooms. That's not crowded, definitely not overcrowded, and it's a low-level creature with alternatives in that range. Rock trolls, bone wolves, arbelogs, snowbeasts, fire maidens, Premium bobcats in Fang Cove, silver bears are in a similar range, just to name a few -- most (not all) of those can be found between the Riverhaven ferry and the north side of the gondola.
>Are you guys still monitoring the survey?
I'm still looking at it from time to time, yes, but mostly focused on this first batch of updates. When this clears, I'll use it to pinpoint a few more creatures that may need special attacks/gimmicks reviewed.
Zadraes
DR-ZADRAES
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/14/2019 12:02 AM CDT
>It seems like the design is laser-focused on the areas between 100 and 200 'levels'.
It is not. From the announcement post: "If it's not an area you can use (too high or low), don't fret! Plenty more that we're looking at as time allows." This initial first batch of projects is, yes. Because at the high end, there are very few options, and more and more players are crowding into those few available areas. Whereas the first 30 or so levels have dozens of options for people to work through. The early game has a spread, and folks have been making it through there since the game started. There may be some bumps, but they can be overcome. The end levels, however, are more of a crisis point right now, so it has the initial attention.
>especially if we're bringing things down to Zoluren more often
I'm trying NOT to do as much in Zoluren, unless something just really makes sense for it (like an area that's too large AND easily condensed, like the trollkin/pothanit/badger area). There is an entire game world out there with neat NPCs, mechanics, other creatures, and so much more.
>Kinda Endrus Serpents, but that area is literally full 24x7,
Actually literally not true. That area has 9 rooms available to the spawner. There are 5 people there currently. The last snapshot I took a few days ago showed only 3. Another previous snapshot I took also showed 5. Compared to some of the existing high level areas that have consistently had more players than # of rooms when I've checked.
>Heck, bringing sand sprites into the crossing could be fun; we don't always need to reinvent the wheel.
Not an option. Sand sprites exist in Ratha already. If they are a creature in your range, feel free to travel! Getting out of Zoluren is a good thing.
Like I said before -- this is a big, long-term project. My initial focus is on more end game options to reduce overcrowding. After that, we'll see what happens.
Zadraes
It is not. From the announcement post: "If it's not an area you can use (too high or low), don't fret! Plenty more that we're looking at as time allows." This initial first batch of projects is, yes. Because at the high end, there are very few options, and more and more players are crowding into those few available areas. Whereas the first 30 or so levels have dozens of options for people to work through. The early game has a spread, and folks have been making it through there since the game started. There may be some bumps, but they can be overcome. The end levels, however, are more of a crisis point right now, so it has the initial attention.
>especially if we're bringing things down to Zoluren more often
I'm trying NOT to do as much in Zoluren, unless something just really makes sense for it (like an area that's too large AND easily condensed, like the trollkin/pothanit/badger area). There is an entire game world out there with neat NPCs, mechanics, other creatures, and so much more.
>Kinda Endrus Serpents, but that area is literally full 24x7,
Actually literally not true. That area has 9 rooms available to the spawner. There are 5 people there currently. The last snapshot I took a few days ago showed only 3. Another previous snapshot I took also showed 5. Compared to some of the existing high level areas that have consistently had more players than # of rooms when I've checked.
>Heck, bringing sand sprites into the crossing could be fun; we don't always need to reinvent the wheel.
Not an option. Sand sprites exist in Ratha already. If they are a creature in your range, feel free to travel! Getting out of Zoluren is a good thing.
Like I said before -- this is a big, long-term project. My initial focus is on more end game options to reduce overcrowding. After that, we'll see what happens.
Zadraes
DEARMANK
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/14/2019 05:47 AM CDT
>>A little more variety at low level might be nice, especially if we're bringing things down to Zoluren more often. Rats-Goblins is a great flow, but goblins soft cap a bit before you can normally do eels safely, and then there's a bit of a blurgle on next tier.
Really? https://drservice.info/Lists/Bestiary.aspx
Look at the low level mobs then look at the high level mobs. There's a great deal more low level mobs. Not to mention the fact that you're only in low level mobs for hours or days. You're in high level mobs for months or years.
Really? https://drservice.info/Lists/Bestiary.aspx
Look at the low level mobs then look at the high level mobs. There's a great deal more low level mobs. Not to mention the fact that you're only in low level mobs for hours or days. You're in high level mobs for months or years.
EARTHMAGE
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/14/2019 08:16 AM CDT
Never mind. Clearly the hive mind has spoken. I apologize for ever trying to contribute.
GRIM45
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/14/2019 09:29 AM CDT
>Never mind. Clearly the hive mind has spoken. I apologize for ever trying to contribute.
AKA: I have no data to back me up, and must fall back on ad hominem to defend my position.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors." -Raesh
AKA: I have no data to back me up, and must fall back on ad hominem to defend my position.
TG, TG, GL, et al.
"Disagreement with the fundamental plan at this point is akin to supporting Richard III vs the Tudors." -Raesh
HEATHCHRISTINE
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/14/2019 10:10 AM CDT
I'm excited about the first batch list as well. Deadfall was fun of my favorite places to train and looking forward to going back.
Jalika
MOCKERJB1
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/16/2019 02:07 PM CDT
Please consider the adan’f level ones going to Theren too as a copied new orc. Theren is a desert of decent hunting and undead are not a promising addition for more than a couple guilds.
All round great to see the plans though.
Hope not ever to see Heaven. I have come to lead you to the
other shore; into eternal darkness; into fire and into ice. —Inferno
All round great to see the plans though.
Hope not ever to see Heaven. I have come to lead you to the
other shore; into eternal darkness; into fire and into ice. —Inferno
LAMBL
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/16/2019 04:24 PM CDT
<<Theren is a desert of decent hunting and undead are not a promising addition for more than a couple guilds.>>
While I emphatically agree that more options in Theren is better (including orcs specifically), this doesn't make sense to me. I've heard someone else say that too, and I genuinely don't get it. What makes corporeal undead worse than living creatures for, apparently, most of the guilds? In general the state doesn't actually have many effects, right? For most guilds it should be neutral?
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
While I emphatically agree that more options in Theren is better (including orcs specifically), this doesn't make sense to me. I've heard someone else say that too, and I genuinely don't get it. What makes corporeal undead worse than living creatures for, apparently, most of the guilds? In general the state doesn't actually have many effects, right? For most guilds it should be neutral?
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
LCAMP2
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/16/2019 06:18 PM CDT
<<For most guilds it should be neutral?
Undead are such a mixed bag of mechanics that it's often just easier to ignore the undead ladder aside from the ones everyone knows to be popular like togballs, stompers, germish, etc. There are quite a few undead that are worse than neutral to use your phrasing.
Some examples: Skeletal pirates with their horrible mechs to deal with. Non-holy magic will plain not work on some undead too, although I think this is mostly in line with non-corporeal undead. Several of them are gated in areas that are only easily accessible by Clerics, and there are some that do spirit damage which only Clerics and Bards have ways of combating without resorting to sorcery. They also tend to have more special attacks than non-undead on average, which often have some form of Holy based defense to them. Most undead are immune to stuns and sleep as well, although they are susceptible to holy based stuns, and this can have a significant impact on guilds who mostly only have those types of debilitation effects such as Moon Mage.
Undead are such a mixed bag of mechanics that it's often just easier to ignore the undead ladder aside from the ones everyone knows to be popular like togballs, stompers, germish, etc. There are quite a few undead that are worse than neutral to use your phrasing.
Some examples: Skeletal pirates with their horrible mechs to deal with. Non-holy magic will plain not work on some undead too, although I think this is mostly in line with non-corporeal undead. Several of them are gated in areas that are only easily accessible by Clerics, and there are some that do spirit damage which only Clerics and Bards have ways of combating without resorting to sorcery. They also tend to have more special attacks than non-undead on average, which often have some form of Holy based defense to them. Most undead are immune to stuns and sleep as well, although they are susceptible to holy based stuns, and this can have a significant impact on guilds who mostly only have those types of debilitation effects such as Moon Mage.
MOCKERJB1
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/17/2019 09:58 AM CDT
Yeah what they said. There’s almost always some mechanic associated with undead that makes them an inferior hunting choice (spirit attacks, magic resistance, stun immunity, lack of skinning, etc). I know they’re great for some guilds and I’m not asking they get yanked, just that they consider a more traditional addition to Theren too.
The whole list of new critters looks awesome though—always fun to get some new ones.
Hope not ever to see Heaven. I have come to lead you to the
other shore; into eternal darkness; into fire and into ice. —Inferno
The whole list of new critters looks awesome though—always fun to get some new ones.
Hope not ever to see Heaven. I have come to lead you to the
other shore; into eternal darkness; into fire and into ice. —Inferno
LAMBL
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/17/2019 11:00 AM CDT
I see, thanks for clarifying. I guess I just tend to view those things as creature-specific issues rather than applying to undead in general. They could just as easily make an undead creature that doesn't have those quirks, and it's possible that this will be one. I guess we'll find out.
I still agree with other options too though, in particular there's probably going to be a level or two needed to fill the gap between these and sky giants. It's still an exciting and refreshing start though!
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
I still agree with other options too though, in particular there's probably going to be a level or two needed to fill the gap between these and sky giants. It's still an exciting and refreshing start though!
Thanks,
-Biomancer Karthor
EARTHMAGE
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/19/2019 06:26 PM CDT
>AKA: I have no data to back me up, and must fall back on ad hominem to defend my position.
Or I disagree and wasn't going to waste my time arguing, because most of you people just argue for fun, not to communicate.
Or I disagree and wasn't going to waste my time arguing, because most of you people just argue for fun, not to communicate.
DEARMANK
Re: Hunting Area Updates - 1
07/20/2019 05:40 AM CDT
>>Or I disagree and wasn't going to waste my time arguing, because most of you people just argue for fun, not to communicate.
You can disagree if you want to be willfully ignorant of the problem. Did you even look at the list? This doesn't have anything to do with hive-minds, not even sure where that came from. There are clearly a lot more lower level options for multiple brackets than there are at high level. There are about 50 critters in the 0-50 rank range. There are 19 in the 800-1750 range. Can you really not see the difference?
