So if I blow up my arms through sorcerous backlash, I'm left with 4 severe bleeders, and 4 stumps. A stump for each arm and hand, and double the vitality loss due to bleeding from non-existent hands.
I don't feel like anyone would argue with me if I were to say you've got more blood flowing to your legs than to your arms, so why do you bleed out twice as fast from having no arms vs no legs?
Possible solutions:
1. Remove hand wounds entirely if arms are gone, and when your arms go above useless, now you have hands that are at useless.
2. Add feet (with a corresponding armor slot for boots since we're all effectively wearing fishing waders right now)
I feel like the same should go for if your neck goes to a stump, honestly. Though that would obviously involve instant death, just like how you go into shock when your wound/scar level on any critical body part goes to useless.
SQUIRRELYB
TEVESHSZAT
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
07/14/2015 10:55 PM CDT
>>1. Remove hand wounds entirely if arms are gone, and when your arms go above useless, now you have hands that are at useless.
When it comes to certain parts still bleeding when other parts are completely detached, I'd chalk the way injuries work up to the anatomy system in DR being pretty old and possibly nightmarish to rewrite to fix those kinds of things. IMO I could see body parts that connect other body parts get "stump" rewritten as something else (completely shredded? shattered?) before having the injury system start checking to see if you have a neck before keeping head wounds, a head before keeping eye wounds, arms before keeping hand wounds, and maybe a torso before considering limb wounds. And what happens if your whole body explodes? Are you just a head? A torso? What?
>>2. Add feet (with a corresponding armor slot for boots since we're all effectively wearing fishing waders right now)
While "feet" would be cool to add to the anatomy system, I'm guessing that having to introduce all those armor options, rebalance how hindrance works, create potential damage messaging for a whole new body part for various weapon types/magic spells/etc would be a crazy big task.
Those suggestions would be neat, though!
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
When it comes to certain parts still bleeding when other parts are completely detached, I'd chalk the way injuries work up to the anatomy system in DR being pretty old and possibly nightmarish to rewrite to fix those kinds of things. IMO I could see body parts that connect other body parts get "stump" rewritten as something else (completely shredded? shattered?) before having the injury system start checking to see if you have a neck before keeping head wounds, a head before keeping eye wounds, arms before keeping hand wounds, and maybe a torso before considering limb wounds. And what happens if your whole body explodes? Are you just a head? A torso? What?
>>2. Add feet (with a corresponding armor slot for boots since we're all effectively wearing fishing waders right now)
While "feet" would be cool to add to the anatomy system, I'm guessing that having to introduce all those armor options, rebalance how hindrance works, create potential damage messaging for a whole new body part for various weapon types/magic spells/etc would be a crazy big task.
Those suggestions would be neat, though!
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
GAMERGIRL151
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
07/14/2015 11:17 PM CDT
I'm always amused to have a "poisoned right hand" when I have no hands. Wound logic is weird, but I think it's largely one of those "core engine" things that isn't likely to change much.
You have an ugly stump for a right arm, an ugly stump for a left arm, an ugly stump for a right hand, an ugly stump for a left hand.
Bleeding
Area Rate
right arm severe
left arm severe
right hand very bad
left hand very bad
You have a dangerously poisoned right hand.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
You have an ugly stump for a right arm, an ugly stump for a left arm, an ugly stump for a right hand, an ugly stump for a left hand.
Bleeding
Area Rate
right arm severe
left arm severe
right hand very bad
left hand very bad
You have a dangerously poisoned right hand.
Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity.
SQUIRRELYB
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
07/17/2015 11:36 AM CDT
I know this game is really old, but I feel like the response of "oh man it's so old if you touch it it'd break" is the reason so many things are broken on the Internet.
That's neither here nor there, though. If it's too old and Simu is too preoccupied with other things to fix it why not just do what was suggested and change the way wound levels are written, so that no matter what you still appear to have those body parts, they're just shredded. There's still some verbiage that wouldn't make sense, like boxes/law enforcement cutting your hands off, or battle messages, falling into a moongate, etc. Changing the actual text for that would be easier than rewriting code to check for the presence of body parts before allowing them to be injured.
Pouring blood out of a non-existent body part just makes no sense.
I know we'll probably never get feet, so let's just keep it simple. Can we change the way wounds look, and get rid of any "sever" type messages?
NINEVAH1
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
07/17/2015 11:42 AM CDT
>>If it's too old and Simu is too preoccupied with other things to fix it
It's not that it is too old, or they don't want to fix it, but that coding GMs don't have access to the core game engine code where wound code resides.
It's not that it is too old, or they don't want to fix it, but that coding GMs don't have access to the core game engine code where wound code resides.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
07/17/2015 06:27 PM CDT
>>I know this game is really old, but I feel like the response of "oh man it's so old if you touch it it'd break" is the reason so many things are broken on the Internet.
It's not that the code being old that's the problem. It's a few things all forming into a perfect storm of "is this even worth it?"
As mentioned, there's the issue that a lot of "core" code is only editable by on-site staff. AFAIK, it's not like most GMs we come across on the forums can just jump into that code and start fixing things.
There's a few other issues, too.
1) A lot of old code is poorly documented. This doesn't mean it's not able to be edited, but it means there's a notable learning curve to understand what is going on before adjusting it is even a possibility.
2) Old code is connected to so much non-core system stuff. Once again, it can still totally be adjusted, but there's an understandable hesitant to tweak something when you don't know where the ripple effects might end up. For example, if hand wounds can't happen when you're missing arms, suddenly every script that relates to hand injuries may need to properly acknowledge that situation.
3) Old code is also connected to a lot of other core system stuff. Like you said, combat! So now not only do the GMs have to poke into one core system, they have to poke into another core system, that may also have similar documentation issues, etc. And if those systems are also connected to other core systems, even more rewriting has to take place, and then... etc etc etc.
It's entirely possible that a wound system adjustment to do what you're suggesting (which is a reasonable idea!) isn't as big a deal as I'm thinking it may be. But from what I've read in the past certain things like wounds and the combat engine and races and guilds are such deep systems that the RoI just isn't worth it, and it's more reasonable to just deal with the fact that hand wounds give damage over time even when you're missing arms.
But when players bring up stuff that is sometimes brought up in the past, old farts might parrot what GMs have said in the past. See all discussions about adding additional guilds and races as other examples.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
It's not that the code being old that's the problem. It's a few things all forming into a perfect storm of "is this even worth it?"
As mentioned, there's the issue that a lot of "core" code is only editable by on-site staff. AFAIK, it's not like most GMs we come across on the forums can just jump into that code and start fixing things.
There's a few other issues, too.
1) A lot of old code is poorly documented. This doesn't mean it's not able to be edited, but it means there's a notable learning curve to understand what is going on before adjusting it is even a possibility.
2) Old code is connected to so much non-core system stuff. Once again, it can still totally be adjusted, but there's an understandable hesitant to tweak something when you don't know where the ripple effects might end up. For example, if hand wounds can't happen when you're missing arms, suddenly every script that relates to hand injuries may need to properly acknowledge that situation.
3) Old code is also connected to a lot of other core system stuff. Like you said, combat! So now not only do the GMs have to poke into one core system, they have to poke into another core system, that may also have similar documentation issues, etc. And if those systems are also connected to other core systems, even more rewriting has to take place, and then... etc etc etc.
It's entirely possible that a wound system adjustment to do what you're suggesting (which is a reasonable idea!) isn't as big a deal as I'm thinking it may be. But from what I've read in the past certain things like wounds and the combat engine and races and guilds are such deep systems that the RoI just isn't worth it, and it's more reasonable to just deal with the fact that hand wounds give damage over time even when you're missing arms.
But when players bring up stuff that is sometimes brought up in the past, old farts might parrot what GMs have said in the past. See all discussions about adding additional guilds and races as other examples.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
DRFREAK3
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
07/28/2015 01:01 AM CDT
I understand and agree with everything said here.
I am assuming this all comes down to how First Aid skill is written. Body parts/bleeding is probably written in with it. We know it is outdated.
I am assuming this all comes down to how First Aid skill is written. Body parts/bleeding is probably written in with it. We know it is outdated.
SYRAKEN
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
12/28/2015 11:20 AM CST
Just as magic was re-written, SO TOO SHALL FIRST AID HAVE ITS DAY!
DR-ANNWYL
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
12/28/2015 11:33 AM CST
Please don't reply to 6 month old threads.
Annwyl
Message Board Supervisor
If you've questions or comments, take it to e-mail by writing me at DR-Annwyl@play.net.
ALLIZAR2012
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 12:42 PM CDT
I don't understand why replying to a thread needs moderator intervention, 6 months or not. Am I missing something? Should I be afraid to post on these message boards? Is there some undocumented time limit I should be aware of?
NITUKI
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 12:43 PM CDT
> I don't understand why replying to a thread needs moderator intervention, 6 months or not. Am I missing something?
The issue is you create posts out of no where, much like yours. Where someone then has to go check other posts to just have a concept of what is going on. If you really want to post something and it has been a long period of time, you can start a new post (and even reference the old post with a link) so that information is neatly gathered and part of a conversation other than seeming like a tourettes episode.
The issue is you create posts out of no where, much like yours. Where someone then has to go check other posts to just have a concept of what is going on. If you really want to post something and it has been a long period of time, you can start a new post (and even reference the old post with a link) so that information is neatly gathered and part of a conversation other than seeming like a tourettes episode.
ALLIZAR2012
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 12:51 PM CDT
If that is a such a large problem than why not implement a mechanical solution? Threads could automatically close after whatever symbolic time restraint is apparently in place. At least it would not require a moderator lecturing someone who I feel did nothing wrong.
FAMEBRIGHT
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 01:41 PM CDT
Our forums are mechanical legacies that are an intuitive and easy to navigate nightmare for all of us to interact with.
Re: Life mana Spell preps
You raise your hands in the air. You wave them like you just don't care. Somebody says, "Hey!" Somebody says, "Ho!" Somebody screams.
Re: Life mana Spell preps
You raise your hands in the air. You wave them like you just don't care. Somebody says, "Hey!" Somebody says, "Ho!" Somebody screams.
ALLIZAR2012
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 02:02 PM CDT
Maybe this is a problem between legacy view and threaded view, In threaded view I just see this topic as the top thread so it's very easy to reply thinking it is active. Either way I think if there is a problem with responding to threads I think there should be a clearly defined rule or a mechanical limit in place.
FLINT-TIPPED
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 02:52 PM CDT
>I don't understand why replying to a thread needs moderator intervention, 6 months or not. Am I missing something? Should I be afraid to post on these message boards? Is there some undocumented time limit I should be aware of?
Thread necromancy is frowned upon almost universally on internet forums. Not just these. This isn't a new development to the internet.
Vote:
http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-DragonRealms.html
Thread necromancy is frowned upon almost universally on internet forums. Not just these. This isn't a new development to the internet.
Vote:
http://www.topmudsites.com/vote-DragonRealms.html
ALLIZAR2012
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:04 PM CDT
Yes a comment from other board members after someone replies to an irrelevant thread that is buried 6 pages and 8 years ago is what I would consider bringing a dead threat back to life back. Posting a few months late on a relevant topic in a forum subsection that has 2014 posts 2 below it by a moderator against a paying subscriber is confusing. Where is the rule or guidelines that will let me prevent making this "mistake"?
NITUKI
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:08 PM CDT
> Where is the rule or guidelines that will let me prevent making this "mistake"?
Somewhere next to common sense. If you post something that adds nothing to a conversation that started 6 months ago, you really shouldn't be surprised someone ask for it to not happen. The context you also don't know is that poster went through and randomly commented in many different threads/forums adding little and just bumping various threads for "fun". And that gets at the heart of the issue, when you perform thread necromancy you often miss out on the temporal context the post was made in. After months you should just create a new topic.
Also you seem to be worried about getting in trouble, it takes a lot to get a forum ban or even harsh words from a MOD. You are trying to turn a simple etiquette request into an accusation and warning, which it wasn't.
Somewhere next to common sense. If you post something that adds nothing to a conversation that started 6 months ago, you really shouldn't be surprised someone ask for it to not happen. The context you also don't know is that poster went through and randomly commented in many different threads/forums adding little and just bumping various threads for "fun". And that gets at the heart of the issue, when you perform thread necromancy you often miss out on the temporal context the post was made in. After months you should just create a new topic.
Also you seem to be worried about getting in trouble, it takes a lot to get a forum ban or even harsh words from a MOD. You are trying to turn a simple etiquette request into an accusation and warning, which it wasn't.
ALLIZAR2012
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:36 PM CDT
Common sense is a very broad term and very much opinionated and biased. If I'm just showing support for a still relevant topic how long do I have? If I have new information and something I feel is very important but the thread is 4 months old why would I disconnect my information from what is already available? Why not just delete anything older than a month?
I passed up 2 threads I was genuinely curious about (QOL for climbing especially) because I don't understand the apparent common sense rules which are not listed in the Posting Policy link above. One post is over a month old and I'm hesitant to share my experiences and support when every other post seems to be a moderator scolding someone over something that seems minor or similar to a post I would unknowingly do myself.
I passed up 2 threads I was genuinely curious about (QOL for climbing especially) because I don't understand the apparent common sense rules which are not listed in the Posting Policy link above. One post is over a month old and I'm hesitant to share my experiences and support when every other post seems to be a moderator scolding someone over something that seems minor or similar to a post I would unknowingly do myself.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:39 PM CDT
>>If I'm just showing support for a still relevant topic how long do I have?
If you read about something that is more than two or three months old, see that it isn't resolved yet, and feel you want to contribute or re-raise the issue, it wouldn't hurt to just start a new thread about it.
That way people aren't trying to find the context of what you're responding too and everyone is back on the same page about what the thread is about as a whole.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
If you read about something that is more than two or three months old, see that it isn't resolved yet, and feel you want to contribute or re-raise the issue, it wouldn't hurt to just start a new thread about it.
That way people aren't trying to find the context of what you're responding too and everyone is back on the same page about what the thread is about as a whole.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
GNIKOLEYCHUK
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:41 PM CDT
>>> One post is over a month old and I'm hesitant to share my experiences and support when every other post seems to be a moderator scolding someone over something that seems minor
There is no hard and fast rule, nut I have generally drawn the line at two weeks for a busy thread. Under some circumstances, such as if someone asked a question that was never answered and feel inclined to do so, you could extend that limit a bit. Six months is definitely long enough to let the thread die in peace.
There is no hard and fast rule, nut I have generally drawn the line at two weeks for a busy thread. Under some circumstances, such as if someone asked a question that was never answered and feel inclined to do so, you could extend that limit a bit. Six months is definitely long enough to let the thread die in peace.
NITUKI
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:43 PM CDT
And as I mentioned before you are always welcome to post a link back to the original thread for context.
ALLIZAR2012
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:44 PM CDT
Maybe that's what I'm not understanding? Why would it be hard to find a reference to a post in the same thread? Is this because of different forum settings? I'm in threaded view and I can easily connect everything, however if I made a new post (which is frowned upon on most forums) it would disconnect my information from the other posts.
TEVESHSZAT
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 03:50 PM CDT
>>Maybe that's what I'm not understanding? Why would it be hard to find a reference to a post in the same thread? Is this because of different forum settings? I'm in threaded view and I can easily connect everything, however if I made a new post (which is frowned upon on most forums) it would disconnect my information from the other posts.
These forums are horrific for trying to follow a discussion that ended with a few other discussions taking place in the meantime.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
These forums are horrific for trying to follow a discussion that ended with a few other discussions taking place in the meantime.
Uzmam! The Chairman will NOT be pleased to know you're trying to build outside of approved zones. I'd hate for you to be charged the taxes needed to have this place re-zoned. Head for the manor if you're feeling creative.
KROONERMANREVENGE
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 06:04 PM CDT
Ali-whatever is using threaded view.
Most/all of the forums users use legacy. Legacy does not thread. It simply lists every post by date-stamp, in the folder. Once you have 'read' a post, it's removed from your view, and you have to jump through some hoops to see it again.
Try swapping to legacy for a few days and you should understand.
I'm a badger, I be badgerin'
Most/all of the forums users use legacy. Legacy does not thread. It simply lists every post by date-stamp, in the folder. Once you have 'read' a post, it's removed from your view, and you have to jump through some hoops to see it again.
Try swapping to legacy for a few days and you should understand.
I'm a badger, I be badgerin'
GABRIEL4
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms?
04/17/2016 06:43 PM CDT
<<Most/all of the forums users use legacy.
+1 for making Threaded View the default view instead of Legacy View. It would go a long way to making the forums at least seem to have some modernness to them.
+1 for making Threaded View the default view instead of Legacy View. It would go a long way to making the forums at least seem to have some modernness to them.
DR-ANNWYL
Re: How are my hands bleeding when I have no arms? ::Thread Over::
04/17/2016 06:49 PM CDT
Don't make me have to pull posts for off topic.
There's an appropriate folder to discuss the boards, this is not it.
Annwyl
Message Board Supervisor
If you've questions or comments, take it to e-mail by writing me at DR-Annwyl@play.net.
DR-ANNWYL
::Post Hidden::
04/19/2016 11:49 AM CDT
A post was removed.
Please don't continue to post to a closed discussion.
Annwyl
Message Board Supervisor
If you've questions or comments, take it to e-mail by writing me at DR-Annwyl@play.net.
